[quote]countingbeans wrote:
[quote]zecarlo wrote:
And wtf does thugz mean? What does thug mean? I know the etymological history of the word but has it taken on a new connotation? Has it become code for the n-word? [/quote]
You are acting like a moron on purpose here. You are much smarter than this garbage, and you know it.
Stop trolling with this shit. [/quote]
As if you have never heard or read some white kid who dresses like that being called a wigger. What’s the black version of wigger?
…and once again, thank you Counting numbers for the exchange.
It shows people can differ in opinion slightly and still carry on a discussion without all of this nonsense.
I wish it was seen more on the board. It would allow real debates and real discussions.
I have to go but will respond later if you want to take it further.
[quote]therajraj wrote:
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
It all depends on a lot more than dress. So people with good judgment look beyond dress, when possible. [/quote]
If you live in a city of millions, it’s rarely possible.
[/quote]
I would say it isn’t.
I would look at stance, gait, and several other “signs” before looking at “sagging pants” like many here seem to be doing.
This next part is not directed at you…but
I am honestly asking…are people unaware of how popular this TREND is?
If you really call all of these guys THUGS you are just out of touch with an entire culture.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
It all depends on a lot more than dress. So people with good judgment look beyond dress, when possible. [/quote]
I was attacked for saying the same in different words. I agree…so this is also why I asked what exactly these people were doing in that “drive way scenario” that made them THUGS if he knew there was a house party nearby.
[/quote]
I’m on vacation and had to stop back to see if this shit was still going on. X you are an idiot and a waste of time. Apparently you know the situation better than I. You know the guy who was there and fearful. I don’t have to explain myself to you and neither does anyone else. You have made this into something it wasnt. You are accusing people of not answering your questions and yet you don’t pay attention to anything that might call you out. ie. you were asked 5 guys standing in your driveway in white robes. What do you do? You skipped that because if you as black man (which was unknown to me as my computer doesn’t show avatars) said you’d approach them, it would make you look more ignorant than you already appear. I was there that night. You weren’t. If you get upset that the police approach you for being somewhere you don’t belong you’re an asshole. These guys did turn out to be thugs or whatever you’d like to call them. It’s the way I profiled them. I was right and I’m better for it. Twist it however you’d like. Play your “I’m better than you because of my city” card or I’m better than you because I don’t see a thug as a thug game. I’m done with you. You are waste of my intelligence and apparently live to argue over shit even when you have no leg to stand on. Do whatever you’d like but stop acting like you are the king of what is right and wrong. You look stupid!
[quote]zecarlo wrote:
[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:
Had plenty of white guys dress like that in my Hs and college. Why did they do it? They wanted to look like thugz. Were they? No [/quote]
How do you know? [/quote]
BECAUSE I WAS ONE.
for shit sake…
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
[quote]thehebrewhero wrote:
Thanks Myosin thats a very well put statement. Its nice to see someone see it that way. Weather people want to agree or disagree on how race was used in Travons case will be forever debated. Im kinda done dealing with it now. And have come to the conclusion that there is such a gigantic divide on race perceptions and gun control that you will be on one side of the fence or the other no matter what.
That is how it is but for black people and fathers of black & brown kids it?s a much more complex and fucked up situation then what most white people can grasp. Which is how can I protect my son from a world where non-trained, un-identified, gun packing citizens have the ability to do their own police work based on their non trained non professional assessments Thats where race is a MEGA issue…
So as a father of a brown or black kid how do we train them to deal with that world? I now have to introduce my son to the neighborhood watch guy not only in my neighborhood but the neighborhoods of friends he could possibly go? WTF!! I have to make sure his clothing is up to the standards of middle age white people? WTF! How do I teach him whats suspicious walking? If hes too slow its suspicious if hes running will someone will chase him. If someone chases him does he freeze, or does he try to defend himself? Is something going to happen if hes at a new friends house and people dont recognize him.
White people with white sons for the most part wont have that fear. Im not a Navy seal with a law degree so how fuck am I supposed to make sure my son lives to see me die? Its hard enough having to worry about the police shooting an unarmed black or brown kid. Now we have to worry about everyone else. My father never had to teach me how to deal with police so I dont get shot, as a white man thats a non issue. For that matter he sure as shit didnt bring up armed citizens.
For black fathers teaching their kids about police is pretty normal. The perception of being safe because of police is not shared by all. Things like street sweeps, and corruption do exist but largely not in suburban or rural communities which are predominantly white. Add in the now fear of average possibly uniformed want to be cops and the fear level has just gone red alert for all parents of black & brown kids. Worst of all we have no way to protect them.
In regards to race on this matter?When everyones packing that?s why race tolerance, understanding, and reason are so god damn important.
[/quote]
This is such a melodramatic appeal to emotion any truth contained within is rendered moot by the horseshit.
This isn’t the first time a democrat has shot a black person.
This isn’t the first time a Hispanic man has shot a black person.
This isn’t the first time an ambitious prosecutor fucked up and went after fame rather than justice.
This isn’t the first time bad judgment has lead to tragedy.
This case does not, did not, nor ever will mean “open season” on liberals “hunting” black people.
This utterly false notion that white people just “have it so easy” is nonsense to the highest degree. All I have to do is cross the river by my house and there are entire neighborhoods I can’t walk in because I’m white, unless I want to invite trouble.
Statistically your kids, my kids and everyone’s kids are more likely to die in a drunk driving accident, eating themselves to death, smoking, drug over dose or any other event than shot by a neighborhood watchman.
I’m white and was raised to hate/not trust police. (I’ve sense grown up to judge individuals not entire groups by any one individual, but hey that is just me.)
My son is biracial and not a single thing you’ve mentioned here are the lessons he has learned from this event…
Good lord. [/quote]
Good lord indeed…You can see it however you want its your right. But dismissing my view as the father of a brown skinned son in a stand your ground state as melodramatic appeal to emotion is exactly what Myosin was talking about. When we disregard & denigrate each others views and perspectives we alienate each other and further the race divide. If you dont feel that way about your brown skinned son ok maybe the environment you live in is different than mine… But consider asking your black relatives and friends from large metro areas how they feel about their sons safety. Im not putting down your views just trying to show you the other side of the coin.
I never said all whites have it easier then all blacks in every aspect of life. As country we have certainly made progress and in most case the playing field has been leveled. But in regards to how we as different races interact with the police is very different. If you want to deny that white people dont have it easier with the police fine you can stay in your cave. How many times have you been caught up in random street sweeps, got stopped and frisked, or just pulled over and harassed. Probably not much but I would bet your black relatives or friends from larger metro areas have a different story to tell. As a white person growing up in Washington DC I can promise you these things happen, and as a white person I walked by it every time. Once in a street sweep they even let me go my black friends were doing the same shit I was. Smoking weed, drinkinking, skipping school. I caught the metro home while they all had to go to jail and get picked up by their parents.
Sure statistically its more likely any teen would die from a car wreck. But ponder this in a large metro area with 1) Black on black crime 2) Police harassment in the community 3) Armed citizens on patrol All 3 potential life threaten to black or brown teens… Most white male teens just dont have that issue to contend with. If you want to throw satisitcs around its probably way more likely a innocent black/brown teen dies from police miss conduct or a stray bullet. Now add to the mix armed citizens on patrol and mortality rates change some more.
As far as lessons go I never said I learned or was teaching anything from it. I said just the opposite that now we dont know really what to teach him. Maybe I should send him to negro survival camp for his 15th bday. What I did say is in a new world where untrained armed citizens make their own police decisions we now have a new fear that we now have to contend with. You can play it off all you want but your lovely brown boy you love so much wont be viewed the same by all. Especially when you are not neer by& hes 13-18.
On another note someone said if I dont like the law in my state move… Thats the very definition of insensitive and shows lack of tolerance. So I dont even need to bother to explain how backwoods, hillbilly retard that is. Maybe I should move to a magic place in the USA where theres no racism, discrimination by our protectors, or crime. I guess that would be Disneyland.
[quote]zecarlo wrote:
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
Expression through style is just that, but people are going to judge. That will never change. [/quote]
But an educated person, which Zimmerman clearly is not, would understand that if he is perceiving something that he needs to know why he perceives it. He needs to come to terms with the forces that shape his judgement. That’s why racial profiling does not work. It’s why cops are not supposed to use it. It is inefficient. So if Zimmerman were an educated person he would have asked himself, “why do I believe black boys are all criminals? Why do I have a hard on and need to get these ‘assholes’? Why do I really believe that that black kid in a hoodie is suspicious?” The unexamined life is not worth living. If Zimmerman were educated he would know who said that. Even more importantly, he would have taken it to heart. [/quote]
How many break ins were in the area prior?
Who were the suspects?
Had this been a McDonalds in say some remote town in Northern Vermont were all the break ins were done and the suspects were all 14 year old white kids with dreadlocks and Phish Tees on, then you’d have a point. However you have failed to look at the facts and circumstances of the situation to see that he might not just be a racist.
In fact the FBI even agrees he isn’t a god damn racist.
[quote]installglass wrote:
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
It all depends on a lot more than dress. So people with good judgment look beyond dress, when possible. [/quote]
I was attacked for saying the same in different words. I agree…so this is also why I asked what exactly these people were doing in that “drive way scenario” that made them THUGS if he knew there was a house party nearby.
[/quote]
I’m on vacation and had to stop back to see if this shit was still going on. X you are an idiot and a waste of time. Apparently you know the situation better than I. You know the guy who was there and fearful. I don’t have to explain myself to you and neither does anyone else. You have made this into something it wasnt. You are accusing people of not answering your questions and yet you don’t pay attention to anything that might call you out. ie. you were asked 5 guys standing in your driveway in white robes. What do you do? You skipped that because if you as black man (which was unknown to me as my computer doesn’t show avatars) said you’d approach them, it would make you look more ignorant than you already appear. I was there that night. You weren’t. If you get upset that the police approach you for being somewhere you don’t belong you’re an asshole. These guys did turn out to be thugs or whatever you’d like to call them. It’s the way I profiled them. I was right and I’m better for it. Twist it however you’d like. Play your “I’m better than you because of my city” card or I’m better than you because I don’t see a thug as a thug game. I’m done with you. You are waste of my intelligence and apparently live to argue over shit even when you have no leg to stand on. Do whatever you’d like but stop acting like you are the king of what is right and wrong. You look stupid!
[/quote]
You’re late to that party, my friend.
[quote]zecarlo wrote:
And wtf does thugz mean? What does thug mean? I know the etymological history of the word but has it taken on a new connotation? Has it become code for the n-word? [/quote]
oh my shit. i posted the definition from the dictionary twice and professorson did as well.
did you just ignore those posts?
i am out, cant take the sillyness. good luck anyone that opposes professorsons views…
edited
[quote]zecarlo wrote:
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
[quote]zecarlo wrote:
And wtf does thugz mean? What does thug mean? I know the etymological history of the word but has it taken on a new connotation? Has it become code for the n-word? [/quote]
You are acting like a moron on purpose here. You are much smarter than this garbage, and you know it.
Stop trolling with this shit. [/quote]
As if you have never heard or read some white kid who dresses like that being called a wigger. What’s the black version of wigger? [/quote]
Ignorant people who use “wigger” have nothing to do with your trolling about thug being a “code word”.
[quote]thehebrewhero wrote:
Thats the very definition of insensitive and shows lack of tolerance. So I donâ??t even need to bother to explain how backwoods, hillbilly retard that is. [/quote]
I was actually going to respond to your post but then this came about.
You can’t be this inconsistent on accident, lol.
“Lack of tolerance” then proceed to use “hillbilly” and “retard”.
Just, lol.
And my son isn’t my “brown son”. He is just my son.
[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:
[quote]installglass wrote:
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
It all depends on a lot more than dress. So people with good judgment look beyond dress, when possible. [/quote]
I was attacked for saying the same in different words. I agree…so this is also why I asked what exactly these people were doing in that “drive way scenario” that made them THUGS if he knew there was a house party nearby.
[/quote]
I’m on vacation and had to stop back to see if this shit was still going on. X you are an idiot and a waste of time. Apparently you know the situation better than I. You know the guy who was there and fearful. I don’t have to explain myself to you and neither does anyone else. You have made this into something it wasnt. You are accusing people of not answering your questions and yet you don’t pay attention to anything that might call you out. ie. you were asked 5 guys standing in your driveway in white robes. What do you do? You skipped that because if you as black man (which was unknown to me as my computer doesn’t show avatars) said you’d approach them, it would make you look more ignorant than you already appear. I was there that night. You weren’t. If you get upset that the police approach you for being somewhere you don’t belong you’re an asshole. These guys did turn out to be thugs or whatever you’d like to call them. It’s the way I profiled them. I was right and I’m better for it. Twist it however you’d like. Play your “I’m better than you because of my city” card or I’m better than you because I don’t see a thug as a thug game. I’m done with you. You are waste of my intelligence and apparently live to argue over shit even when you have no leg to stand on. Do whatever you’d like but stop acting like you are the king of what is right and wrong. You look stupid!
[/quote]
You’re late to that party, my friend.
[/quote]
I missed a party? I guess that’s two I didn’t know about.
[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:
People with good judgement also know that in some cases, profiling can help you avoid some pretty shitty people.
The key is to have the ability to see past that if they can prove you wrong. [/quote]
I don’t think many people would disagree with this.
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:
People with good judgement also know that in some cases, profiling can help you avoid some pretty shitty people.
The key is to have the ability to see past that if they can prove you wrong. [/quote]
I don’t think many people would disagree with this. [/quote]
Agreed 100%
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
[quote]thehebrewhero wrote:
Thats the very definition of insensitive and shows lack of tolerance. So I don�¢??t even need to bother to explain how backwoods, hillbilly retard that is. [/quote]
I was actually going to respond to your post but then this came about.
You can’t be this inconsistent on accident, lol.
“Lack of tolerance” then proceed to use “hillbilly” and “retard”.
Just, lol.
And my son isn’t my “brown son”. He is just my son. [/quote]
It is backwoods thinking but I can candy coat it and call it uniformed or unedjucated if we want to be all sciency about it. I’ll be less snarky if that contributes to the debate better. My son is my son too 100% with you on that but how you see your son wont be the same to all. Lets not kid ourselves they will grow up to look like brown skinned men in a mirror. I hope when mine gets older maybe race relations are better they certainly seem to be eaons from our parents or grandparents time. For that matter things are better since the 80’s
[quote]thehebrewhero wrote:
It is backwoods thinking but I can candy coat it and call it uniformed or unedjucated if we want to be all sciency about it.[/quote]
Dude… Not using “hillbilly” and “retard” isn’t “sciency” it is called decency. Particularly seeing how hard you have been rallying for tolerance and non-discrimination.
Are you really missing this point?
Nope. He is going to grow up and see a man in the mirror. Period.
And anyone that doesn’t see the same, that is on them.
Beans is laying down the law
[quote]installglass wrote:
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:
People with good judgement also know that in some cases, profiling can help you avoid some pretty shitty people.
The key is to have the ability to see past that if they can prove you wrong. [/quote]
I don’t think many people would disagree with this. [/quote]
Agreed 100%[/quote]
yep
This is for those of you who are interested in actual discussion and not just throwing insults.
What exactly makes this guy a thug?
Or this guy?