We’ll have to disagree on that one.
I appreciate the offer, but I don’t know how I’d feel about you robbing people to feed my family. I would probably rob some people if I had to-that doesn’t mean I wouldn’t deserve to be killed by my victim/s.
https://criminal.findlaw.com/criminal-charges/robbery-overview.html
I think that most people don’t understand what robbery is, because they hear people that come home and find their lawn ornament gone say, “I’ve been robbed.” That’s larceny.
Well, TBH I’m against the death penalty due to flawed criminal justice systems. We have executed people who turned out to be innocent, or at least unable to be proved guilty when new evidence surfaces.
Maybe, for the case where it is not possible for the defendant to be innocent I could support it (Hitler would be an example). I think that these situations are so few and far between, that just locking them up makes the most sense.
Additionally, it is generally far more expensive for the tax payer to execute, than to lock up.
I think the goal should be to have a safe society, and not to get vengeance.
Already said I don’t generally support the death penalty.
I’m against the death penalty for the majority of circumstances
However there are instances wherein I think such barbaric measures are certainly justified. For instance, Adolf Eichmann… This man oversaw the mass deportation of Jews, political prisoners, homosexuals etc into ghettos and concentration camps. He was also (somewhat) directly responsible for organising the “final solution”, visited numerous concentration camps, witnessed mass executions etc.
After the war ended, he fled to Argentina, but was captured by the Mossad in 1960. Throughout his trial he showcased zero remorse, even stated that he didn’t feel guilty… Does someone like this, someone who oversaw the murder of millions deserve to live?
I wasn’t aware it was more expensive to execute a criminal than to house one in prison. Apparently in the USA it costs around 30000$/yr to house a federal inmate. Would it really have been cheaper to house Eichmann for 20-30 years before he died of old age? Post trial they executed him via hanging, a death of which to me was well deserved.
Another instance of a character I believe deserved the death penalty (but didn’t get it) was a guy named Peter Scully. This guy was Australian, so his capture was on the news here. He was a serial child rapist and perhaps killer who ran a “distribution ring” on the dark web, made millions. His crimes were behind atrocious. The level of sheer cruelty behind some of his actions (you can watch the news segment about his capture, it says enough) indicates an individual beyond rehabilitation and furthermore… Someone who doesn’t deserve a second chance in my opinion. There was also a televised interview of him wherein he shows very little remorse for his actions, refuses to answer numerous questions etc, tries to market a book he’s writing… Why pay to house someone like Scully until death by old age? He will never reintegrate back within normal society, his crimes were behind atrocious and numerous in nature… I personally wouldn’t want any portion of my tax going towards ensuring a person like this is kept adequately fed.
Do these not appear as if they’re circumstances of which the death penalty could be warranted? Within both cases the evidence was absolutely damning, irrefutable.
I never said anything about closing gun stores, if tobacconists/bottle stores and cannabis dispensaries can be deemed essential services, I see no reason as to why gun stores shouldn’t be.
You’re free to agree to disagree with my ideology regarding concealed carry, but it should be noted it doesn’t mean I’m definitively wrong … Just as you aren’t definitively right. A spectrum of opinions do exist, and just because my opinion differs to that of yours doesn’t mean that it’s invalid.
The truth is, just about every other secular, developed nations in the world doesn’t have civilians walking around with loaded firearms… They’re doing fine (well, people aren’t getting shot), why?
They also have far lower rates of gun violence. I’ve heard the “mental illness” argument, the “but… Gangs” argument etc
Italy has the mafia, why don’t we see sky high rates of firearm homicide there? Whether the uptick in US gun violence per capita is due to gun ownership, criminal activity (sheer presence of black market availability), sociocultural attitudes or mental illness I don’t know… What I do know is that something isn’t right.
In response to people panic buying weapons, will the subsequent increase in gun violence be due to criminal activity, suicides (prolonged isolation), or civilians getting antsy/stressed out (isolation + on edge)… Or legitimate instances of self defence. Only time will tell.
My point isn’t to ban guns or shut down gun stores, it’s to state that no gun control at all is ludicrous. You’re not infringing upon anyone’s rights by enforcing that someone priorly convicted of aggravated assault can’t purchase a firearm.
If one looks at statistics, a gun is far more likely to be stolen than legitimately used in self defence. I’d hypothesise stealing will be more commonplace following mass economic recession. Stolen firearms could fall into the wrong hands. Hence my advocation for gun safes.
You’re at home, you’ve stockpiled a ton of weapons… Cabin fever sets in, doesn’t seem like a good combo…
I’m not the villain here, nor am I millitantly anti-gun. I just don’t see why you need concealed carry when you’re hardly leaving the house. If you’ve got a legitimate chance of getting shot on the way to buy groceries… to me that paints a picture of a country in a very bad state of affairs.
That being said, the mass unemployment and associated lack of federal compensation currently present in the USA may drive up rates of criminal activity. I can only comment from my standpoint, wherein people are being compensated adequately, not having to pay rent if laid off. If the USA is legitimately on the brink of societal collapse… Perhaps it is justified to stock up on weapons as gun ownership is so rampant within the generalised populace to begin with. I don’t live in America anymore, thus I can’t comment here.
Still, I don’t believe panic buying guns is nessecary, and I do believe gun control ought to be implimented, perhaps you can change my mind?
Moved from other thread. This post isn’t designed to be facecious. I’m trying to figure out the rationale behind the mass purchasing of guns currently present within the USA, why you (or anyone) wouldn’t believe in gun control etc. Why are gun stores essential? Why is booze essential? One can order these commodities online if I’m not mistaken, so why does one need to buy these items in-store.
Major news today. Didn’t want to make a new thread since this fit in here.
The feds got a huge fish. The company making OxyContin is going to pay $8 billion in fines and close the company.
I saw this in the news. Surprised they are closing down though. I am interested to see if there will be criminal charges against the Sacklers. Based on what I have heard on recordings, some of them sound pretty criminal.
I will bet there are, but it will take some time to develop. Regardless, chopping up a company is a big win.
There should be. They could all use a stint in jail.
In a more civilised era, they’d have gotten a short drop with a sudden stop.
If we want to send a message that this type of behavior is going to get you prison then we should.
The audio recordings I have heard (not sure which of the Sacklers it was) revealed a pretty disturbing person who seemed to be morally bankrupt, extremely rich, but still greedy for more at the cost of other lives.
There is a very strong part of me that thinks we should have more of this sort of penalty for depraved indifference to human life and suffering on an industrial scale mixed with greed. No country club prisons here.
Yes, what purdue has done was/is sickening. Opiates are valued medications, and a small minority of people may at times (myself included) legitimately require them in order to live a normal life.
But to aggressively and knowingly market one of the most addictive medications on the planet as “not habit forming”… Absolutely sickening.
It should be noted this is history repeating itself. Morphine used to be OTC in cough remedies, after rampant addiction heroin was synthesised as a non addictive alternative. The difference here is nefarious intent wasn’t present. There was no agenda back then, doctors just didn’t know any better.
8 billion isn’t enough to counterbalance for all the lives lost and/or destroyed through opiate addiction. I do believe purdue has now filed for bankruptcy.
These are the guys that ought to be put away, not the individual suffering from the addiction who has a few tablets of oxycontin on him/her. Those who are addicted like this ought to be referred to treatment facilities.
In my opinion opiates aren’t drugs that should be legalised, the societal detriment induced is too extreme. We have safe injecting sites and government issued opiate replacement prograns for those hopelessly addicted, that’s good enough. A big issue with the safe injection sites however is the quality of the neighborhoods surrounding them.
Used needles, people shooting up on park benches (just shoot up at the god damn site, it’s called a safe injection site for a reason) and amoral degenerates actually pushing drugs at and/or near these places (looking to prey on people). I suppose it’s a lesser of two evils as opposed to just letting people overdose on fentanyl laced gear.
Data released in Aus indicates safe injection sites have had a large impact regarding the reduction overdoses and the transmission of diseases spread by sharing needles. Easy access to services one would require to quit using are also present within these sites.
We have a huge ice problem in Aus, especially rural Australia. Depending on where you live/are, it isn’t all that uncommon to see guys tweaked out on meth in delerious states and/or shooting up methamphetamine in public (hardened addicts do this).
The generalised response to this has been excessive policing/penalisation, but this hasn’t worked at all. It appears around 6% of the Australian population has tried crystal meth, and in rural regions this figure is higher.
Thankfully we never had the opiate epidemic like America did. Though we did have a fairly nasty heroin problem in the 1990s. That being said, purportedly heroin addicts usually kept to themselves, methamphetamine addicts or even casual users on a stimulant binge can be legitimately dangerous to be around.
I don’t agree with this. Public hanging isn’t a civilised form of execution. Esp considering the rope wasn’t always adequate to instantaneously break the offenders neck, and in rare cases not set up to adequately asphyxiate the victim. Lethal injection to me appears to be the only acceptable use of the death penalty.
We don’t want to stoop down to the level of those who commit heinous crimes. Furthermore I don’t believe in the death penalty for the majority of drug related crimes. Whilst the Sacklers may have done a terrible thing, they weren’t involved in the black market trade… At least I don’t think they were.
Multiple consecutive life sentences without the possibility of parole seems adequate. Seizing all assets procured from the sale of oxycontin should be more than enough to pay for said jail time.
Many became addicted (as opposed to dependant) when doctors suddenly pulled scripts, and tightening rules/regulations regarding the prescriptions of opiates after so many people were already hooked pushed a large number of people to look for heroin/painkillers on the streets.
Purdue did a horrible thing, the response to the opiate epidemic (via law and order as opposed to treating it as a health crisis) was also botched and contributed to more death/suffering.
You can arrest the dealers, but you can’t exactly arrest your way out of addiction.
Mass dealers of drugs like fentanyl and heroin are areas law enforcement should legitimately put their time/energy into going after as opposed to one guy/girl with a 10$ crack rock or a couple of pills.
In NSW we have harsh policing over drug use as methamphetamine is so rampant, but despite high incarceration rates for minor drug offences, Australia has one of the highest rates of drug use per capita. This approach isn’t working and like 99.9 percent of the time those getting arrested and/or incarcerated are guys guilty of minor possession (esp in QLD) as opposed to the dealers. Sometimes the possession pertains to relatively harmless substances (in comparison to say … Alcohol) like psilocybin or dare I say even cannabis.
Thankfully NSW has introduced on the spot fines as opposed to court dates. QLD has very conservative laws though, as does my state.
Incorrect. The British had the long hanging down to an ar. A long hanging is almost as surefire as a firing squad. I’d have to look up the declassified stats from the archives, but people didn’t asphyxiate in the U.K. when hanged.
They were profiteers that are indirectly responsible for the street epidemic of opioids, and they used kickbacks to prevent this gravy train from stopping.
I hear this a lot, but south east Asia manages something approximating it. (Not that I condone that for the record, but there are jurisdictions who have arrested enough users to squash demand.)
I can’t really speak to Aus, as I’ve never been, but I can say that London and Dublin ‘policing’ of drugs isn’t anything of the sort.
Not incorrect, there have been cases of botched executions as the result of public hanging. Not withstanding the barbaric nature of public execution.
What is interesting however is that lethal injection have the highest prevalence of “botched executions”, totalling around 7%. For hanging the rate of botched executions totals around 3%.
Lethal injection however is a combination of sedative/depressant drugs. Typically a botched execution should theoretically result in a strung out, semi conscious, stupor like state.
The only “foolproof” way of execution is by firing squad. You are assuming the rope/noose is always adequately set up, this isn’t always the case. When set up properly hanging is highly effective though.
I’ll use some faulty logic here but fast food resteraunts are indirectly responsible for countless deaths induced by cardiovascular disease. Big tobacco is directly responsible for millions of deaths AND big tobacco is furthermore guilty of fraudulent marketing similar to purdue.
Opiates have more of a stigma associated with them, this penalties for the guys marketing opiates should be higher right? Opiates when used responsibly (in a clinical setting) aren’t particuarly dangerous. The Sacklers are indirectly responsibly for the black market trade, this isn’t adequate cause for punishment. They are however directly responsible for fraudulent marketing/high rates of dependence/addiction associated with prescription opiates (doctors are also at fault here, but oxycontin was aggressively marketed as non-addictive).
Not particularly, methamphetamine is still a big problem in the Phillipines and since Duterte was voted in seizures of meth haven’t decreased within the country. Some 20 thousand citizens have been shot dead though, and vigilante killings have become problematic as politicians/innocents are occasionally getting caught up in the mix regardless of drug use.
Prevalence of drug use relates to
Societies like Singapore that harshly stigmatise against drug use absent of government intervention (though they are very strict) tend to have low rates of drug use, though even there drug use is prevalent.
You can’t compare london to say… NSW where you’ve got sniffer dogs on trains, roaming the city streets, on buses etc. Then they’ve got booths to detain and strip search you if a dog sniffs you out. These dogs have been found to be accurate around 20-30% of the time. Furthermore they’ve been illigally strip searching minors, the majority of those stopped and searched coincidentally tend to be aboriginal/indigenous. I’ve been to London, the dynamic isn’t the same at all.
The penalty for minor drug possession in QLD is… Prison. Though state by state/territorial laws differ dramatically. Cannabis is flat out legal in the ACT, and they’re looking at setting up a permenant pill testing station. NSW, VIC and QLD have some pretty conservative laws. In QLD possession of anabolic steroids for reference incurs a prison term of up to 20 years.
As I’ve stated, despite harsh laws drug use is quite rampant here, at least half the guys in my gym were on gear (all states have relatively harsh laws). The vast majority of those using don’t get caught, recreational drug use is typically done in private (either at home or on private property prior to going out) and police could typically care less about weed despite it technically being a criminal offence to use/possess in my state (you’ll probably get off with a warning if it’s only a small amount).
We also have salival testing on roadsides testing for the smallest trace of a substance. If you’re smoked a cannabis cigarette two days ago, you might test positive. The consequence is a police record, a 1000$ fine and loss of license for 6 months. We are the only secular democratic country that does this. As a matter of fact this offence is considered different to “driving under the influence” which incurs a far more severe penalty. It’s prohibition era rhetoric designed to punish a demographic the government doesn’t approve of and/or raise revenue.
You also can’t speed here, you will incur a fine if you go more than 3-5km over the speed limit. In NSW someone recently copped a fine for leaving their car window open… The car was parked in said owners driveway…
I do agree with arresting meth addicts at this point in time. I don’t necessarily say that they have to be charged heavily or something, but they are not safe for people to be around and as such should at least be kept until they come down. Being a danger to others is enough to be taken in in my mind.
Why do you want to hurt Antifa’s recruitment efforts?
Does antifa hand out free meth? SiGn Me Up (kidding, I’d never do something like that)
Obviously, because I am opposed to all that they stand for!
More importantly however, because those orcs have terrible taste in everything and need to grow up
Rare cases. The book of hangings is open to inspection, if I get some time I will post it, it takes some effort to retrieve. Some complications include that it was too effective, one man’s neck was so thin he was decapitated, for example.
Towards the end of the long drop, it was effectively zero.
I’m assuming nothing, the practice was refined by such data. By the 50’s it was extremely effective.
You should recall they had an enormous lawsuit as a result of this.
They ignored their own red flags in pursuit of cash. That, to me, is criminally negligent.
Compared to what? Japan, South Korea, Taiwan and Singapore all have much lower rates than, say, Western Europe. No one is saying zero is possible.
This portion of your post is interesting, I will again plead ignorance, and defer to your experience there, as I have nothing to go on for NSW.