Me. I pissed myself off.
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This conversation has become a total head-scratcher for me. Iâm left wondering if I wander around like a simpering imbecile. Iâm also puzzling over the intent of your harassers, because while I agree with this:
I canât quite get to:
If itâs older men, Iâd suspect protectiveness might underlie unease that you are (to them) visibly unhappy. Obviously youâre not going to get to âhappyâ through fake-smiling, but it makes more sense to me than that they want young women to present a flower garden of visual appeal. Donât older women do this to you, too? E.g. âyouâd be so pretty if youâd just smile more.â
I know that when Iâm cleaning or hurrying to get ready for work my family can interpret my facial expression as angry. Iâm not; Iâm focused and intent, but itâs not my âneutralâ vibe of cheery chattiness. I know I probably rock the same expression at work when Iâm in motion, trying to get things done between clients. No one has ever commented, though.
I wonder if your neutral/thinking expression is sad rather than something more business-like and leave-me-TF-alone? Which is not to say that you should change or worry about your expression, because youâre absolutely right, you donât exist for the comfort or pleasure of others. This has just momentarily caught my attention as a curious thing.
If theyâre uneasy about someone seeming unhappy Iâm not sure asking them to pretend to be happier so they canât see it is the right move.
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Oh, I completely agree! Just curious about intent, which I think matters. âIâm distressed by your distressâ is different from âIâm distressed by your lack of attention to the pleasure of the people having to view you.â
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My wife calls this my frumpy brow.
At one place I worked there were a couple of people that wouldnât come near me because they thought I was always angry. We ended up finally breaking the ice and having some laughs about it. The one old Ukrainian guy used to break me out of it with âWhy you look like you stuck in Russian gulag? Sun is shining. Birds are chirping. You not fucking dead.â.
My typical response was usually something like âMy head is full of fucks and I canât get rid of them. No fucks for you!â in my best soup nazi impression.
Then some laughs and goofing off, etc. And a good time is had by all.
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Thanks. It seems to happen to women much more often, but I imagine anyone, regardless of gender identity, would not like to feel how I described.
No, not older women who donât know me. Surely Iâve had older women in my family say that to me when I was a child â never a stranger. So when they said it, it was not creepy albeit still a little annoying at times. Pre-pandemic Iâve thankfully never had anyone in a school or work setting, regardless of their age or sex, say this to me because smiling is not part of the job description and because it is, well, inappropriate.
Again, I know this happens to younger men too (probably from older women though canât say for sure). But Iâd really like to know of all the older dudes who see me commuting or at the grocery store and have the audacity to approach me and insist I smile, how many times they are told to do the same, or if they also routinely tell young men whom they do not know and probably will never see again to smile.
I feel that strangers who do this are not thinking whatsoever. They assume they can perfectly map my mood from my facial expression in mundane situations. I can admit my default facial expression errs more toward the serious side, but I by no means walk around like I am about to burst into tears. And if I were genuinely depressed about something, why would I not be allowed manifest that anyway? Should I smile all day, every day regardless of the situation?
It does not matter if the speaker actually intends to objectify me, but the phrase comes off that way, because âoh, even if your family member/friend/etc. died yesterday, or if youâre simply tired from a long workday (how would I know), seeing your non-smiling face in a grocery store bothers me so much that I will approach you and say you should smile because that looks more pleasant to me.â Not even checking if something is wrong, which would be much better than telling me how to look, or how I should look. Sorry my neutral expression doesnât win you over?
/endrant
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Sad but hilarious that I remember reading this exact review months ago. People do not understand the purpose of reviews.
Similar things happen all the time online but sometimes in the opposite direction. I like buying things from Etsy, and so many reviewers leave five stars and say stuff like âI bought this as a gift, but I think X person will love it!â or âI havenât tried it yet. The seller packaged everything so nicely. Canât wait to try.â
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I think itâs possible but definitely less so with guys. I am a very normal looking person and I dress very plain. I have never had a stranger comment on my face. On the other hand my buddy paints his nails and has had one or two older guys complain about him wearing âgirl stuffâ.
While weâre on the topic of misplaced reviews: Who are these people that comment on recipes? âI replaced the chicken with salmon and the potatoes with corn. Not good 4/10â
???!
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Fair enough, and I agree. Please donât take my questioning as anything more than an exploration of something I hadnât thought much about previously!
Oh, THESE fuckers! They piss me off, too.
Yeah, people in new work contexts are sometimes surprised that Iâm as fun/funny as I am. I think because in addition to the angry focused-on-work face I look a little goody-two-shoe-ish. Which Iâm not.
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And when people rate some establishment one star because it was closedâŠ
It also totally sucks for the product/company, but I must say I always find it hilarious more than aggravating when elderly people donât understand how online reviews work and leave a one star review for something they really like. Or a totally irrelevant and unhelpful comment.
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People who think itâs acceptable to say their personal pronouns are they/them/their. Those are plural pronouns and itâs confusing to use them to refer to a single person. Youâre not the queen and there is only one of you.
You are really missing out.
Has anyone seen Gansu? When is them getting here?
How do you refer to a non-binary person without using they/them?
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In addition to what @rroo said, I can almost guarantee that you already use âtheyâ and âtheirâ in singular forms in your everyday speech.
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Person 1: Did you hear what the cashier at the store did today?
Person 2: No, what did they do?
They/them as a singular is used commonly in English.
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If folks are uncomfortable using they/them, try on âbuddyâ or âfriendâ or âpalâ.
Personally I think the people who correct you on pronouns are the same people who go by the full name and get pissed when you assume they go by the common nickname. Jonathan not Jon, Mathew not matt, Thomas not tom, etc. Kinda pretentious imo, but whatever.
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No, I donât use âtheyâ as a singular pronoun because it isnât and using it as such is improper grammar. Person 2 in your example sounds ignorant.
Person 1 in your example sounds ignorant.
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So, in such a context, you say âheâ or âsheâ or âhe or sheâ 100% of the time, even when you donât know the gender?
lol it absolutely is proper grammar.
Even excluding the current movement to be gender inclusive the aforementioned case has been correct for my entire life. If youâd like to stop sounding ignorant here are some opinions from popular style guides.
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