[quote]56x11 wrote:
[quote]trivium wrote:
[quote]56x11 wrote:
[quote]trivium wrote:
(I felt like my form was off on the leg press. Something felt different than usual.)
Some knee discomfort setting up for the leg press was present.[/quote]
Trivium, if you recall from our prior conversations, one of the things I mentioned is that since the injury, your body has been making subtle changes in the way it moves. It compensates for the injury by altering its movement patterns. And this can, and often does, lead to other issues. I’ve seen this time and time again in the weight room and on the playing field.
And, although the leg press does not require as much stability as a traditional squat, it also limits hip extension. And this can often transfer the load to…you guessed it, the knees. Furthermore, where you place your feet on the leg press will also dictate how much hamstring complex will assist (generally, higher the feet, more hamstring complex involvement).
I don’t know if you’re aware of the Lombard paradox. It takes place in a squatting pattern in which the hamstring complex actually assists in the movement. If your feet are low (or low-ish) when doing the leg press, this, along with the inability to optimally extend the hip can actually cause more harm than good for you at this particular time.
I’m not anti-leg press per se, but these are some of the things you need to be aware of.
Whether the MRI shows something significant such as a sprain or not, you’d be much better off incorporating some type of corrective work that addresses the imbalances you have. This ain’t sexy but it has a much higher rate of getting you on the road to injury-free PRs.
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I was aware of the foot placement thing, but I didn’t know that it had a name haha.
I hang my toes off the top of the press because, not only do I squat low bar and I feel that has greater carry over, but I also believe that raw squatting is a quad dominant exercise so it helps to balance everything out.
As for the other stuff, I have been working on trying to incorporate more stretching.
I have always done a basic RTC warm up (YTWL and Apley scratch) before pressing movements.
For lower body though, I have been lacking a bit. I am now making a conscious effort to do the limber 11, wall sits for time, and shoulder dislocations (gradually with the last 2 of course) on my off days.
My appointment with sports medicine is tomorrow, so I will get the results of my MRI there.
I should add that I did play basketball two days ago, and my knee was stiff about 3 hours after playing. I wasn’t sitting comfortably though, so that may have played into it all.
Thanks for posting man. If you have any recommendations for prophylactic stretching routines, I would be all ears.[/quote]
Just to clarify on the Lombard paradox, this applies more to an actual squat. As you know, the leg press (to some degree) mimics the squat. However, there are several things lost in translation (such as full hip extension).
So what I meant to say is that when using the leg press, it would be debatable just how much of the Lombard paradox will occur (many factors such as machine design, physical size of the trainee, etc.)
Therefore, to make sure you recruit the hamstring complex when doing the leg press, use the high feet placement. The fact that you already do this is a bit serendipitous and I only mentioned it earlier because I wasn’t sure where you place your feet.
I will caution you regarding machine-based work. Just because the stability has been eliminated (or significantly reduced) does NOT mean you’re guaranteed a safe workout. I’ve said this repeatedly; it won’t surprise me one bit if your body is subtly favoring the non-injured leg. This has the potential to lead to over use issues for what is currently the “healthy” leg.
I don’t know what is in the Limber 11 but I do know that DeFranco’s earlier version (I think he called it agile 8 or something) has a movement called the sleeper stretch.
I am NOT sold on the efficacy of this as I’ve noticed it tends to stretch the posterior capsule. This is an area in which I do not believe most people need more mobility. Of course, there will always be exceptions. However, there are safer alternatives such as the cross body stretch.
In general (again there are exceptions which I won’t go into), stretching pre and during the workout should be light to moderate. RPE of 6 or less out of 10 and a duration no longer than 15-30 seconds. If the stretch is aggressive and/or prolonged, the Golgi tendon organ can be activated and down regulate the muscle. This is one of the reasons stretching got a bad rap; people stretched too hard to too long prior to training or competition, their power output suffered, and they threw the baby out with the bath water.
Judicious use of moderate smr/static stretching can improve mobility which will lead to performance gains and help injury prevention.
Here is one example that applies to you. You mentioned the YTWLs. After a general warm up to raise overall body temp, foam roll the T spine. Then, in between sets of the YTWLs, take a tennis ball (or something similar) and smr the pec minor, followed by a stretch that targets the area (also squeeze the scap towards the spine while stretching to help the process). Then perform your next set of the YTWLs. Then smr/static stretch again. You will notice that your mobility will gradually improve. This will lead to getting more out the YTWLs.
DO NOT get aggressive on the smr/static stretch if you are doing the YTWLs prior to benching (or any other activity in which you need your pecs to fire maximally). Remember: we do not want to down regulate that muscle to the point it negatively alters performance.
However, if you are performing the YTWLs AFTER pressing or on an easy day, feel free to experiment with a slightly more effort on the smr/static stretch. This is also a good time to try PNF stretching and see if you benefit from it.
The above is just one example of how to integrate mobility work into your program.
People devote so much time to the strength gaining aspect, they are doing themselves a disservice by ignoring the plain Jane things. As is often the case in life, sexy is fun and exciting but often lets you down if that’s all you chase.
When you work with the medical team, they will get specific on various protocols and techniques. Let’s just keep our fingers crossed and hope they take pride in their jobs. Regardless, the ball is now in their court because they’re the ones directly working with you. Therefore, I have little choice but to defer the matter to them. This, obviously, also applies to the other aspects of your treatment. Just be sure to be an active participant that asks questions and isn’t shy about giving them feedback - good and bad.
In closing, I posted in this thread because we first met in the injury subforum and I pride myself on following up as long as the other party is open minded and respectful, which you have been. Just know that my schedule is getting more and more busy and I will be posting less because…well, something has to give.
Best of luck. [/quote]
Thanks man. I do my YTWL’s for one set before I start my warmups with lots of reps with the bar only. I don’t get carried away with that stuff. My roomate in college was a fantastic track and field athlete, and being in the HS field I have been warned of the aggressive stretch routines that people attempt. I just want to promote flexibility, not destroy the hell out of my tendons/ligaments. I am a big proponent of building. You cant build if you break.
Thanks for all the help. I do know all about getting busy and losing time to be able to get on here and message people. Best of luck to you!