Sure it is possible that the old guy was being sarcastic, and if so, it shows a lack of taste IMO. My post was more of a joke strawman TBH.
You should learn that some do change their opinions (I have). Seems a bit rigid to hold the idea that nobody has ever changed opinions.
[quote=“mnben87, post:2666, topic:257948, full:true”]
Agreed. Most recently, discussion on this board made me look further into the BLM organization and see a lot of unsavory (IMO) policies, goals and activities. I’m now passing that along to folks I know, so they are better informed as well.
I keep coming back for more though. It gets particularly interesting when the conversation essentially devolves into a debate about the nature of reality, as this thread often does. We have the video, we have the audio and we can clearly read the words in front of us, yet basic facts can’t be agreed upon.
Did we see a video of a white supremacist shouting white supremacist slogans in support of white supremacy?
Did we see a sarcastic response to a hecker?
This seems obvious to me, but here we are in 2020.
To be honest, this happens more often than not with verbatim audio/video recordings of Trump that are supposedly somehow “unfair”
That’s the thing though. We don’t know it was sarcastic, but even if it was sarcastic (likely) you think yelling “white power, white power” in anger at people of color is ENTIRELY appropriate. That’s fucked up.
What’s more, you also think that the president should not denounce what was said in the video.
Well, obviously no one is allowed to tell me what my personal reality is as an individual. That would be bigoted and we have no place for that in post-modern society.
But, all those who agree with my individual reality can collectively tell them who disagree with it, that they are wrong as a group. It’s the only way forward.
FWIW, I agree with your overall assessment. Except I do think that the administration could have (should have) added more appeasing language to their statement on the matter. That said, as was alluded to earlier, Trump’s ego craves attention over all. All of the “how could he do/say that!” boils down to maintaining the spotlight. As long as you look at it through that lens, his actions never seem as nefarious as made out to be. (That is not an assessment of right or wrong on my part)
There wasn’t a single person of color in the entire video that I saw. It was certainly a white guy yelling racist at him.
The full video I saw showed minorities as part of the protest.
Regardless, I hope you are not condoning his actions, or saying it is ENTIRELY acceptable to yell “white power, white power” in anger at folks.
I think it is completely unacceptable to accuse people of racism because they are Republicans.
Agreed. It’s totally unfair.
Still can’t bring yourself to denounce some old white guy yelling “white power, white power”? That’s just sad.
Why is it so difficult to condemn this?
Here’s the issue - when there is some scandal or controversy, you always want the starting point for Trump to be 1) a context free environment ignoring his previous history and 2) Trump starting with maximum benefit of the doubt. Nope.
The retiree shouting “white power” may have been doing so sarcastically, who knows, who cares - bottom line is Trump tweeted it in the context his entire record (recent and old) of bigoted statements and actions. If it we’re, say, Marco Rubio tweeting it - he gets the benefit of the doubt - everyone is entitled to an oops, and Rubio has no record of supporting such nonsense. Trump? Of course not.
But try y’all do every time he does something - this time, tedious and pedantic parsing of the tone and body language of a shithead in a golf cart shouting “white power”, dissembling, “no, what he really meant was…”…
He said it. Trump retweeted it. Trump’s record as bigot continues to grow. No idea if Trump watched it first, but he doesnt get the benefit of the doubt. Calling him a racist isn’t a slander - it’s a description based on observable evidence, and no amount of cult Newspeak can change that reality.
I think sarcastically responding “Yeah, white power” to some old doofus white guy accusing you of being a racist is a perfectly reasonable response.
No, it isn’t. Its idiotic.
Sarcastic remarks are not in need of condemnation, unless you worship at the Church of Woke.
What? Say it is bad for him to have tweeted that? How about very bad?
It seems to me that I’m being criticized for failing to join in the “Orange Man Bad” hysterics of the day with the same level of vigor and disregard for context that our other posters take part in.
I think it would also be a perfectly reasonable response for the Black cops being called racist by the privileged white suburban kids
Nonsense, and this a predictable dodge, no surprise. There are no hysterics here - it’s criticism of a man who turned the US military against protesters complaining about racial injustice and who notes “very fine people” amongst torch-bearing white supremacists.
All justified, but you retreat into the tired counter of claiming it’s all “Orange Man Bad” emotionalism instead of dealing with the obvious shortcomings of Dear Leader. No one buys that line any more.
We can debate whether golf cart guy was being serious or not - what can no longer be debated is Trump is a a bigot.
Sarcastically yelling “where’s your hood and robe” is unacceptable.
Yelling in anger sarcastically “white power, white power” is perfectly reasonable.
Got it.
You just proved my point for me.
I said the tweet was bad. I clarified that to “very bad” in an entirely separate post.
Yet you still see a need to criticize my thoughts on this topic as insufficiently vitriolic, I guess. Your criticism isn’t exactly clear, but you seem to believe that I was defending Trump’s tweet, despite several posts calling it a bad tweet in plain English.
This is perplexing to me, which is why I reduce the notion to “Orange Man Bad Hysterics”.
They have no idea. The goal posts move, entirely depending on what needs to be said to defend Trump - which is exactly like Trump himself.
^^^THIS^^^. It is quite plausible that one or two of his slip ups were just that. However, when we add all of them up it becomes so unlikely that they were just slip ups.