In what way does ‘reason’ mandate splitting up a family by deporting someone who was by all accounts a productive, law-abiding (albeit undocumented) citizen who had been here 20+ years?
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Break laws.
Get caught.
Face consequences.
Nation of laws. Not of feelz. Don’t like the laws change them.
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While I agree with this 99.99%, I don’t think there has ever been a time in American history where this is how it’s actually worked.
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That’s exactly how it works. It’s the “get caught” part that’s key. The government has tens of thousands of laws and can only enforce so many.
There’s an entire steroid section on this very board where people are logging their experience with class 3 scheduled drugs. Likely without shielding their IP’s. Should be easy pickins for the DEA, but they likely have bigger fish to fry.
Tell that to -Insert F500 exec that paid a fine instead of jailtime here- or -Insert celebrity with 10x cocaine possessions and 10 stints in rehab-.
Not saying getting caught isn’t the govt’s biggest problem, but when it comes to the public viewpoint, it’s definitely not anywhere near the only problem.
The same reason that puts a murderer in prison after she assumed a new identity, got married, became a productive, law-abiding, citizen, had children, and then was caught 30 years after the crime of blowing up a college building to protest the Vietnam War. (This is a true case, BTW.)
So tempting to let her go, eh? But hard cases make bad law because people twist the law into something it is not. Making exceptions to enforcement because of “feelings” is bad policy. She broke the law and needed to go to prison.
I agree that it’s disgusting immigration law hasn’t been properly enforced for 20 years, but that doesn’t make it OK to not enforce the law. You have to start sometime.
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They needed to arrest the idiots for interference of a federal officer and attempting to free a prisoner. Putting 10 of them in prison for 10 years each would have a chilling effect on stupid protestors.
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Sounds very much like a police state.
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Caning would be an alternative.
Protestor would be productive in a week or so.
‘Enforce the law because it’s the law’ is a principle-based argument, not a reason-based one. Further, and as pointed out by @pfury above, it has never been the modus operandi of law enforcement in the US. In America, LEOs and the courts have been given wide latitude when it comes to enforcing and prosecuting the law, including immigration laws.
To suddenly insist that certain laws be rigidly enforced ‘just because’ is not a reason-based position. Indeed, it sounds like it’s based more on ‘the feelz’ than anything else.
The laws went unenforced because the people that owned the politicians didn’t want them inforced.
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Remember how I said you don’t believe in the concept of nations in the taxation is theft thread?
Protection of property rights which illegals are violating is one of the fundamentals of a nation
So arrest and prosecution are not consequences? Only if there’s a conviction. Seems like money and the criminal justice system could be its own thread.
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To clarify, I am not in favor of sanctuary cities. They are a form of nullification, although it’s somewhat tricky because the feds cannot compel a state agent to enforce federal laws.
But I don’t support the idea. My suggestion is a new legislative fix, a new law, not gamesmanship (like sanctuary cities) under existing law.
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Can you expound on how?
I thought the issue was, from your statement above, of compulsion not being allowed.
No doubt we need immigration reform.
Agree. I want to be a nation of just laws that make sense. Not a nation that has laws we don’t respect or don’t enforce.
Let’s prosecute felons, regardless of their immigration status or ethnic group, but Raj, no way would I support mass deportations. It would split the GOP in two. No way would deporting the parents of citizen children fly. I’m in a border state here, but you’d have to live under a rock to NOT have people you associate with who come from families who entered the US without documents.
The states differ dramatically on how much they enforce the laws, or mandate use of the DHS E-verify system. Arizona enforces E-verify, and they passed some really tough on immigration laws in 2007. You can see some of the trends in illegal immigration here.
Departed
Graph from Pew Research Center, WSJ
The Legal Arizona Workers Act, as amended, prohibits businesses from knowingly or intentionally hiring an “unauthorized alien” after December 31, 2007…This state law allows a County Attorney to bring a civil suit to suspend or revoke business licenses if a business intentionally or knowingly hired an “unauthorized alien” worker after December 31, 2007.
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Incarceration costs for illegal immigrants? Countries who will not accept their own felons? What do we do with those people?
I’m certain you’ve seen the footage of the undocumented AZ mom being deported, with the crowd of protesters surrounding the van. She’s been in the US over 20 years, and has two kids who are citizens by birth. As I understand it, the reason she’s finally being deported (she’s been checking in with ICE for years) is that she’s a felon. Her felony? Per the news reports I’ve heard, she used a fake SS number on a job application. She did not impersonate someone else by using that person’s actual number; rather, her number was simply a string of random digits, so as not to leave that portion of the job application blank.
My point: Even though ‘let’s deport the felons’ sounds reasonable, the fact is, not all felonies are created equal.
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I think that this deportation stunt is a shit test. Like, “Lets do it and see how it goes over.”.
Similar to the widely publicized shooting of a child during a covert operation.
Both have been happening in part and parcel, but these are two fundamental timbers of Trumps platform- Go hard on terrorism- kill their families, and Go hard on immigration- deport them no matter what.
Its the current admin. testing policy in action to see how it goes over with the public.
What I mentioned earlier - a path to citizenship for illegal immigrants. Everyone is eligible as of a certain effective date, but carve out felons, etc.