[quote]super saiyan wrote:<<< I just read some of the stuff Trib has posted on some other threads. Wow. And you say Mormons aren’t Christian. LOL. >>>[/quote]According to the Word of almighty God yes, I say mormons are tragically deceived worshipers of false gods and a false christ. Repent, forsake your idols, turn to the one true and living God and His Christ and live. [quote]super saiyan wrote:<<< And why are you calling us to repentance Trib if you believe that God will choose who He wants and damn who He wants? Aren’t you attempting to thwart the will of God by calling everyone to repentance knowing that not all of us are the “elect?”[/quote]I have been over this… let’s see… 1, 2, 3 … one billion times. If you’re really interested look around some more. I may do it one more time later tonight, just for you, because regardless of what you may think about guys like me, I really do care about guys like you. Like most serious mormons I’ve met you seem a decent likable man. You weigh heavily on me. I don’t handle it well every single time. I assure you I mean you no ill.
[quote]TallBaldDave wrote:<<< Clarification please: What do you DISagree with? Do you think God has stopped giving revelations? Or is it your belief that revelations happen, but they don’t develop or progress our understanding of the truth? [/quote]An honest question to which I will give you an honest answer. “Revelation”, being defined as God’s direct communication man-ward wherein HE reveals truth about Himself and His creation which alone and in it’s entirety governs and dictates the relations between us? Given that definition? There has not been additional revelation since John put his pen down in the last decade of the first century.
I do not have time to elucidate further at the moment.
[/quote]
Don’t concern yourself with these poor Mormon’s, pull up a mirror and take a really, really hard look. That image in that mirror, that’s the problem.
What you say about them is man-made, a-biblical GARBAGE. I have urinated on more truth than this. You think you have truth, but you run away from it every chance you get.
[quote]pat wrote:<<< The only being who has knowledge of saved vs. not saved is God himself. >>>[/quote]And He tells us in His Word VERY clearly that people who believe and practice idolatrous lies are at the moment going to hell. I have no idea who the elect are who will repent and believe. Hence I obey Him and tell everybody His gospel. [quote]pat wrote:To claim knowledge that only God himself has knowledge of is BLASPHEMY!!![/quote]WELL!!! isn’t that terrible? Do blasphemers got to heaven Pat? Only a blasphemer would say they do.
All I can say for certain is that to be Christian you have to have a valid baptism.[/quote]YEAH!!!
Worship whatever god or gods you want, but H2O on the forehead? Dat’s da bomb. Have no fear anyway because you don’t have to be a Christian to be saved. Just do the best you can. God’s a hip n groovy dood. He understands.
[/quote]
Not all Christians are saved.
And, are you really making fun of baptism? Would you do that if Jesus was here, you know the guy that instituted the one baptism for the remission of sins?
[quote]pat wrote:<<< The only being who has knowledge of saved vs. not saved is God himself. >>>[/quote]And He tells us in His Word VERY clearly that people who believe and practice idolatrous lies are at the moment going to hell. I have no idea who the elect are who will repent and believe. Hence I obey Him and tell everybody His gospel. [quote]pat wrote:To claim knowledge that only God himself has knowledge of is BLASPHEMY!!![/quote]WELL!!! isn’t that terrible? Do blasphemers got to heaven Pat? Only a blasphemer would say they do.
[/quote]
So, idolatrous practices? What if they have never heard the Gospel of Jesus Christ?
[quote]Brother Chris wrote:<<< So, idolatrous practices? What if they have never heard the Gospel of Jesus Christ? [/quote]That’s the whole point of missions Chris. Invincible ignorance is one the most reprehensible and humanistic falsehoods ever to be spawned from the wretched mind of man. It is the very definition of theological idolatry to exalt the sinful notions of justice concocted in the filthy heart of man over God’s infallible authority which resides sooner anywhere in the universe other than the Vatican. Protestants who preach it are just as bad as their papist counterparts.
Romans 10:8-17
[quote]8-But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart” (that is, the word of faith that we proclaim); 9-because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10-For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved. 11-For the Scripture says’ “Everyone who believes in him will not be put to shame.” 12-For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, bestowing his riches on all who call on him. 13-For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”
14-How then will they call on him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard? And how are they to hear without someone preaching? 15-And how are they to preach unless they are sent? As it is written, “How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the good news!” 16-But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed what he has heard from us?” 17-So faith comes from hearing, and hearing through the word of Christ. >>>[/quote] Don’t waste my time with some meely mouthed pronouncements from the liars in your church. This false doctrine is one I have zero tolerance for. People who are not fully self aware of the resurrected Christ dwelling in their repentant hearts by faith are damned until they hear, repent and believe. There is NO SUCH THING AS A REDEEMED HUMAN BEING WHO DOES NOT KNOW THEY’RE ONE AND WHY. Invincible ignorance is a lie Chris and Oh how Satan rejoices as he hears this deadly invention of his proclaimed as gospel truth.
[quote]Quick Ben wrote:
I really have to thank you people. I thought I had problems, but the insanity contained herein has brightened my day considerably.
I’ll just say that if my salvation depends upon me understanding and believing the Athanasian Creed, I’ll see you guys in hell.[/quote]Your salvation depends on the sinless life, sacrificial blood and resurrection of Jesus Christ. Creeds are useful, but are only man’s instruments of codifying divine truth. They do actually do a wonderful Job sometimes though as in the case of the Athanasian creed. If you ever do understand the triune nature of God you will be the first man to do so. You won’t be seeing me in hell btw and I most sincerely do hope that nobody sees you there either.
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
filthy heart of man
[/quote]
Lol…wut? Filthy heart of man? Man’s nature is not evil.
Missionary work? I thought Sola Fide is your mantra, you know that which you SAY that Jesus is your Savior and Lord and you’re saved? Where love of your neighbor and God is not necessary, just faith alone. Just SAY Jesus is your savior and lord and nothing else is required to go to Heaven, isn’t that right?
Or is there something else you need TO DO besides SAY that phrase to get to Heaven?
Reread my quote from Romans 12 Chris. Or did you even bother to read it at all becaue your puppet masters have told you what to believe? Where there is no love of one’s neighbor or God, OR progressing sanctification and holiness of life there is NO saving faith. How many times? HOW MANY, do I have to go over the same things with you? Here’s another glorious passage of scripture for you not to read, in a translation your church approves.
Ephesians 2:1-10 [quote]1 And you were dead in the trespasses and sins 2 in which you once walked, following the course of this world, following the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience 3 among whom we all once lived in the passions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the body and the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind. 4 But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, 5 even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ-by grace you have been saved- 6 and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, 7 so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.[/quote] Dead in sin, by nature children of wrath, raised from death to life in Christ, grace trough faith, NOT of works, even our good works were prepared BEFOREHAND by God for us to walk in. Of course none of that makes any difference to you because at the hands of your demonic bishops it all dies the death of a thousand qualifications as the serpent of old just as he deceived Eve leads billions of hearts astray from the simplicity and purity of devotion to Christ. Your church is bar none Satan’s greatest accomplishment and one of which he can at least temporarily be very proud.
[quote]Quick Ben wrote:
I really have to thank you people. I thought I had problems, but the insanity contained herein has brightened my day considerably.
I’ll just say that if my salvation depends upon me understanding and believing the Athanasian Creed, I’ll see you guys in hell.[/quote]Your salvation depends on the sinless life, sacrificial blood and resurrection of Jesus Christ. Creeds are useful, but are only man’s instruments of codifying divine truth. They do actually do a wonderful Job sometimes though as in the case of the Athanasian creed. If you ever do understand the triune nature of God you will be the first man to do so. You won’t be seeing me in hell btw and I most sincerely do hope that nobody sees you there either.
[/quote]
Perhaps I didn’t catch your drift correctly from earlier in the thread(your arguments get convoluted to say the least), but I thought you were saying that misunderstanding the triune nature of God equates to worshiping a false idol.
Pat’s point of view is more along the lines of what I’m used to hearing from Christians.
Besides, if our salvation depends on Jesus alone, and this or that person follows Jesus and prays to the Father through Jesus and lives by his example, how can you say that person has not been saved? Because he thinks God, Jesus, and the Spirit are three separate entities?
I find the notion that God and Satan are locked in some epic struggle for all our souls, and that technicalities and misunderstandings over scripture can tip the scales for a man… well, childish and petty.
I don’t mean to offend or pick a fight, just putting that in here in case it comes off that way.
I do not believe for one second and never will, that an all powerful god, infinitely wise (think about that) would care if we belived in him or not. If that was a big deal to him, we can be certain that he is an asshole. People that demand that kind of worship on Earth are called Dictators and we all know what huge ballbags they are. We know it’s wrong. No god worth their salt would demand that babies get baptised, or that people pray at certain times on certain days, wear certain clothes, eat certain food etc.
This being is a god, the creator of time, energy, all life, by definition it created itself perfectly. It would be SOOOOOOO far above that kind of thinking, would they not!? I would hope so. If they were not, would that not pose some rather worrying questions as to what kind of being this is? What kind of mind they have, the reason for creating life in the first place? Religion was an early attempt to understand the world around us. It’s our nature. There are tribes in jungles who have never and hopefully will never hear of ‘our’ religions. Do they stand a chance with god? By some reasoning here and elsewhere, they are hell bound. If not, why not? If so, it it fair? Because they do not know what to worship, are they exempt?
[quote]pegasus3 wrote:
I do not believe for one second and never will, that an all powerful god, infinitely wise (think about that) would care if we belived in him or not. If that was a big deal to him, we can be certain that he is an asshole. People that demand that kind of worship on Earth are called Dictators and we all know what huge ballbags they are. We know it’s wrong. No god worth their salt would demand that babies get baptised, or that people pray at certain times on certain days, wear certain clothes, eat certain food etc.
This being is a god, the creator of time, energy, all life, by definition it created itself perfectly. It would be SOOOOOOO far above that kind of thinking, would they not!? I would hope so. If they were not, would that not pose some rather worrying questions as to what kind of being this is? What kind of mind they have, the reason for creating life in the first place? Religion was an early attempt to understand the world around us. It’s our nature. There are tribes in jungles who have never and hopefully will never hear of ‘our’ religions. Do they stand a chance with god? By some reasoning here and elsewhere, they are hell bound. If not, why not? If so, it it fair? Because they do not know what to worship, are they exempt?
I find the notion that God and Satan are locked in some epic struggle for all our souls, and that technicalities and misunderstandings over scripture can tip the scales for a man… well, childish and petty.
[/quote]
So therefore it can’t possibly be true, right? You think it’s petty so it can’t be true. I find that childish.
[quote]pat wrote:<<< The only being who has knowledge of saved vs. not saved is God himself. >>>[/quote]And He tells us in His Word VERY clearly that people who believe and practice idolatrous lies are at the moment going to hell. I have no idea who the elect are who will repent and believe. Hence I obey Him and tell everybody His gospel. [quote]pat wrote:To claim knowledge that only God himself has knowledge of is BLASPHEMY!!![/quote]WELL!!! isn’t that terrible? Do blasphemers got to heaven Pat? Only a blasphemer would say they do.
[/quote]
You’re wrong, once again. But since you are to cowardly to address whole posts, I don’t feel the need to tell you why you are on a dangerous, fallacious slippery-slope.
When can grow a pair and face the totality of of my posts let me know, then I will answer your questions…
I will say this, that if you read the gospel in the same way that you deal with conversation, then it’s no wonder you have twisted the truth in to something barely recognizable.
Deal with whole posts, I will deal in kind, don’t be a coward, it’s annoying.
[quote]Brother Chris wrote:<<< So, idolatrous practices? What if they have never heard the Gospel of Jesus Christ? [/quote]That’s the whole point of missions Chris. Invincible ignorance is one the most reprehensible and humanistic falsehoods ever to be spawned from the wretched mind of man. It is the very definition of theological idolatry to exalt the sinful notions of justice concocted in the filthy heart of man over God’s infallible authority which resides sooner anywhere in the universe other than the Vatican. Protestants who preach it are just as bad as their papist counterparts.
Romans 10:8-17
[quote]8-But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart” (that is, the word of faith that we proclaim); 9-because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10-For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved. 11-For the Scripture says’ “Everyone who believes in him will not be put to shame.” 12-For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, bestowing his riches on all who call on him. 13-For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”
14-How then will they call on him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard? And how are they to hear without someone preaching? 15-And how are they to preach unless they are sent? As it is written, “How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the good news!” 16-But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed what he has heard from us?” 17-So faith comes from hearing, and hearing through the word of Christ. >>>[/quote] Don’t waste my time with some meely mouthed pronouncements from the liars in your church. This false doctrine is one I have zero tolerance for. People who are not fully self aware of the resurrected Christ dwelling in their repentant hearts by faith are damned until they hear, repent and believe. There is NO SUCH THING AS A REDEEMED HUMAN BEING WHO DOES NOT KNOW THEY’RE ONE AND WHY. Invincible ignorance is a lie Chris and Oh how Satan rejoices as he hears this deadly invention of his proclaimed as gospel truth.
[/quote]
You really need to get your hands on that mirror.
Redemption isn’t something you know, that’s a lie. You have to fight for it everyday.
You think your saved, by going through some ritual that says you accept the truth and accept Christ in your heart? Nobody here is more afraid of the truth than yourself, you have made that clear. Look for truth and you will find it.
The biggest lie is those who think they know the mind of God. The gospels speak against your bold pronouncements. Don’t be a liar in Christ. God hasn’t said the things you say.
However, it does seem interesting how well you claim to know satan too since you talk about who believes him and belongs to him…Sounds like a close relationship. Damn close considering you condemnations and flat falsehoods…
I pray for you tirib, it breaks my heart to see you scuffle so…
[quote]pegasus3 wrote:
I do not believe for one second and never will, that an all powerful god, infinitely wise (think about that) would care if we belived in him or not. If that was a big deal to him, we can be certain that he is an asshole. People that demand that kind of worship on Earth are called Dictators and we all know what huge ballbags they are. We know it’s wrong. No god worth their salt would demand that babies get baptised, or that people pray at certain times on certain days, wear certain clothes, eat certain food etc.
This being is a god, the creator of time, energy, all life, by definition it created itself perfectly. It would be SOOOOOOO far above that kind of thinking, would they not!? I would hope so. If they were not, would that not pose some rather worrying questions as to what kind of being this is? What kind of mind they have, the reason for creating life in the first place? Religion was an early attempt to understand the world around us. It’s our nature. There are tribes in jungles who have never and hopefully will never hear of ‘our’ religions. Do they stand a chance with god? By some reasoning here and elsewhere, they are hell bound. If not, why not? If so, it it fair? Because they do not know what to worship, are they exempt?
[/quote]
Those are fair questions, I hope you find you answers one day.
I find the notion that God and Satan are locked in some epic struggle for all our souls, and that technicalities and misunderstandings over scripture can tip the scales for a man… well, childish and petty.
[/quote]
So therefore it can’t possibly be true, right? You think it’s petty so it can’t be true. I find that childish.[/quote]
Pettiness is real, no doubt about that. If however the ultimate master of all that is and ever will be is petty, jealous, and vengeful, then we should all regret being born.
Be cast into the fire, or be a sycophant boot licker to a power mad deity for eternity.
One question: If some of you believe that the stakes are really this high. That if you live your life the wrong way you might end up being punished so severely… how do you dare bring children into the world? Your child may not follow your faith. I certainly don’t follow MY parents faith.
That’s quite the roll of the dice there. But I suppose if your child ends up as a murderer, that is also God’s will. And God commanded you to multiply and be fruitful. So yeah nevermind.
Also, Forlife has a point he keeps making and it keeps getting ignored. All of you think you are right and the other guy is wrong. It stands to reason that you cannot ALL be right, and all any of you have to offer is: “this is what I believe.” All based on events that conveniently happened thousands of years ago.
In my opinion your interpretation is correct. This is purely a compliment on your reading comprehension though. I see it saying mankind are angry, disobedient children, and that we are dead in our sinful ways. Nothing new there. So in his love, God sends Jesus to earth and we all get a second chance through him. This is a gift to us, given to every man and woman without judgement on individual merit. Basically, we were put here to do something specific, we disobeyed, and are being given a chance to repent and get our act together.
Do I need to get into what this does to the notion of “free will?”
Given an either/or choice, repent and get with the program, or be cast out… not much freedom there.
And why the whole charade in the first place. If God is all knowing, he knew we would revolt against him.
Wow this brings back memories… if I’m not careful I’ll be back to bugging people with Watchtower pamphlets on sunday mornings with my mother. lol
I find the notion that God and Satan are locked in some epic struggle for all our souls, and that technicalities and misunderstandings over scripture can tip the scales for a man… well, childish and petty.
[/quote]
So therefore it can’t possibly be true, right? You think it’s petty so it can’t be true. I find that childish.[/quote]
Oh, it might be true.
I just do not care to whorship such a being.
If Lucifer rebelled against THAT, I guess hell is probably the better choice overall.