[quote]paul bunyan wrote:
Professor x have you ever listened to 2pac, Notorious BIG and NWA. They made rap big and sold milions of records. Their lyrics are so harshly violent. Murders, drug deals and rapes are all lyricized in these songs for teens to buy. (c)rap music is a fucking discrace to us as a species. You compare rap to elvis. You sir are an idiot. [/quote]
Could you name someone who was even releasing records in this decade? Gangster rap was very big in the 90’s. The death of both Tu Pac and Notorious BIG changed much of that. This is the reason much of hip hop has taken a change. To sit there and bring up dead artists is what makes you the idiot.
[quote]Oogie wrote:
NOT ALL RAP IS BAD…I’m not going to go through each song, genre, etc… I listen to rap and listen to Kayne and others…but I don’t live by their words or dress and emulate these people.[/quote]
And who does this aside from teenagers and possibly some from the college crowd? You know, the same people who dress up like ANYONE who is considered cool and make entire wardrobes based off of punk rock bands, goth, and boy bands? But you blame rap for that? Braids are a “statement” now and you believe everyone with braids is making that “statement”?
I also wonder how you know by looking at someone who has rims and has a decent job and who has rims while on wellfare. Most truly poor people can’t afford new 21" rims on their cars.
[quote]JJJJ wrote:
I don’t know why black communities are more violent.
[/quote]
Again, your blaming color on conditions that go way beyond color, namely socioeconomic conditions. You haven’t proven shit.
It “list of white atrocities” proves just about as much as you reaching for trying to “prove” colored communities (namely black) are more violent. Again, your simplifying your argument down to a color of skin and it’s not flying.
I’ve given you statistics. Including the graph showing black on white crime as well. And white on black crime throughout the 20th century is overwhelming compared black on white. You haven’t refuted anything.
That’s what your desperately trying to do. But again, your simplifying an argument based on skin color that has a lot more to do with historical influence of white on black inequality, socioeconomic conditions, etc.
Again, your numbers don’t prove shit. In 2003, 226 whites vs 501 blacks. Well, that proves everything; not. What was the average income level or each murderer, geography of each crime, racial makeup of each are where murders occured, etc. I thought you were talking about black communities vs white communities. Now your comparing individual statistics. So which is it?
Again, attributing a skin color to a problem that is not due to someone’s skin color, but due to socioeconomic condition and upbringing. You have proven nothing.
You think. You think. Sorry, your guessing coupled with statistics isn’t going to fly here.
And this proves what??? Point here?
Sure, also one of the poorest places in the country. But it has to be skin color, doesn’t it?
I’ve spotted no trends that proves blacks are more violent than whites.
No, just a hell of a lot of gang-related shootings. In California, a lot of mexican-related gang shootings. Just not riots. And your point again is what???
Your conclusion is very refutable. It’s a load of crap. You’ve proven nothing. Your rattle off statistics to prove the point you want to prove. It’s an easy game to play. And what is your point of all these posts? Seriously, what is your payoff for this? What’s your motivation? I’m serious, I want to know.
Do you feel better about yourself because you think blacks are more violent or inferior? Because the death happening in NO is a type of ethni cleansing and they deserved it since they’re so violent? Maybe I’m putting some words in your mouth but what is your goal by trying to forward your racially-biased agenda here on this board.
And yes, I’m capable of debate without insult, but not when it comes to intolerable bigots like yourself. My patter is getting old? Your so-called objective analysis on violent black behavior IS OLD because your just throwing around useless statistics to back up your bigoted views. How do ya like them apples?
How can you ignore the fact that 80% of the city evacuated, and that it appears only the poor black and disenfranchised decided to stay behind. Now, this alone was stupid, and then the poor, which happen to be mostly black start looting and shooting at rescue workers? This is also reminiscient of the LA riots.
The man has a point, you really only see poor black neighborhoods rioting, you dont see white trash trailer parks rioting, you dont see large crowds at country fairs burning everything down. Face it, the poor black culture has had well over 100 years to pull it together, and they havent.
Look at all the other minortities and how quickly they have assimiliated and risen economically in the United States. Anyone remember the Chinese railway workers? Bill Cosby is right, blacks in general need to stop blaming everyone else, and look at their own self-fulfilling predicament. Kudos, to those blacks who are commited to education and hard work.
[quote]ArmyAg wrote:
The man has a point, you really only see poor black neighborhoods rioting, you dont see white trash trailer parks rioting, you dont see large crowds at country fairs burning everything down. [/quote]
Excuse me. Hi. Could you point out a trailer park with a population density that equals those left behind in New Orleans? Thanks. Could you also point out the trailer park where most of the occupants pull in less than 17 grand a year, also in a population this large? I appreciate it.
[quote]randman wrote:
Because the death happening in NO is a type of ethni cleansing and they deserved it since they’re so violent? quote]
RANDMAN . . . it’s been an eye-opening experience reading your rantings. You provide us all a prime example of the bullshit that substitutes for race relations in this country. Sure, let’s not debate . . . that might uncover some ugly truths . . . let’s bully, demean and accuse everyone we disagree with of being a racist and a bigot.
I just provided you with the latest 2003 FBI crime stats. It shows that the black minority (13% of the population) commits 49% of the murders in the US. That doesn’t prove my point?
I provided you a comparison of nine predominantly white cities with one predominantly black one and showed you the murders in each. That didn’t prove it to you?
I suggested you go to the FBI crime stats yourself (so that you might learn something) and compare cities with predominantly black populations to those with mostly white populations. You say you see no trend . . . ???
Did you even try? We’re talking about 4-5 hours worth of work . . . I don’t believe you even made an effort.
But, oh yeah, you did provide us with some list from no less an academic powerhouse than the Tuskegee Institute . . . And a shallow analysis of the Detroit riots from Rutgers. Fucking Rutgers??? So . . . Tuskegee and Rutgers. No bias there, huh?
Interestingly, for example, the Rutgers article made little mention of the influence the Communist party had on the riots. How could they have missed that . . . afterall, Rutgers is renowned as a hotbed of socialism and communism.
And they spent several paragraphs on police brutality and black economic deprivation . . . but only a line or two on the influence of black radicals. Yeah . . . those radicals . . . nobody listened to them. No bias in that article, huh?
He’re’s a clue, Sherlock . . . Googling for numbers to back up your argument doesn’t constitute “debate” or “objective evidence.” If you don’t know the material to start with, it usually makes you look silly.
Go study the subject carefully, do some research. Then when you’re ready, come back and talk to me.
Or don’t, I don’t particulalry care since you really don’t appear open to new ideas.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
paul bunyan wrote:
Professor x have you ever listened to 2pac, Notorious BIG and NWA. They made rap big and sold milions of records. Their lyrics are so harshly violent. Murders, drug deals and rapes are all lyricized in these songs for teens to buy. (c)rap music is a fucking discrace to us as a species. You compare rap to elvis. You sir are an idiot.
Could you name someone who was even releasing records in this decade? Gangster rap was very big in the 90’s. The death of both Tu Pac and Notorious BIG changed much of that. This is the reason much of hip hop has taken a change. To sit there and bring up dead artists is what makes you the idiot.
[/quote]
THEY BECAME MORE FAMOUS AFTER THEY DIED!!! YOU ARE THE IDIOT!!!
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Excuse me. Hi. Could you point out a trailer park with a population density that equals those left behind in New Orleans? Thanks. Could you also point out the trailer park where most of the occupants pull in less than 17 grand a year, also in a population this large? I appreciate it. [/quote]
So, let’s see . . . the “historical oppression” argument doesn’t explain why black social groups are more violent . . . the “economic deprivation” argument doesn’t work . . . what the hell, let’s see if the “population density” argument flies.
Let me point out the obvious, like, the population densities and income in Hong Kong, Shanghai, a California migrant labor camp or a predominantly Irish ghetto in New York City. Many ethnic groups earn less and are crammed on top of each other in far greater numbers.
And if the “transient and tourist” card hasn’t been played yet, it soon will be. But of course, that doesn’t explain why Mexican-Americans in San Antonio and Houston don’t go ape-shit every time there’s a flood. Or why Las Vegas, the shit-hole of the western world, has a murder rate half that of New Orleans.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Oogie wrote:
NOT ALL RAP IS BAD…I’m not going to go through each song, genre, etc… I listen to rap and listen to Kayne and others…but I don’t live by their words or dress and emulate these people.
And who does this aside from teenagers and possibly some from the college crowd? You know, the same people who dress up like ANYONE who is considered cool and make entire wardrobes based off of punk rock bands, goth, and boy bands? But you blame rap for that? Braids are a “statement” now and you believe everyone with braids is making that “statement”?
I also wonder how you know by looking at someone who has rims and has a decent job and who has rims while on wellfare. Most truly poor people can’t afford new 21" rims on their cars.
[/quote]
You need to travel beyond the computer and the gym. IF you have, then you need to open your eyes.
If you think only kids are dressing like that, you are so VERY WRONG.
If you believe that poor people aren’t finding a way to get those rims on their cars…you are again wrong.
I welcome you to where I’m at in Mass. You can stay with me for free and I’ll drive you around. From the drivel that you have written, your eyes will pop out of your head. My girlfriend lives next door to a guy that owns nothing except a Jim Brown throwback jersey, rims (total price $15K) on his 1991 Eclipse (has 140K miles) and dish network. He’s part of a group of guys who drive around the city shooting guns at random houses because in his words “WE GANGSTA.”
Come on out and play X…it’s a fun place this America…wow. you’ve been spending too much time at the gym. Probably a good thing…you are so blind to this stuff…you are better off.
[quote]Oogie wrote:
Professor X wrote:
paul bunyan wrote:
Professor x have you ever listened to 2pac, Notorious BIG and NWA. They made rap big and sold milions of records. Their lyrics are so harshly violent. Murders, drug deals and rapes are all lyricized in these songs for teens to buy. (c)rap music is a fucking discrace to us as a species. You compare rap to elvis. You sir are an idiot.
Could you name someone who was even releasing records in this decade? Gangster rap was very big in the 90’s. The death of both Tu Pac and Notorious BIG changed much of that. This is the reason much of hip hop has taken a change. To sit there and bring up dead artists is what makes you the idiot.
THEY BECAME MORE FAMOUS AFTER THEY DIED!!! YOU ARE THE IDIOT!!!
[/quote]
What is your point? Are you saying rap is the same today as it was back in the mid-90’s? If you honestly believe that then yes, you are the idiot. That is like comparing rock today based on Kurt Cobain’s music. If some fool feels the need to point to 10 year old music to talk about the influence of the music on society today, than I blame all serial killers on KISS.
If you believe that poor people aren’t finding a way to get those rims on their cars…you are again wrong.
[/quote]
Obviously, our definitions of “poor” are different. If some woman with three kids in the projects even has a car, it usually won’t have 21" rims on it. They usually just won’t have a car.
[quote]
I welcome you to where I’m at in Mass. You can stay with me for free and I’ll drive you around. From the drivel that you have written, your eyes will pop out of your head. My girlfriend lives next door to a guy that owns nothing except a Jim Brown throwback jersey, rims (total price $15K) on his 1991 Eclipse (has 140K miles) and dish network. He’s part of a group of guys who drive around the city shooting guns at random houses because in his words “WE GANGSTA.”
Come on out and play X…it’s a fun place this America…wow. you’ve been spending too much time at the gym. Probably a good thing…you are so blind to this stuff…you are better off.[/quote]
Your city doesn’t have anything that Houston doesn’t have. The difference is, I don’t blame music for the negatives in society. I don’t think I have ever seen OutKast in throwback jerseys.
[quote]JJJJ wrote:
I just provided you with the latest 2003 FBI crime stats. It shows that the black minority (13% of the population) commits 49% of the murders in the US. That doesn’t prove my point?
[/quote]
No, it doesn’t. Again, your using one factor skin color to “prove” your weak argument when you refuse to acknowledge any of the other factors I’ve mentioned. I’m getting tired of repeating this…but your simply ignoring what’s convenient for you.
Again, your somehow making the jump to a conclusion that “SKIN COLOR” is the reason for this violence. Your just speaking in circles now.
Do I stutter? Simplifying trends down to a color issue. Statistics, damn statistics and lies. Doesn’t prove shit. Your taking one factor, skin color, to make your conclusions. Again, bigoted and false assumptions.
Wow, you really do everything in your power labeling black society violent. What’s your payoff for putting forward this utter racially-biased bullshit on this thread? You still haven’t answered this question.
You just proved my point. Your fucking analysis is just as weak as mine. Trying to use statistics on murder rates to prove that “skin color” and skin color alone is the reason for these violent communities. It makes you look really silly…and bigoted.
Your telling me to go study statistics that will prove your racially-biased views correct? You’ve got your nose so far shoved up your own ass it’s not even funny. Your tyring to come from this pedestal position like your so objective. Trying to use statistics on murder rates and pinning it to one factor: “skin color”. This leap of logic is unfathomable.
[quote]
Or don’t, I don’t particulalry care since you really don’t appear open to new ideas. [/quote]
New ideas, huh? That all men are not created equal? That’s your idea right? That races of people are inferior to others? Some more violent than others? Based on skin color? Tell me, sherlock, what is the genetic makeup of a black person/community that causes them to be violent? Is there a black violent gene? I’ve read your ideas on this thread. And I, among a majority of the others, aren’t buying your racially motivated posts.
[quote]What is your point? Are you saying rap is the same today as it was back in the mid-90’s? If you honestly believe that then yes, you are the idiot. That is like comparing rock today based on Kurt Cobain’s music. If some fool feels the need to point to 10 year old music to talk about the influence of the music on society today, than I blame all serial killers on KISS.
[/quote]
My point is they became more famous after they died…there is glamour in the rap culture to being shot. Fifty Cent has made a mint on that.
The rap game has changed but it’s still mired in the same immoral crap…they’ve just moved to other bullshit like $10k diamonds in their teeth.
[quote]
Obviously, our definitions of “poor” are different. If some woman with three kids in the projects even has a car, it usually won’t have 21" rims on it. They usually just won’t have a car.[/quote]
Yeah. That lady lives upstairs from my girlfriend. She doesn’t have a car, but she has dish network and a diamonds on her teeth. They find a way…because they want to live the lifestyle.
[quote]
Your city doesn’t have anything that Houston doesn’t have. The difference is, I don’t blame music for the negatives in society. I don’t think I have ever seen OutKast in throwback jerseys.[/quote]
OUTKAST??? LOL…jesus man…Outkast isn’t what these people are listening to…LOL! Classic…next you’ll pull out de la soul and the roots…LOL!!!
Try Young Buck, Tony Yayo, Llyod Banks…
I’m not just blaming music…you cornered yourself into this “rap” debate that finds you pissing down your leg…Hoss.
I’m blaming the WHOLE American culture…rap’s just a part of it…Our culture sucks.
Sixty-seven percent of the population of New Orleans is black and so the odds are that the sufferers and the people harmed by this are going to be black – and, by the way, all these areas are wiped out. The non-black population was just as devastated, but apparently they were able to get out, and the black population wasn’t able to get out. Maybe New Orleans has a half decent mass transit people and some of these people don’t need cars.
“But no, Rush, you’re glossing over. They can’t afford cars.”
Well, why is that? Why can’t they afford them? What is it about New Orleans that doesn’t pay? It’s a 67% black population. They have lots of black-run businesses. Why is this they don’t pay well down there?
Houston is an entrepreneurial city. Houston is not a welfare state mentality in its government; New Orleans is. This is not racial. This is not a racial comment. This is ideological. We on this program believe capitalism and entrepreneurism the best way to provide the greatest amount of prosperity for the greatest number of people. The welfare state will never do that. Socialism to one degree or another has failed everywhere it’s been tried. New Orleans has been run by liberal Democrat governments, people, for as long as I can remember, and there’s an entitlement mentality there. You are never going to have a thriving city relying on handouts, or on welfare payments, whatever you want to call them. It’s just not going to happen. Rush Limbaugh, It’s Ideological, Not Racial, September 1, 2005
I’m trying hard to stay away from CAUSE AND EFFECT in this thread . . . but this, in my opinion, is what helps breed the violence in the black community folks.
[quote]snipeout wrote:
To make this a racial issue is retarded, there were something like only 3 reported rapes. [/quote]
That’s because there weren’t any white women there. (rimshot)
Thank you, thank you, good night, don’t forget to tip your fitness instructors. Just Kidding. Sorry.
[quote]randman wrote:
Again, your blaming color on conditions that go way beyond color, namely socioeconomic conditions. You haven’t proven shit.[/quote]
Then the question is, why are black neighborhoods and cities poor? I think the poverty and violence go hand in hand but I don’t believe one is caused almost solely by the other. I think the mentalities that cause one, cause the other too.
[quote]Pretzel Logic wrote:
randman wrote:
Again, your blaming color on conditions that go way beyond color, namely socioeconomic conditions. You haven’t proven shit.
Then the question is, why are black neighborhoods and cities poor? I think the poverty and violence go hand in hand but I don’t believe one is caused almost solely by the other. I think the mentalities that cause one, cause the other too.[/quote]
Why do you falsely believe that all black neighborhoods are poor?
If Orangejello (pronounced Or-ANN-jello) walked into your business, he’s dressed ‘Gangsta’, and he says “Sup?”, would you hire him? Let’s put him right out there to represent the business! My guess is that you’d soon be applying for jobs also.
As for the history of slavery, what are you a professor of? Is it history? There are these things called history books and Google…
Amazing how the libs always play this racial crap on conservatives.
This is a “no-win” scenario…you truly will beat your head against the wall in an attempt to explain that this is not a “color” issue…but a MUCH more complex set of social, economic and yes…historical circumstances that account for poverty and urban violence…
To JJJJ, Ooogie, ArmyAG and all of the more “enlightened”…we get it…because we’ve heard it for years:
We’re more violent.
We’re lazy.
We’re less intelligent (but can REALLY dance and play basketball!)
Rap and Hip-Hop is, and will be, the downfall of all Western Civilization.
Give us a “40”… some Newports…throw in some Fried Chicken, Watermelon and some White Ho’s…and we’re in “Big Dick” Heaven…"
We get it…because we’ve lived with it all our Lives…