[quote]Professor X wrote:
kroby wrote:
Arbitro wrote:
Ok, let’s say that the thermal effect of food (TEF) for turkey protein is 10%, so let’s say instead I eat another 10% calories over that 2500 (now at 2750) - as someone said, turkey calories vs doughnut calories - am I not going to gain the same amount of weight?
Are you kidding? Are you going to gain weight eating turkey or doughnuts? Are you suggesting that all we have to do is eat doughnuts, lift and sleep to grow muscles? Ah ha! That’s it! You may gain weight, but there’s no way you’ll gain LBM by eating serving after serving of doughnuts. That insinuation is about the most absurd thing I’ve ever read.
Yeah, if you want to gain weight, eat doughnuts. If you want to gain muscle, eat protein rich food - such as turkey, chicken, tuna, yoghurt, cottage cheese… don’t eat doughnuts.
I’m stupefied.
Genetics and overall caloric intake ARE the predominant factors. There are people who make significant gains in muscle mass who are not consuming very much protein at all. Your body BUILDS protein out of available resources. The only ones that it NEEDS are essential amino acids. That means, yes, at its most basic concept, someone could eat doughnuts and gain muscle mass. Is it ideal? No, it isn’t. You need to put things in context and it is truly a shame that this needs to be explained when you have people tossing around much larger words all of the time as if they truly know what they are speaking of.
If someone is trying to gain muscle mass, the first place you look is OVERALL DAILY CALORIC INTAKE, not protein. You won’t gain shit if you don’t eat more than your body needs to maintain body weight. Exceptions to that rule include training stimulus (especially in newbies) who may be able to cause their body to make adaptations to training by gaining muscle while decreasing body fat. This is also not the norm as far as body composition changes but it can happen. I suppose all of this needs to be stated before someone logs on with twice the ability to type than they have at understanding what was written.[/quote]
Are you kidding?
Eat donuts and gain weight wow! Are you one of those “bodybuilders” at my gym who weigh 280 lbs and breath heavily after one set of leg extension?
[quote]Arbitro wrote:
Gunitgansta wrote:
Arbitro wrote:
So… if my diet consists of nothing but turkey & oats, for instance, and my maintenance is 2000 calories/day, and I eat 2500 calories of the turkey & oats… am I not going to gain weight because these are “clean” foods?
Ok, let’s say that the thermal effect of food (TEF) for turkey protein is 10%, so let’s say instead I eat another 10% calories over that 2500 (now at 2750) - as someone said, turkey calories vs doughnut calories - am I not going to gain the same amount of weight?
That was a pretty uneducated post.
Donuts contains high amount of fat and carbohydrates at the same time. Your insulin will be elevated and fat will be stored more readily.
Try read up on the nutrition articles here.
What if I eat the doughnut while I’m hypocaloric? Will I still gain fat more readily if I eat it?
Obviously you are a proponent/believer of Berardi’s food combining stuff. Here’s one for you: did you know that when you eat a P+F meal, it will generally take 2-3 hours for the dietary fat you just ate to reach the fat cells. That’s right about the time you are eating your next P+C meal, which will jack up your insulin. What happens then?
Point being… your total calories (assuming adequate protein & EFAs are present) trumps all, including the magical food combining ‘stuff.’[/quote]
So you mean if I eat the same amount of protein, EFA and calories, getting the rest from peanuts or Oats makes no difference?
Eat donuts and gain weight wow! Are you one of those “bodybuilders” at my gym who weigh 280 lbs and breath heavily after one set of leg extension?[/quote]
No, I am not kidding. The basic concept is understanding weight gain and how your body’s genetic make up has much to do with what is used to for muscle growth and how your body responds to training and increased caloric intake. It is an extreme example that should allow you to understand this. I am not surprised you don’t, however, because you actually wrote that all carbs are bad.
If any fool thinks this is a recommendation to eat doughnuts for mass gains, you show your own level of understanding.
I understand about the daily caloric intake, in that it must be above maintenance levels. But isn’t the quality of that food important? Does a bodybuilder have to follow the Lee Priest BLOB formula for muscle gains?
Sure, he gains muscle and fat. But is that method optimal for overall health? It is my hope that we here can promote a healthy way to reach our goals. I’d prefer to tell a novice to eat right (and alot) than just eat everything. Isn’t that responsible?
Exactly. While I understand that those bodybuilders can use steroids get big, eat crap and royally fuck their bodies up, its not optimal for healthy to bulk with unnatural food.
By unnatural foods I mean transfats, all carbs except vegetables because they greatly elevate insulin, sugar and other other stuff people sell as “food”.
By ultilizing a clean bulk diet, you can a lot of muscle with not much if any fat gain. If you go on a dirty bulk full of fat and carbs together, you will gain a lot of fat.
[quote]kroby wrote:
I understand about the daily caloric intake, in that it must be above maintenance levels. But isn’t the quality of that food important? Does a bodybuilder have to follow the Lee Priest BLOB formula for muscle gains?
Sure, he gains muscle and fat. But is that method optimal for overall health? It is my hope that we here can promote a healthy way to reach our goals. I’d prefer to tell a novice to eat right (and alot) than just eat everything. Isn’t that responsible?[/quote]
Yes, quality of food is important and no one wrote otherwise. The basic concept still needs to be understood. Bodybuilding and “health” don’t always go hand in hand. It is very questionable whether trying to bench press 400lbs is “healthy”. It is no doubt strong and can lead to several other “healthy” things like confidence, strength and pussy, however, is it “healthy” itself? Not really. You need to decide what your goals are. If your goals are to be a granola munching health nut, than be one. If your goals are to be a massively built bodybuilder who is very strong and has the ability to run up 3 or 4 flights of stairs while only being slightly winded, then be one. They don’t always go together and that should be understood as well.
As far as bulking up, every lifter alive will have their personal limits as to what they will allow themselves to do or not do. Lee Priest is one massively built son of a bitch. It is his life. If he wants to get that big in the off season, who gives a shit? I personally wouldn’t take it to that particular extreme, but I would be lying if I said that I didn’t think that gaining some extra body weight helped in gaining more overall lean body mass. It worked for me and that is what I stand by. My limits are not your limits and they should not be. Your limits should also not be Lee Priest’s limits.
As far as telling a newbie to eat right. Newbies also have a hard time understanding “gray areas”. Everything is black or white. Certain foods are either all bad or all good. Hamburgers bad. Fish fats good. It is not that damn simple and getting them to understand this, as you can see, takes a lot of knocking down walls by sometime using extreme imagery.
[quote]Gunitgansta wrote:
Exactly. While I understand that those bodybuilders can use steroids get big, eat crap and royally fuck their bodies up, its not optimal for healthy to bulk with unnatural food.
By unnatural foods I mean transfats, all carbs except vegetables because they greatly elevate insulin, sugar and other other stuff people sell as “food”.
By ultilizing a clean bulk diet, you can a lot of muscle with not much if any fat gain. If you go on a dirty bulk full of fat and carbs together, you will gain a lot of fat.[/quote]
I thought you said carbs were bad. Why are you eating vegetables!?
I cant wait to get my large cheese with ground chuck on it for lunch! Bulking is very fun eating wise! Optimal, nope, not all day every day. But will it add me some extra calories while I’m in class taking a 3 hour test an no break, absolutely!
i wouldnt train to failure everytime im in the gym,take too long to recover
and just to share my opinion about hwo you feel at what you weight,i started at 5’11 150(and i looked nasty)and now im 205-210 at 5’11 and I feel better,my waist has gone…well ive gone from a 32’ to a 42’ but it’s because the pantleg gets to tight not so much because of the waist.That’s just how I feel,so i dont know how you can feel that 190lbs is “extreme”
sorry if this has already been addressed I only read the first page
Are you confusing doughnut calories vs. turkey calories? Turkey calories will not make appreciable fat gains. [/quote] So 200 calories from a donut will make you fat but 2000 extra calories from turkey won’t?
Protein spikes insulin also
Fat is now a mechanism?
[quote]
But you suggest that fat gain goes hand in hand with muscle gain. Perhaps even more fat gain than muscle gain?
[/quote] at a certain point determined by bodyfat levels yes, which is why there should be a stopping point.
[quote]
Or do you mean that people should go down to, say, 5% BF? What for? Are you competing?
[/quote] Where did you pull this number from? Did I give a low point?
[quote]
big69penisman? Haven’t seen you around here before. Maybe you should do a little reading about nutrition.[/quote]
New name, not new to the board. You’re lack of understanding of basic nutrition leads me to believe you should stop living in fantasy land and actually read a real book on nutrition and maybe train a alittle.
Are you kidding? Are you going to gain weight eating turkey or doughnuts?
[/quote] Both.
[quote] Are you suggesting that all we have to do is eat doughnuts, lift and sleep to grow muscles? [/quote] what’s your obsession with donuts?
How is that? Just the act of gaining fat forces your body to gain lbm to support the extra weight.
[quote]
That insinuation is about the most absurd thing I’ve ever read.[/quote]
Yours? Yes it is.
[quote]
Yeah, if you want to gain weight, eat doughnuts. If you want to gain muscle, eat protein rich food - such as turkey, chicken, tuna, yoghurt, cottage cheese… don’t eat doughnuts.[/quote] Blanket statements like this are retarded.
[quote]
I’m stupefied.[/quote]
Because you don’t understand nutrition. That’s ok, there’s help.