If I recall correctly, even when the type II fibers are recycled/salvaged to become sort of type I fibers (though perhaps not identical to young type I), you still end up with overall fewer motor neurons. The remaining neurons end up driving somewhat larger type I fibers, so maybe that somewhat offsets declines in hypertrophy. But this transition is not without consequences: explosiveness and ability to generate power decrease, and fast contractions become slower. The ability to execute fine control over movement also decreases.
Physical inactivity and disuse accelerate the process, but sadly, it can happen even to people who continue to strength train.
One guy who is often cited as an example of how to age well is Clarence Bass. But if you read his blog, you see he is having issues. He writes specifically about struggling to maintain the strength of his quads, and you can see this in photographs. He says he reached his peak physical condition in his mid 40ās. At that point, he was 165 lbs in lean condition. Today, in his mid 80ās, he is 140 lbs at similar % body fat. So 25 lbs less muscle, despite training regularly.
for sure, sarcopenia happens to all, so many alterations in hormones, satellite cells, mTOR, etc. That doesnāt mean a loss of T2 fibers though, just atrophy in general of the fibers.
Doing the math if you had 16" arms at fifty and lose 1% a year you would end up at 13.28 at 67 if bodyfat is the same. Thatās scary. Thank the Lord for sledgehammers and weights.
But that is of course inevitable, at some point you are just struggling to maintain what you can. Still, I donāt think anybody could deny that Clarence is an exemplar of how to play the long game with regard to health and fitness, especially within the realm of sound weight training and cardiovascular conditioning as well as diet. No bro science, no magic bullets, he has always known, and always touted, that its about consistency, hard work, and discipline.
Iāve always enjoyed his writings because he has shown what has worked and what hasnāt through direct experience. He is interested in the research, and has posted quite a few good studies and articles his website, but with no agendas. He always has been interested in just the facts, so I have much respect for him. Regarding his approach to training, while he has never been a big advocate of training to failure, his philosophy has been centered around hard, brief, infrequent training with predominately the basics.
When it comes to training and aging, others that I think get it right are Dr. Darden of course, Richard Winnett, and Bradley Steiner.
Adaptation, as it relates to building muscle, is a lot more complex than most people realize. It involves all body systems and, in my opinion, is less critical than stimulating and supporting protein synthesis and growth signaling.
We can easily stimulate and fuel protein synthesis and signaling, increasing muscle mass, using the same weight and exercises over many weeks. Adaptation to mechanical work, in this case, is insignificant.
In the 1980s, Ray Mentzer and I would discuss becoming āimmuneā to exercises by trying to stay ahead of adaptation. And everyone will eventually get plateaued if all they consider is mechanical overload.
If getting your body to build more muscle is your goal, you need to focus on stimulating biomechanical and biochemical protein synthesis and growth signaling. Those who know how to do that will easily avoid adaptation pitfalls.
Regarding volume, muscle tissue recovers rapidly, whereas the nervous system recovers remarkably slower. You have to stimulate maximum growth with the least amount of CNS fatigue. Itās a balancing process involving science and creative skill.
Perhaps you are right that it is just general atrophy. However, Iāve recently happened to read a number of papers on sarcopenia, and a lot of them mention that declines in the nervous system are key factor.
Thatās interesting, the key thing to me would be what causes a loss in the neural systems. Is it from very long term disuse maybe? The FT fibers are āusuallyā in the larger MUās, and those require very high effort, and usually older people never use high effort, I wonder if they just deteriorate over the long term from just not firing those MUās.
been lurking here, but your comments inspired me to sign up {again}
As ill hit 60 next year, iām interested in staying in the game as long as possibleā¦ so please Hi-Jack the post [blame me- lol} Or start a new one [please}
Longevity is a cornerstone element in everything we write. Ellington and I develop programs that promote insulin sensitivity, maximize growth signaling and protein synthesis, and preserve CNS. We instruct lifters to feel the muscles contracting and un-contracting on every rep and only change resistance when itās too heavy or too light. (We now know going to failure hinders building muscle, and most often, you donāt need to increase resistance or reps to gain muscle.)
Everyone will get older, and performance will eventually decline, but all ages should be training with the same methods. No one should ever lift like a 20-year-old, including 20-year-olds. Young lifters are usually reckless and do dangerous things in the quest to build muscle. They get nothing for it but injuries that last a lifetime.
Lifters should train to one day be super-strong and healthy 80-year-olds. Living your training life with that overarching mindset will deliver your very best gains in your 20s, 30s, 40s, and beyond.
Keep reading and asking questions until you own these concepts and see the gains youāve always wanted.
Thanks for responding Timā¦ Overall I feel as good as I was 20 to 30 years ago , thanks to abbreviated training methods . I know I aināt gonna live for ever , but I refuse the so called enevitable decline. ā¦. I aināt going out quietly
This is something that has become more and more apparent to me as time goes on. It also defines the difference between bodybuilding and powerlifter/weight lifting.
āLongevity is a cornerstone element in everything we write. Ellington and I develop programs that promote insulin sensitivity, maximize growth signaling and protein synthesis, and preserve CNS. We instruct lifters to feel the muscles contracting and un-contracting on every rep and only change resistance when itās too heavy or too lightā. Agree 100%. Mind- Muscle connection is real. Strict form, pure concentration on breathing and muscle worked with nothing else entering your mind, not number of reps, not anything will make just about any weight intense.
Sounds interesting. Extremely sore lats and chest from a highly focused workout yesterday. Supposed to be hoeing a garden with the worldās biggest hoe. Buy a lighter one? Winter is much easier.
In the 1980s, Ray Mentzer and I would discuss becoming āimmuneā to exercises by trying to stay ahead of adaptation.
Hi Tim, thank you for your fascinating comments in this thread. Could you please expand upon the above discussions with Ray Mentzer , i.e., what the two of you were thinking and the implications it may have for how we train? Thank you!
Those discussions were all focused on creating the maximum stimulatory effect in the muscle. We found layering techniques worked the best.
Our new Surge Challenge program layers multiple techniques over three phases. Every workout includes a pump phase, a work phase, and a flutter phase for each body part.