The Stupid Thread 2 (Part 1)

[polo77j]

Nah I gotcha … I think what the issue is is that words do have meanings beyond the veneer, beyond the slogan. I don’t think the issue is with the sentiment … I don’t think there are any racists among us here … and if there are I don’t think being actively anti them is helpful in helping them see the light so to speak … at least here we can engage in meaningful dialogue and arrive at some mutual understanding.

I think the issue is with semantics. Words have meanings and for good reason. Language shouldn’t be used as flippantly and imprecisely as it seems to be. It’s almost as if we’re all operating under different languages and assuming our definition, understanding or interpretation of any given word or phase is there correct one.

For example you said:

@Californiagrown

I get what you’re saying and agree that kind of thinking is bad… I haven’t encountered it IRL

Yet here we are discussing the dissonance amongst seemingly intelligent individuals in this conversation. I see it, Z sees it, 2jar sees it, others see it, but you don’t…

[treco]

@Californiagrown

To me it seems like you are taking a view held by an extreme few and attributing as a problem of a large portion of folks left of center. Or that soon all of the left will be thinking they same way as the small extreme minority.

I’m admittedly VERY skeptical about slippery slope arguments, so maybe that’s why Im skeptical here.

This is more to my thinking, rather than your statement yesterday about FB’s influence.
To me, you are defending ‘free thinker’ exercises like one might discuss in college. Yet we are seeing a widespread push on unsound ideas, using authoritarian tactics.

edit as I read, l see others laid this out in more detail than l did.

[Legalsteel]

@loppar

it’s worth noting that a tame, anodyne letter published in Harper’s Magazine by a bunch of leftist intellectuals warning about the dangers of cancel culture (although they take great pains no to mention it by name) and the importance of free speech is producing a visceral, Stalinist response from the woke crowd.

Chomsky cancelled. Who’d have thought that a tame call to slow up on the witch burning would be what did it?

[Legalsteel]

@Californiagrown

They dont want to be associated with the letter, not because they disagree with its content, but because they found out that other people who were supposed to be enemies, share their same opinions. SMH

Omg, that’s actually hilarious. ‘Please remove my name from this letter because I low key wanted to cancel some of my fellow signatories.’

[zecarlo]

@treco

you are defending ‘free thinker’ exercises like one might discuss in college.

You would think college would be the one place you could talk about almost anything from any position without fear of personal attacks or calls for censoring or even expulsion… it’s not anymore.

[Legalsteel]

@Californiagrown

I just don’t see it being pushed by any significant portion of the left, and I haven’t encountered it IRL in any shape or form.

Significant in size or influence? Because some very influential portions of the left are fully on board with this nonsense. I don’t think the actual public is much on board with it.

@Californiagrown

Or that soon all of the left will be thinking they same way as the small extreme minority.

I wouldn’t say so. The left wing party might, as happened to the U.K. Labour Party, which is why they were absolutely battered in the last election.

@Californiagrown

I’m admittedly VERY skeptical about slippery slope arguments, so maybe that’s why Im skeptical here

While it is important to be sceptical of such arguments, I can only say that the discourse in left wing circles in Britain has gone completely insane, and very quickly too.

[zecarlo]

How many of those calling to cancel him even know who he is or read anything by him? The thing is, his contributions to language studies, among other things, are too significant to actually cancel him.

And as radical as the cancel culture activists think they are, Chomsky is more radical. Orwell said something about how he believed in socialism but hated socialists.

[Legalsteel]

@zecarlo

Orwell said something about how he believed in socialism but hated socialists.

The British Far left is attempting to reframe Orwell as a fascist toady currently. It’s a fascinating bit of auto-cannibalism.

[Legalsteel]

@zecarlo

And as radical as the cancel culture activists think they are, Chomsky is more radical.

That he is. But as he’s a small state socialist, I imagine that the statue smashers wouldn’t have liked him for long anyway.

[zecarlo]

The Road to Wigan Pier might be the book I’m thinking about.

People drawn to socialism for intellectual reasons, the people who prefer to not be around actual working class people who they find simple and brutish (cue Hillary and the deplorables), can’t be real socialists.

The Labour Party abandoned labor is how I have understood it.

[loppar]

Meanwhile on Twitter people are threating and insulting Terry Crews for quoting Nelson Mandela and daring to name black kids killed by gang violence in Chicago.

Terry Crews

On a positive side, Terry seems to be holding his own in this cesspool.

Confirms my previous belief that he’s a fantastic human being all around.

[Legalsteel]

@zecarlo

The Labour Party abandoned labor is how I have understood it.

That’s an apt summation. Their problems were preceded by Corbyn’s takeover, to be honest.

Labour as a party do not share many values with their heartland who, while supporting a welfare state and economic intervention, don’t like Europe and are very socially conservative on things like the family and immigration.

The Tories, being the survivalists that they are, targeted that demographic, Labour didn’t make the attempt and so suffered a spectacular loss.

[Legalsteel]

@loppar

Terry Crews for quoting Nelson Mandela and daring to name black kids killed by gang violence in Chicago.

The monster! How dare he actually mention things harming black lives and quote Mandela!

He’s also anti-porn too, so I’m sure that’s rustled the jimmies of a few of these soypods.

[zecarlo]

@loppar

Terry seems to be holding his own in this cesspool.

Because most people can see how ridiculous his critics are. If Jesus came down and said he believed all lives matter, these same clowns would try and cancel the second coming.

[polo77j]

@zecarlo

these same clowns would try and cancel the second coming

Tbf most if these clowns think they’re atheist (the irony being they worship the Pantheon of social justice)

[punnyguy]

@zecarlo

the second coming

Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.

[Aragorn]

@loppar

On a positive side, Terry seems to be holding his own in this cesspool.

Confirms my previous belief that he’s a fantastic human being all around

In full agreement. I loved his statement about choosing to die on this hill as much as I get furious that he actually needed to justify anything he said to the orcs.

[Aragorn]

Yeats is always appropriate.

[idaho]

DEARBORNE, Mich. — Ford Motor Company’s CEO reaffirmed the automaker will continue making police vehicles in a letter to employees earlier this month. The statement came after an estimated 100 employees asked executives to reconsider building and selling police vehicles in the wake of the George Floyd protests, according to the Detroit Free Press.

In the letter to executives, workers asked the company to “cease development, production, and sale of all custom police vehicles and products," saying that its “resources can and should be diverted to other forms of first response and public safety.”

What does that mean? Fire trucks? Ambulances? Covered wagons?

Ford has long established itself as a trusted automaker for police vehicles and provides about two-thirds of police vehicles in the U.S., according to the Free Press. In its response to employees, the automaker said it would continue providing these vehicles.

In the letter obtained by the Free Press, CEO Jim Hackett said he is both supportive of the Black Lives Matter movement and believes that law enforcement plays a vital role in the safety of society.

Lets see, you supply two -thirds of all police vehicles in the US. So , yes, I support BLM, but, damn, not giving up that market share.

“It’s not controversial that the Ford Police Interceptor helps officers do their job,” wrote CEO Jim Hackett in a letter sent to employees July 1. “The issues plaguing police credibility have nothing to do with the vehicles they’re driving.”

You are going to make a fine politician. Split those hairs. Not man enough to defend the police outright, got to write your letter to your employees, be politically correct and still get your profits.

I suppose issuing a statement that Ford supports the police and if you don’t like that, then just fucking quit. Too harsh, I know for the woke.

[treco]

Society where 100 people out of 200,000 employees can be enough to potentially change business when it is not needed.

I’m surprised CEO didn’t fold myself.