TOT ExperiMENT Log

Pharma
23

I feel you. I’m starting today with a slow cut as my last fast cut left me aggressive as shit after two weeks. I got 10 weeks to go and about 10 lbs. Should drop me to 11-12 %.

Recomping is done by naturals. When I started out I did it myself (granted I was light as fuck) at 160 lbs on 6 ft and 15-17 % and I went to 160 at 10 %. I even got pictures, took me about a year in a small to medium deficit with cheat days mixed in.

My opinion on this is, if you’re willing to take the long and small step approach of recomping, it can absolutely be done with it without roids (I actually think with roids it’s a given if you eat at maintenance or slightly below).

I throw sleep in there as an equally strong regulator of well being and good looking.

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24

I remember reading that you are prone to overproduction of RBCs; have you noticed a difference in HCT with MENT vs testosterone?

25

Good question. I don’t know yet. Blood work is scheduled for mid month. If HCT doesn’t come down or stabilize then I’m very likely to either drastically reduce doses of anything or come off entirely.

I’ve considered going a different route—low dose dbol and HCG only for a month or two, combined with a bloodletting—but with the speed of international delivery being slowed considerably and domestic labs all capping at doses too high for my needs I may be SOL. My back stock of gear has been used up by someone else and I’m running low on everything but MENT and my RX testosterone.

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26

Scientific update

So it’s been a while since I’ve given an official update.

On January 5th I dropped my dose to 2.5mg/d. This was to correspond with my cut, thus my need for a higher dose was lessened.

In five weeks I lost 5lbs, which is the pace I was expecting. Strength stayed consistent until last week. Libido and mood are not nearly as good as they were at the beginning of the year, but I cannot attribute that solely to the change in dose. The calorie deficit could be the culprit or at least be playing a part. Overall I’m where I expected to be, which is hungry and mildly unhappy. I will say that I don’t look any different, which is at once frustrating and also encouraging. It’s frustrating because as you drop body fat you hope to look better, and I’m not seeing it. But it’s also encouraging because I still look relatively full and I can’t see any size loss within my overall musculature.

This has been a fun experiment and I imagine I’ll end up using MENT forever if my blood work comes back clean. I’ll likely have to take some time off at some point, since my wife and I are discussing having kids, but once that’s settled I picture myself using this instead of testosterone for the duration. Or at the very least using it as a replacement for x% of the year. I don’t know. I don’t want to make any predictions until I have blood work done and I know what impact it’s really had.

27

Gotta say, i’m tempted to try this in place of TRT at like 1-2mg/day. Perhaps down the line I’ll try it… Or not… No rush.

Out of everything I’ve ever tried my favourite was (and will probably always be) primobolan. I won’t disclose the details, but as always the dose was very low/conservative in conjunction with a (slightly below) TRT dose of testosterone (below 75mg/wk).

Aside from lipids (drop in HDL) virtually no negative effects were noted on blood work. No negative effects regarding autonomic dysfunction, physical health (pulse pressure/BP etc). Only side effect noted was cramping during cardio.

My hairline does appear to be receding, but I don’t care enough to do anything about it; I have bigger fish to fry and losing my hair (to me) certainly isn’t the end of the world. I have a mate who is a year younger than me, but going bald. He’s now on Finasteride.

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28

On point. To those who used during a cut, how would you rate the feeling of cutting on supra physiological doses of AAS in comparison to cutting natural?

29

Scientific update

It’s been a while. Recently got blood work done and it was pretty much everything I had hoped for. I’ll post the relevant information and discard that which was unchanged.

Standard TRT, which was 100mg/w

Hemoglobin 18.2
HCT 59.6%
Cholesterol, Total 188
HDL 24
LDL 146
Ratio 7.8

MENT/No test

Hemoglobin 19
HCT 54.2%
Cholesterol, Total 163
HDL 33
LDL 114
Ratio 4.9

As I suspected (based on the clinical data available) dropping testosterone and replacing it with MENT decreased my HCT by 5.4%. That was a huge ‘holy shit it worked’ moment for me. Some of you know that my struggles with high HCT have been the only thing I was focused on over the last six months. I knew that if the MENT didn’t work then I’d have to come off everything for a while, and that was not something I was looking forward to.

My cut is still going, albeit slowly and annoyingly. Down to 187 this am, so -7lbs since January 1st. I’m not exactly happy with the progress, but I’ve had a few days that I simply planned to fail because I failed to adequately meal prep.

Primo/MENT blast begins, fittingly, on Pi Day. I may start the primo at a low dose for the next two weeks just to add a little extra to these last few weeks of cutting. Cut may carry over into the first few weeks of this blast as well. Depends if I’m happy where I am on day one of the blast.

I may be adding GH to this as well. I’m still on the fence. FBG was good a few weeks ago, so insulin issues seem to be nonexistent. I had been worried about that. Getting an IGF-1 baseline taken today (actually already had the blood draw this AM), so now would be a good time to go for it. Follow up blood work is in three months. So that’s a decent window with which to experiment. Probably will do 4iu eod the first two weeks, then up it to 5iu, and if tolerance is good I’ll be at 6iu eod by the start of April. Going with a mix of pharma and UGL. The pharma will be 4iu and any extra will be UGL. It’s one of those ‘I have money to burn and the good sense not to burn all of it’ situations.

Interesting side note here: so I went in for blood work under the guise of having my personal physician monitor my trt. I laid out what I’m currently doing and she has agreed that I obviously know more about it than her. But my TT came back at 345. You see, I had to show some testosterone otherwise it would have looked suspicious. And I wasn’t sure if I wanted to tell her everything, so I took one test shot to give myself a few options. That 345 is the result of a 60mg test c injection nine days prior to blood work. That’s a damn good response from a low dose more than a week prior. In fact, that’s the best time-adjusted trough reading I’ve ever had. It’s a curious aberration.

Anyway, I plan on taking measurements before I start this blast and I’ll share them as things progress. Thanks for reading. Any questions or comments are welcome.

7 Likes
30

Let me know how this goes for you. Just heard back from Defy and while the patient care coordinator told me they DO prescribe it the doctor said no they don’t. That leaves me only the UGL HGH option which is one I did not want to take.

31

Can you elaborate on the dosages your going with for the primo and ment?
Above you mentioned 5mg/d ment and 600mg/wk primo. That still the plan?
Still the planned recomp?

32

Pharma is out there if you’re willing to pay for it. Maybe skip an oil change on the McClaren and that’ll cover it :joy:

33

Plan is still primo 600, might bump the MENT to 10mg since 5mg was so easy on my body and mind. If it gets to be too much I can bail out fast. With an acetate ester it’s easy to adjust on the fly, thankfully.

34

Yeah I just don’t want to change clinics. I just did last year so theres that.

No kidding my friend. I brought it in for its annual oil change which already costs 2K and left with a 17k repair and maintenance bill. Thank god I have an extended warranty which covered half of it at least.

35

Holy shit that’s literally—not figuratively, literally—insane.

And clinics aren’t the only ones who provide pharma GH…just sayin’.

36

Yep, I can’t get myself to pull the trigger on a project car that would cost about that much total (after doing what I want to it).

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37

Thats true. I can get 36iu pharma pens for a pretty penny. I don’t want to use the damn pens for whatever reason and I almost think something that walks, talks, and looks like pharma is more likey to be fake that just generic UGL. I think I’m either going to skip it or just get UGL from a reputable source with lab data.

My IGF1 may have come up due to the CPAP anyway so I gotta wait and see on that too. I’m really starting to lean out on this cut program and vascularity is even starting to show. My arms stopped shrinking and my waist is still trimming down. I’m sad to be down to just over a semi cut 16" arm but on my small frame it looks better than my blobish almost 17" arm.

38

Looking at blood values and test levels you could run 5mg daily alongside your TRT dose and there would be no red flags during bloods or am i missing something? Your cholesterol improved (do you think that was from dropping the test?) but what about lipids? How else does MENT affect bloods that I should be aware of? I’m becoming more convinced I may run it for a while after my this cycle ends and bloods look good. As long as all is good they won’t wanna see me for 6 months. I’ve been able to locate a domestic source with lab results of almost 97% purity.

39

And you are killing it on weight loss. That alone can sometimes stop (and in most cases at least improve) sleep apnea.

With UGL is the main concern sterility or contamination? It seems plenty get IGF-1 up a ton on UGL HGH (similar levels as pharma). If that is the case, I don’t understand the attraction to pharma GH, unless it is sterility or contamination? I also understand the legal advantage of pharma.

Maybe I am missing something else? I am seeing all this attraction to pharma GH lately, but I don’t understand it coming from people getting UGL gear already? It seems like it is quite easy to confirm the quality with a blood test.

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40

Blood tests aren’t the standard for HGH. You need to know purity and dimer. There’s a very good UGL (I hate the term ‘generic’ with a passion) that tests about as well as any pharma grade out there.

41

Look to the East, my friend. China has actual pharma HGH that is approved by their ministry of health, used in hospitals, and sold at pharmacies. No different than major US brands, but the price is maybe 15-20% less. And they come in old school vials. That’s what I’m looking at because I don’t want to mess with pens either.

42

What is dimer? The ones I’ve seen have a purity test, but I take this with a grain of salt as I don’t think they would be hard to fake.