Trayvon Martin Pt. 3.. The Legacy Pt. 2

Off Topic
181

[quote]Waittz wrote:
This was on O’Riley last night. Say whatever you want about him and Foxnews but the statistic of 73% of new black children born out of wedlock and what he says about where the blame lies on how to correct it is very spot on. Maybe the best comentary I have heard on this topic in a while.

[/quote]

I never watch his show and I usually disagree with him but his talking points were right on last night. Ever since Jon Stewart took his break from the Daily show, I’d tune in every now and then to O’Reilly. I caught this last night and thought it was great.

This is coming from a guy who worked on the Obama campaign in 2008 and supported him 2012. I now regret I had any part in helping his campaign and no longer consider myself a democrat.

182

I could be way off base here, but it seems to me that the white community has marginalized and demonized the “white trash” community. The black community seems to want to emulate their low socioeconomic counterparts instead of shunning them. It’s as if they feel this is the way they are “supposed” to act and then say it’s just their culture and no one else can possibly understand. I would love to wear sweatpants and cutoff shirts everywhere I go, but I realize that sometimes you have to do things you don’t want to if you want to succeed.

Have a little class, speak proper English, and dress respectfully. Keys to making an honest living in the USA.

183

[quote]sam_sneed wrote:

[quote]Waittz wrote:
This was on O’Riley last night. Say whatever you want about him and Foxnews but the statistic of 73% of new black children born out of wedlock and what he says about where the blame lies on how to correct it is very spot on. Maybe the best comentary I have heard on this topic in a while.

[/quote]

I never watch his show and I usually disagree with him but his talking points were right on last night. Ever since Jon Stewart took his break from the Daily show, I’d tune in every now and then to O’Reilly. I caught this last night and thought it was great.

This is coming from a guy who worked on the Obama campaign in 2008 and supported him 2012. I now regret I had any part in helping his campaign and no longer consider myself a democrat.[/quote]

Not to hijack this thread, but I’ve got to ask … What turned you off in the end?

I get being disappointed / disillusioned during his first term, but to go from campaign worker in '08 to still supporting him just 8 months ago … And now having regret?

He seems to have been consistently pretty awful to me … What was the final straw for you?

184

[quote]Stiglitz wrote:

[quote]sam_sneed wrote:

This is coming from a guy who worked on the Obama campaign in 2008 and supported him 2012. I now regret I had any part in helping his campaign and no longer consider myself a democrat.[/quote]

Not to hijack this thread, but I’ve got to ask … What turned you off in the end?

I get being disappointed / disillusioned during his first term, but to go from campaign worker in '08 to still supporting him just 8 months ago … And now having regret?

He seems to have been consistently pretty awful to me … What was the final straw for you? [/quote]

I’m not Sam, but I’m also a reformed liberal, and Bam sealed the deal for me as well.

I can tell you why, in my case it happened.

  1. I hated Bush43 with a passion, still do strongly dislike him, but don’t hate.
  2. I ate up “Hope and Change” like a fat kid on cake. I honestly believed Bam was going to be different. Boy was I wrong…

NO individual mandate he said
Bring back habeas corpus he said
No bankers and lobbyists in his cabinet he said
Everything he signed online for 7 days before hand he said
most transparent administration he said
no more red states and blue states, just united states he said
close Gitmo he said
End the wars he said

Bam lost me sometime in 2010-2011, but the thing that sealed the deal for me, and made me realize I made the right choice in abandoning Contemporary American Liberalism: “You Didn’t Build That”. Every time I think of that speech all I can remember is sitting next to a client who was crying, he had lost everything. 40 years in business, his entire life, all his money, his home, most likely his family, everything, gone. And our “leader” was telling him “he didn’t build that.” Fucking chump has never worked a day in his life, and he had the balls to tell this man he didn’t build that. Get bend you progressive douchebag.

As much as I was riding this dudes jock in 2008, I was hoping he got fired in 2012. Not that I thought Romney was going to do things any different, but the rational thought is, if my government is going to be run by a clown liar as a totalitarian regime that ignores my rights, I’d rather have the individual mandate repealed and my tax rate go down.

185

[quote]Professor X wrote:
like NOT being called a thug simply because how you dress is a trend usually seen in mostly people of your own race and nothing more.[/quote]

I live in 65% Black Prince George’s county Maryland. I don’t expect to see teen-agers of any race walking around in Brooks Brothers preppy attire or wearing 3 piece suits. I do however have a problem with anyone white, black, asian walking around with their pants pulled down below their ass. Does this make them a Thug? I don’t think so…does this make them asking for trouble? I think so. Is it racial to demand people cover their asses? I don’t think so. I don’t see the majority of white people walking around with their asses hanging out, but I do see some pretty sloppy looking white people. I guess I just assume the white people are homeless.

186

[quote]Stiglitz wrote:

Not to hijack this thread, but I’ve got to ask … What turned you off in the end?

I get being disappointed / disillusioned during his first term, but to go from campaign worker in '08 to still supporting him just 8 months ago … And now having regret?

He seems to have been consistently pretty awful to me … What was the final straw for you? [/quote]

Like Beans, I also did not like GW Bush at all and have always leaned democrat because:

  • I don’t care if gays marry each other.
  • I don’t think abortions should be banned.
  • The war on drugs is retarded and I’d like to see marijuana legalized even though I don’t smoke.
  • I’m not religious and don’t believe religion has any place in government.
  • The patriot act and the loss of civil liberties post 9-11.
  • I hated that we went into Iraq. I supported going into Afghanistan but I wanted the wars to end.
  • I wanted Gitmo closed immediately.
  • I hated the Bush administration’s foreign policy.

So I worked a few days on Obama’s campaign in '08. He got elected, I was happy and over the next 4 years he expanded on infringing on civil liberties and Gitmo is still open. If the Republicans had a better candidate, I would’ve went in that direction even though I’ll never fully be a Republican. Lesser of 2 evils. I couldn’t get behind Romney for several reasons.

Last straw was the payroll tax increase (or expiration of the decrease). O’Bama promised my taxes wouldn’t go up and they did. I don’t care why, I just care that there is less money if my pocket.

If that didn’t do it, Benghazi wouldn’ve been the last straw.

or the Snowden incident.

or his policy and lack of transparency on the use of drones.

I’d like to keep the thread on topic so I don’t really want to debate my reasons. But, since I was asked, there they are.

187

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]Stiglitz wrote:

[quote]sam_sneed wrote:

This is coming from a guy who worked on the Obama campaign in 2008 and supported him 2012. I now regret I had any part in helping his campaign and no longer consider myself a democrat.[/quote]

Not to hijack this thread, but I’ve got to ask … What turned you off in the end?

I get being disappointed / disillusioned during his first term, but to go from campaign worker in '08 to still supporting him just 8 months ago … And now having regret?

He seems to have been consistently pretty awful to me … What was the final straw for you? [/quote]

I’m not Sam, but I’m also a reformed liberal, and Bam sealed the deal for me as well.

I can tell you why, in my case it happened.

  1. I hated Bush43 with a passion, still do strongly dislike him, but don’t hate.
  2. I ate up “Hope and Change” like a fat kid on cake. I honestly believed Bam was going to be different. Boy was I wrong…

NO individual mandate he said
Bring back habeas corpus he said
No bankers and lobbyists in his cabinet he said
Everything he signed online for 7 days before hand he said
most transparent administration he said
no more red states and blue states, just united states he said
close Gitmo he said
End the wars he said

Bam lost me sometime in 2010-2011, but the thing that sealed the deal for me, and made me realize I made the right choice in abandoning Contemporary American Liberalism: “You Didn’t Build That”. Every time I think of that speech all I can remember is sitting next to a client who was crying, he had lost everything. 40 years in business, his entire life, all his money, his home, most likely his family, everything, gone. And our “leader” was telling him “he didn’t build that.” Fucking chump has never worked a day in his life, and he had the balls to tell this man he didn’t build that. Get bend you progressive douchebag.

As much as I was riding this dudes jock in 2008, I was hoping he got fired in 2012. Not that I thought Romney was going to do things any different, but the rational thought is, if my government is going to be run by a clown liar as a totalitarian regime that ignores my rights, I’d rather have the individual mandate repealed and my tax rate go down.

[/quote]

Thanx CB … Enlightening as always

I think that quote turned a lot of folks … That was kind of the beginning of the groundswell / theory that Romney could pull it off

188

[quote]sam_sneed wrote:

[quote]Stiglitz wrote:

Not to hijack this thread, but I’ve got to ask … What turned you off in the end?

I get being disappointed / disillusioned during his first term, but to go from campaign worker in '08 to still supporting him just 8 months ago … And now having regret?

He seems to have been consistently pretty awful to me … What was the final straw for you? [/quote]

Like Beans, I also did not like GW Bush at all and have always leaned democrat because:

  • I don’t care if gays marry each other.
  • I don’t think abortions should be banned.
  • The war on drugs is retarded and I’d like to see marijuana legalized even though I don’t smoke.
  • I’m not religious and don’t believe religion has any place in government.
  • The patriot act and the loss of civil liberties post 9-11.
  • I hated that we went into Iraq. I supported going into Afghanistan but I wanted the wars to end.
  • I wanted Gitmo closed immediately.
  • I hated the Bush administration’s foreign policy.

So I worked a few days on Obama’s campaign in '08. He got elected, I was happy and over the next 4 years he expanded on infringing on civil liberties and Gitmo is still open. If the Republicans had a better candidate, I would’ve went in that direction even though I’ll never fully be a Republican. Lesser of 2 evils. I couldn’t get behind Romney for several reasons.

Last straw was the payroll tax increase (or expiration of the decrease). O’Bama promised my taxes wouldn’t go up and they did. I don’t care why, I just care that there is less money if my pocket.

If that didn’t do it, Benghazi wouldn’ve been the last straw.

or the Snowden incident.

or his policy and lack of transparency on the use of drones.

I’d like to keep the thread on topic so I don’t really want to debate my reasons. But, since I was asked, there they are.[/quote]

All very valid, from pro to anti … Thanks. I was just curious. My family is mostly Democrats, but it is more traditional than true ideology. It always piques my interest when someone goes from very pro (campaigning for a candidate) to hoping he’ll get tossed on his butt

OK gents, back to the sagging pants … What’s up with THAT?

189

[quote]J. Prufrock wrote:

[quote]Quasi-Tech wrote:
http://news.yahoo.com/black-americas-real-problem-isnt-white-racism-070000529.html

Yay, more racist statistics and information. [/quote]

I really just was so shocked and upset while reading through that. I’m not going to take part in the blame game going on in here, but I will say that I just cannot understand how X and some others are still trying to argue that racism is, in large part, a white institution. Really? Fourteen THOUSAND cases of black on white rape and NOT ONE case of white on black rape. It blows my mind. Like SmashingWeights, I believe, said: Does X and crew really think that 14,000 or more white people got away with rape to skew those statistics?
[/quote]
Well we do know that even more white women are raped by white men. We also know that most rapes are done by someone familiar to the victim. We also know that most rapes go unreported. The point? No point, just as the stat of black men raping white women has no point. However, I wonder if the race of the rapist matters to the victim as much as it matters to some posters here.

190

[quote]Jewbacca wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:
I don’t see sagging pants as the social stigma you do…because I understand that culture.
[/quote]

OK, start dressing like a ‘gangsta’ instead of a scrubs and white lab coat or whatever dentist wear and see how your patients react and how you business does.

Sorry, people dress to give the world an impression of who they are, or rather how they want to be seen.[/quote]
Is it OK to dress like a “gangster” however? You know, like Gotti, Luciano, or Capone?

191

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Sagging pants are a big thing in my community. The only people who would see that STYLE AND TREND as criminal would be people who don’t even try to understand the culture.

[/quote]

I don’t see it as criminal, I see it as retarded. How soon until pants are sagging in the front and kids are walking around with their junk hanging out and anyone who criticizes is deemed racist when in fact we just don’t like looking at other people’s junk?

192

[quote]countingbeans wrote:
All in all. I’m pretty sure our great grandkids are going to look back at this and think we were all assholes, to be honest. [/quote]

Didn’t “we” all look at our parents and think they were racist assholes? I know I did.

193

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]Jewbacca wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:
I don’t see sagging pants as the social stigma you do…because I understand that culture.
[/quote]

OK, start dressing like a ‘gangsta’ instead of a scrubs and white lab coat or whatever dentist wear and see how your patients react and how you business does.

Sorry, people dress to give the world an impression of who they are, or rather how they want to be seen.[/quote]
Is it OK to dress like a “gangster” however? You know, like Gotti, Luciano, or Capone? [/quote]

194

[quote]J. Prufrock wrote:

[quote]Quasi-Tech wrote:
http://news.yahoo.com/black-americas-real-problem-isnt-white-racism-070000529.html

Yay, more racist statistics and information. [/quote]

I really just was so shocked and upset while reading through that. I’m not going to take part in the blame game going on in here, but I will say that I just cannot understand how X and some others are still trying to argue that racism is, in large part, a white institution. Really? Fourteen THOUSAND cases of black on white rape and NOT ONE case of white on black rape. It blows my mind. Like SmashingWeights, I believe, said: Does X and crew really think that 14,000 or more white people got away with rape to skew those statistics?
[/quote]

I’d be careful quoting Pat Buchanon or trusting him to be accurate.

He may be right here, but he’s not adverse to making crap up out of whole cloth.

195

[quote]Professor X wrote:
so why should they pull their pants up because YOU don’t accept it?[/quote]

Common sense?

I do things all the time to avoid THEM not “accepting” me…when I enter a building with security, I take off my sunglasses…some people don’t…they get patted down or inspected while I get waved through…go to a jewelry store I keep my hands out of my pockets…I get shown stuff by the employees rather than watched by security…

When I was younger I had a dangling hoop ear ring, wore a Malcolm X hat and wrapped a red bandana under the hat…I realized after a year of looking like this that I was not going to turn into Axel Rose or Alex Haley…I conformed to what Society said was acceptable…claimimg dressing like a thug is Cultural is playing the role…call me racist, but it doesn’t seem to make any sense to put yourself in a position where you’ll be looked at as a thug.

196

[quote]sam_sneed wrote:

[quote]Stiglitz wrote:

Not to hijack this thread, but I’ve got to ask … What turned you off in the end?

I get being disappointed / disillusioned during his first term, but to go from campaign worker in '08 to still supporting him just 8 months ago … And now having regret?

He seems to have been consistently pretty awful to me … What was the final straw for you? [/quote]

Like Beans, I also did not like GW Bush at all and have always leaned democrat because:

  • I don’t care if gays marry each other.
  • I don’t think abortions should be banned.
  • The war on drugs is retarded and I’d like to see marijuana legalized even though I don’t smoke.
  • I’m not religious and don’t believe religion has any place in government.
  • The patriot act and the loss of civil liberties post 9-11.
  • I hated that we went into Iraq. I supported going into Afghanistan but I wanted the wars to end.
  • I wanted Gitmo closed immediately.
  • I hated the Bush administration’s foreign policy.

So I worked a few days on Obama’s campaign in '08. He got elected, I was happy and over the next 4 years he expanded on infringing on civil liberties and Gitmo is still open. If the Republicans had a better candidate, I would’ve went in that direction even though I’ll never fully be a Republican. Lesser of 2 evils. I couldn’t get behind Romney for several reasons.

Last straw was the payroll tax increase (or expiration of the decrease). O’Bama promised my taxes wouldn’t go up and they did. I don’t care why, I just care that there is less money if my pocket.

If that didn’t do it, Benghazi wouldn’ve been the last straw.

or the Snowden incident.

or his policy and lack of transparency on the use of drones.

I’d like to keep the thread on topic so I don’t really want to debate my reasons. But, since I was asked, there they are.[/quote]

You fit squarely in the libertarian wing of the Republican party.

197

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]Jewbacca wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:
I don’t see sagging pants as the social stigma you do…because I understand that culture.
[/quote]

OK, start dressing like a ‘gangsta’ instead of a scrubs and white lab coat or whatever dentist wear and see how your patients react and how you business does.

Sorry, people dress to give the world an impression of who they are, or rather how they want to be seen.[/quote]
Is it OK to dress like a “gangster” however? You know, like Gotti, Luciano, or Capone? [/quote]

I just want to hear Professor X’s answer before we expand the question.

Stop dressing like a doctor, doctor. Let’s see how it works.

198

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:

[quote]Waittz wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:

[quote]Waittz wrote:
On the topic of it not being fair to stereotype people for wearing sagging pants as criminals… really? Pant sagging is a fashion trend that originated from prisonwear and popularized by ganster rap, a music genre that romanticized criminal activity. Dont want to be steriotyped based on your fashion? Pull your pants up.

I dont see many people driving windowless vans complaining about being steriotyped as a pedobear.

Also, gorillavanilla I also am a white male living in Orlando. That doesnt mean my opinion on the lack of racism here prior to this event makes it a fact. Not sure how yours does. [/quote]
Don’t waste your breath on the clothing. I already tried that line of thought and was shot down by big X
[/quote]

That is because it isn’t logical.

I don’t see sagging pants as the social stigma you do…because I understand that culture.

You are stereotyping every man with a fashion trend as a CRIMINAL when that isn’t the case at all…and you think it is ok simply because it is “majority opinion”.

Minorities don’t share that view…so why should they pull their pants up because YOU don’t accept it?[/quote]

All I am saying is that when a fashion trend is based on a criminal trend and popularized by those romanticizing criminal behavior dont be suprised when people stereotype it as criminal related. To not do so and justify it as ‘I get it because I am black’ means that you do not in fact get it. [/quote]

Damn I should of not replied. You worded it better
[/quote]

I think the issue with this really stems from where one is riding in the “perception train”.

What this style is born of, and what it is evolving to represent are two different things. And X is at the front of the train as far as seeing the evolution, and people outside the communities where it is evolving are at the back of the train.

X, and I’m not trying to put words into his mouth, has eluded to Black culture in America as being in its infancy stage, and that is relatively true. Shit American culture in and of itself is relatively young, when compared to other civilizations in the world. It isn’t outlandish to look and see a group of people that were systematically withheld from making their place in the world by their government taking quite a few generations to fall into a cultural system that works for them, and within the larger society to which they belong.

In short, things don’t always mean what they did 10 and 15 years ago. [/quote]

Not quite like I would put it but yes, that is pretty much it.

I seriously doubt even one kid I see dressed like this if asked why would say, “Because they do it in prison”.

If anything it is because the guys getting the girls now dress like that so they do too…like every other human being would do if that was the surrounding culture.

199

[quote]waldo21212 wrote:
Dave Chapelle on how you dress:

[/quote]

VERY astute post.

200

[quote]Jewbacca wrote:
You don’t see Jews demanding everyone keep kosher, do you?

Oh, but we’re a SUCCESSFUL minority. Hmmmmmmm…[/quote]

fucking A right…Jews = The Original Slaves!