You are advocating one of the most anti-liberty, anti-Anerican policy moves that can be thought up. Its insane and despicable. It robs ALL of us, not just illegal immigrants, of our rights and our privacy and it not only allows spying on American citizens it MANDATES it–because there is NO WAY you can find out who is illegal except through massive data surveillance and domestic spying. Which violates the rights of American citizens. Which is somethogost definitely NOT allowed.
Unacceptable and scary as fuck. That represents everything in my life that I have fought against both politically and ideologically. If you have to break the rights of Americans–including MY RIGHTS–to solve a problem it is not worth that solution. Once we allow our rights to be broken they will eventually erode to nothing.
You are using a deductive fallacy in an inductive conversation. Slippery slope fallacy is only valid for strict deductive logic. That is not what is happening and indeed it cannot be applied to an inductive argument in the way you have posited
As I pointed out they are already tracked since we can see how much welfare they collect and how much they contribute to taxes. If that’s possible the data is already there.
If the government rounds up one set of criminals(illegals) I should be worried that the government will start rounding up legal immigrants… Don’t buy it.
Pro-state doesn’t equal anti-Liberty. Contrary to conservative orthodoxy (not necessarily Republican), a strong government supporting a mixed economy is essential to a dynamic economy. Often, what’s good for the “state” as some illy define the term is good for its citizens. State power and civil liberty aren’t combatants in a zero-sum game.
I wonder how Raq will feel about Trump once the Odious Orange decides that green card holders are taking too many jobs from fully fledged American citizens. He’ll have to return to the Land of Always Winter to do whatever he does.
Context matters. The US government is so massive that it owns 1/3 the land in the country and has billions of dollars in redistributions while trillions of dollars in debt.
If people are going to keep posting this slippery slope can someone explain the gap here of how Trump’s enforcing of immigration laws will somehow lead to a deportation of people in the US legally?
Do you have any idea how much uncertainty there is in that data? Do you have any idea of the methodology and how many holes are there?
There is no way to deport everybody who is illegal without massive–and ACTIVELY targeted–domestic spying on on American citizens to determine who is “really” illegal and who is not.
There is no excuse to allow domestic spying on American citizens, let alone actively encourage a wider and more invasive scale. None.
You’re kidding right? Look at Europe. The government can “afford” to grow as long as it is not checked. And if you’ve read any bloody history at all you know that it has for ages, and continues to steadily expand in the modern day. And it will continue. That is a weak ass argument–the government can “afford” to get as big as we the citizens let it.
And also, that land should not be owned by the Federal gov’t. The BLM has a shitload of problems, and causes more. The fact that it IS owned does not a) establish in any way an upper bound on gov’t growth or b) establish that it “should” own all of that land.
I definitely went overboard when I mentioned NSA, I guess I was just trying to say technology today is better than it was 70 years ago. But yes you’re right there are definitely limits that should be put on methods to remove illegal invaders.
Setting that aside lets see what can potentially be done:
get rid of illegals in Prison and any of who have been previously processed in the criminal justice system. Ban them for life as well.
E-Verify. If illegals can’t work here legally, many will leave on their own. I think some estimates peg 20% of illegals will self-deport
Visa tracking. Visa overstays will be tracked and when an offender wants a job or any government-issued service (like a license), the offender can get reported to INS.
Removal of all government funded benefits to illegals. If an illegal applies for government funded services they will be instantly marked for deportation. Again many will self-deport once they can no longer live off the government.
If the limit of your scope is that we were speaking solely about leading to a deportation of other legally present demographics in the country…You really are myopic. That is only 1 of a host of issues that SHOULD be readily apparent.
Also, we are not talking about “enforcing immigration laws” by merely doing the job of patrolling the border, deporting the criminals already convicted and in our criminal justice system and such. We are talking about direct and even more invasive domestic spying being not only tolerated but encouraged openly in order to do this–which WILL 100% violate the rights of actual, real American citizens in the process. American rights are not supposed to be violated…period.
No I’m not, all Western countries are ticking time bombs heading for eventual economic collapse. They just keep piling on national debt. That debt eventually has to be paid off, politicians are just buying things for people now to get votes and giving the bill to future generations.
The future of Western countries will be similar to what we are seeing in Venezuela right now. We will probably be too old for use personally to matter.
Putting aside your fundamental misunderstandings of macroeconomic policies, the U.S. is not a future Venezula. I’m not going to hold your hand and walk you through what you should have learned in macro and international economics 101.
And what? The BRIC states will inherit the earth when the west collapses economically? Those states have deep and systemic economic disadvantages, while the United States’ economic advantages have only become more entrenched.
Though I agree that we need to shrink government, I don’t think policy that involves spying on millions of people and building a wall across the southern border will achieve this end. I understand your sentiment, but I can see another DHS/TSA coming out of all of this and the state wields more power than ever.
If we are against big government, lets be against big government even if “our guy” is at the helm.
What do you think about what I wrote above as a method of catching and deporting illegals?
As far as limited government I agree with you that it is the best form of government . Unfortunately with a massive nanny state, illegal migrants have great incentive to come here for free stuff.
So in essence, if we had a limited government a wall wouldn’t be necessary but in the current situation it is the best option
