Thanks KSman, I appreciate the help.
I do have 1% androGel, but it clearly states DO NOT APPLY TO GENITALS.
Would a 1/2 pump be considered a small amount? BTW What do you mean by [clipped] scrotum?
What do you think of a Mon, Wed, Fri schedule? My wife and I like to get away for the weekend and it would be nice not having to bring along all my meds. Would those 2 days be too long of a break?
clipped = need to remove some hair
T-gel would sting, creams do not.
Many do 3 doses a week when injecting. Injections are a time release system. Transdermals really need to be applied every day as FT spikes with application and falls rapidly after that. You may not be able to achieve decent serum levels with 3 applications per week. I transdermals are to bothersome, you might be better off injecting. Some have switched for that reason.
Not applying to genitalsā¦ the FDA is weird about some things. Women apply hormones to their genitals all of the timesā¦ but not alcohol based! I have two male HRT books that recommend T cream application to the penis. One does need to be aware of the transfer potential during sex. Getting blowed is not going to happen - tastes bad.
Application to the scrotum has the benefit of very good absorption and a good amount of DHT generation. DHT is essential for libido. DHT does not cause prostate problems, but less DHT can reduce prostate size when the prostate is enlarged. It appears that estrogen is responsible for a lot of prostate problems, not T or DHT.
Thanks for the heads up, I think I will pass on the cream to the genitals. I do enjoy my blow jobs LOL.
As far as scheduling I was referring to injecting. I know injecting test 3x week would work do to long half life, but is 2 days too long to go without HCG and Adex. Could I run a larger dose on Friday to get through the weekend?
I did order some HMG in case I need it for fertility reasons. Do you know what kind of dosage I would run?
You may not need hMG and can always use when making babiesā¦ get a sperm count done.
That would be ok for injections. hCG is a maintenance thing, should not affect your sense of well-being. So you can skip days and add a little more.
Adex: Use a little more before and after.
Cannot advice hMG dose. You may find dosing on WWW but that may be for fertility treatments or when things are bad. I do not know what you would find for maintenance dosing. Anabolicminds would probably be your best bet. A few guys there were using it.
I will have all my meds on Thurs and Im going to start on Mon.
10 wk. Supply:
Test C 200 - 100mg wk
Arimidex - 1 mg wk
HCG - 250IU Eod
What do you guys think about adding some Test Prop in the beginning for a quick jump start. I have a vial of prop and was thinking about doing:
25mgs Test Prop: Mon
25mgs Test Prop: Wed
50mgs Test Cyp: Fri
Anyone try this? How long should I run the Test P before switching to just (2) pins of Test C wk.
JS, I donāt know if you are a gear user. There can be an issue of getting used to larger doses then not feeling as good on the regular dose. I would not go beyond a one week front load. Remember that you will also be front loading Tā>E production. Your body should react strongly to the 100mg/wk.
No, Iām not a gear user. I will still be running 100mg a week either way. My thought was since the Prop is a shorter ester it would get my levels up faster, then I could taper to the Test C. Would the 3rd cycle option be better?
Difference is:
Mon: 25mg Prop vs. 33mg Cyp or 33mg Prop
Wed: 25mg Prop vs. 33mg Cyp or 33mg Prop
Fri: 50mg Cyp vs. 33mg Cyp or 33mg Cyp
I do have Androgel. Could I use that instead of Test Prop to front load. I know that Test Cyp is a long ester and may take a while to get my T levels up. Im just looking for a good way to get my levels up faster and then maintain.
Iād suggest sticking with just the 100mg cyp per week for two reasons. One, Iāve never noticed a long delay in blood level increases and if you inject IM there should be a rather fast increase. I think I noticed a positive affect with in 24 hours after my first injection. I would also break the injections down to every 3.5 days or EOD. IĆĀ¢??ve been doing every 3.5 days.
Keeping things uniform (i.e. not front loading) will allow you to better evaluate 6 week blood work results. If you are expecting this to be a long term treatment schedule then itās best to patient since it will likely take several rounds of blood tests to determine just how much AI you need to keep your E2 levels at 22. I started with .25 mg (anastrozole liquid) EOD then .375 then .5 (Arimidex) and was still high. After my last blood work I said fuck it and when to 1 mg EOD.
I have been taking that does since Jan 26 and have not felt any symptoms associated with low E2 yet but time and blood work will tell the story. Each time I increased the dose I thought I was feeling possible low E2 levels but lab work said otherwise so I am still unfamiliar with what low E2 will feel like. I would not expect to get it all right on with the first try. My free and total test have been fine and my nuts returned after starting HCG but E2 levels have been what most of us have had to adjust over time.
It is not easy to be patient and wait every 6 weeks for blood work but since I have been experiencing a dramatic improvement to my overall energy levels the proper E2 levels are just the refinement.
JC: I would not worry about the differences in esters. With frequent and overlapping injections, levels will even out soon enough.
So is anyone bumping doses up to say 200 per week ?
I know one guy who needs 300/week and some others around 200, just to get high normal levels. These guys have processes in there bodies that eat T or eat the T esters. Some genetic variations or conditions of the kidneys can lead to spilling of some body chemicals by the kidneys. That can lower steroids, which does include vit-D25 hormone and some other things. I know one guy who needs vast amounts of vit-D to get proper vit-D serum lab numbers.
The 100mg/week dose seems to be a magic number and many docs will not go higher. And some will have good TT numbers and lower FT numbers and docs only see the TT and SHBG bound T and will not go higher. Some docs look at the FT number and will increase the dose if needed to get high normal youthful [non age adjusted] FT numbers. Some docs do not even test TT, only FT or bio-T.
If you are lusting for more T, you would be better off first optimizing your T levels to optimize your FT response and TRT benefits. If E is not well managed, you could double your T and feel like crap. This conversation can easily then drift into discussions of neural transmitters that become limiting factors for some guys, typically the older guys.
And yes, some guys abuse T just because they can. A few doctors seem to be very liberal, suspiciously so.
Thank you, your posts are very informative.
I would assume everyone would want higher then average t levels.
Although i have never had normal t levels if i felt them that might infact be sufficient to me and my goals.
Interesting how alot of drās seem to have no idea and i have experienced this. Dr i visited for ED only tested TT. I went to another dr and asked for a test of all my estrogren hormones as i have gyno and trouble losing fat and he said that has nothing to do with fat we will check your thyroid.
I eventually got the tests done and you can see the numbers in the thread i created.
Its just a shame these people who are supposed to be in charge of our health seem to have no idea what they are doing.
[quote]KSman wrote:
I know one guy who needs 300/week and some others around 200, just to get high normal levels. These guys have processes in there bodies that eat T or eat the T esters. Some genetic variations or conditions of the kidneys can lead to spilling of some body chemicals by the kidneys. That can lower steroids, which does include vit-D25 hormone and some other things. I know one guy who needs vast amounts of vit-D to get proper vit-D serum lab numbers.
The 100mg/week dose seems to be a magic number and many docs will not go higher. And some will have good TT numbers and lower FT numbers and docs only see the TT and SHBG bound T and will not go higher. Some docs look at the FT number and will increase the dose if needed to get high normal youthful [non age adjusted] FT numbers. Some docs do not even test TT, only FT or bio-T.
If you are lusting for more T, you would be better off first optimizing your T levels to optimize your FT response and TRT benefits. If E is not well managed, you could double your T and feel like crap. This conversation can easily then drift into discussions of neural transmitters that become limiting factors for some guys, typically the older guys.
And yes, some guys abuse T just because they can. A few doctors seem to be very liberal, suspiciously so. [/quote]
That is where I am at. 300mg per week. I started to not āfeelā that so I waited a week, did blood work and just did the full does instead of 1/2 twice weekly. I feel a lot better already.
I am working thru the bloodwork to find out if this dose is justifiable or not.
one thing I need help with is this insanity regarding bloodwork. GP refused, clinic is not responsive when I pulled two so I could also test cortisol etc, they did not call back in time.
I just want to be in control, how can I use labcorp every month DIRECTLY ?
Thanks
Oh the high test is probably because I am eating up Test from so much stress. I worked 20 hours straight yesterday and wednesday I will pull an all-niter taking a hospitals systems down and scrambling to upgrade them before sunup. Billing 60 hours per week to the client. I know that if I just had a laid back life everything would probably normalize and improve but that is not going to happen anytime soon.
[quote]HiredGun wrote:
I just want to be in control, how can I use labcorp every month DIRECTLY ?
[/quote]
Hey guys, I was wondering when I could expect results in terms of lean body mass.
I have been on TRT with 100mg per week for 2 weeks now, and I know it wonāt be overnight, but in general when should I start noticing an increase in lean body mass and a decrease in body fat?
That will not happen by itself. Your mood, libido and energy levels may change all by themselves with TRT but it will not magically transform you. For many, diet and exercise just does not help if the free T and E2 are off. Getting you free test up and your E2 right will give you the missing part of what you need to get into shape. You still have to let the diet and exercise do there thing.
The physical affects of normal to high free T are one thing but the mental improvements typically motivates many to get off the couch and junk food. ItĆ¢??s my opinion that if you are willing to deal with all of the details of TRT you are probably willing to watch your diet and exercise and should have the mood and energy to do it.
LabCorp via LEF.org is affordable if you join up. You canāt get your insurance to pay, but if you have an HSA with a debit cardā¦
Some will loose fat doing nothing else if they are the type that got flabby as they lost muscle mass with no weight change. They can loose fat and gain muscle with little weight change and no change in activity levels. I do not exercise and my waist went from 34"ā>31". I am much stronger. It is really hard to generalize when the reader is not a statistic, but has his own metabolic destiny and eating habits.
[quote]KSman wrote:
LabCorp via LEF.org is affordable if you join up. You canāt get your insurance to pay, but if you have an HSA with a debit cardā¦
I do not exercise and my waist went from 34"ā>31". I am much stronger. [/quote]
Thanks for the tip. Are you serious about not lifting in general or when you started you lost waste inches from therapy alone but workout most of the time ?
I have been sick for a week and have another all-niter tomorrow so it seems this week is not a good week to hit it hard, just going to do light workouts and cardio as I do not want to overstress my body from too many angles as I have UC which like a wildfire can burn off 60 lbs of body mass in no time flat.
Just a question HiredGun, you mentioned that you have UC? What are you refering to.
[quote]HiredGun wrote:
[quote]KSman wrote:
I do not exercise and my waist went from 34"ā>31". I am much stronger. [/quote]
Are you serious about not lifting in general or when you started you lost waste inches from therapy alone but workout most of the time ?
[/quote]
Yes, I lost fat and gained muscle without working out, just my normal level of activity. I seem to have shifted to a build of where I was when I was 28YO, only stronger. I am 61YO next month. I did attempt lifting but I do not do that now. I lost fat with T, then T+hCG. When I reduced E2=37ā>22, I lost more fat, from the resistant loss areas.