Not really bro science but anecdotal feel good science:
The anabolic window has been thoroughly debunked but it still feels good to get that high protein meal in while still sweaty post workout.
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I agree. The body is one unit. Upper body gets he glory, but I believe the legs, gluteus, and hips are where the size and strength generate from. I read long ago that as you age the legs are your most important aspect. When they start to get affected by reduction in musculature due to sarcopenia, inactivity, etc. is when the whole body begins to breakdown. I will file this under opinion, but as I read in a Weider article/interview, in Muscle and Fitness with Dave Winfield, you cannot shoot a cannon out of a canoe.
No fats immediately post workout is pretty well established, but I find that having a higher fat meal post workout helps control the urge to eat everything in sight later
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This could be its own thread!
I don’t disagree, but I think there are two important bits of context:
- Do they care if their legs grow? I think there’s a lot of folks that don’t.
- Are they athletes? If so, something has to give, and jumping, running, etc. all count towards total volume.
Now you can rightfully disgree with both. For point #1 you can say that the whole body won’t grow unless the legs do, and that’s it’s own separate debate! For point #2, we could go 400 different directions on goals and nuance, etc., but it’s probably moot: in your original example it’s usually recreational lifters asking how to get jacked anyway.
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If I have heard it once, I have heard it a thousand times: “Train legs? I keep my legs in shape running?”
In fact, that is exactly what I did the first two years I lifted weights.
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I was actually going to write something similar. I think most people think working out is this nebulous thing that will get you the body you want when you kick your own ass. So the difference between squats and running isn’t there because its all magic muscle stuff.
Also we need to make men care about their legs. Let’s make fuck muscles the new beach muscles.
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Its always amazed me on here in the past. When you had new guys posting, claimed they dont train legs because their legs grew too easy and would overpower their upperbody.
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I suppose I am the “libertarian” of weight training. I believe you should lift weights however you see best. I might not agree with what you are doing and you might be doing everything wrong for your desired goals, but it’s your choice.
Should I give the person advice from my experience? I have come to be on my guard. “Unsolicited advice is seldom welcome.” If someone asks, then I will gladly tell them.
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Agree 100%. I was trying to say that the nature of the conversation should shift.
There’s this great quote from John Milton about how idolatry is priortizing image over substance. I think that happens a lot in the gym. Which then feeds into surface appeal, not performance appeal.
I dunno, it’s a multi-faceted idea. But to sum it up, front-squats suck ass and I’m going to keep doing them. Because having a teardrop and a sweep when you take your pants off is a pretty good feeling.
Especially with an interested audience.
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I think the issue is seeing this as a bug vs a feature. When wanting to put on muscle, you WANT to have that appetite. It’s why whey is so popular as a post workout food: you can slam a whey shake post workout, get in 40-50g of protein, and still be ready to eat a solid meal an hour later, compared to eating a ribeye and some eggs post workout and not wanting to eat again for a few hours.
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One should be mindful of genetic but not to the point it handicaps them from achievement.
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You must have some grasp of reality. There is more to life than bodybuilding or strength. Don’t sacrifice everything else in life for what is highly unlikely.
Just because you cannot be at the top of the bodybuilding world, doesn’t negate that the reality that you can greatly improve both body composition and strength. (Even beyond your most optimistic expectations. That is what happened to me.)
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Im glad someone knew what i was hinting at.
Great thread. I think some of this boils down to “what works for you might not work for everyone”
Have a few powerlifting related and a few BJJ/Martial Arts related
For powerlifting:
- I think linear periodization is underrated but I think there are a few changes I found helpful:
a. Rather than doing sets of 8-12 the first few weeks doing higher volume but capping the reps at 5-6 per set and doing more sets, perhaps doing other tweaks also like not using a belt or pausing longer on the bench. Most people’s form suffers too much on the higher reps especially on squats and deadlifts
b. Adding a deload week after each phase or every 5th week - Sheiko is a very good “off season” program but I found it sub-par for leading up to a meet since most of the reps are in the 70-80% rep range.
- A good assistance exercise for both squat and deadlift is high bar squats with a pause. Good mornings I think can be helpful if done with a moderate weight/reps but very easy to overdo on the weight and turn into a bizarre quarter squat.
- I did not like heavy “walk-outs” as I thought the risk-to-reward ratio was not good
- I think assistance exercise should be done with moderate weights and reps it is very easy to overdo and end up LARPing as a bodybuilder and have trouble recovering. I remember a video with Ed Coan saying he would cycle all his assistance lifts along with the powerlifts but then again he’s Ed Coan lol
- Lifters should make mobility work and some MODERATE intensity cardio on off days a staple in their routine. MAYBE you are trading off a few pounds on your total (and it’s probably less than you think) but most of us aren’t chasing world records so worth keeping in for long term health.
BJJ/Martial arts - note sort of dabbled in this after doing powerlifting so some might apply to my case but not everyone - came into it with good strength (at least for BJJ at a local level) but terrible cardio and mobility
- I think two lifts worth training heavy are Front Squats and Pull ups (weighted if possible) a third would be the clean and press.
- Core strength from front squats seemed to carry over to “taking a gut punch” more than sit ups for high reps
- Not normally in the “sport specific” school of thought but think that unilateral movements (one-arm push up, one arm row, lunges, etc.) carried over well to BJJ because you often find yourself in positions where you are only able to push from one side.
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Thats exactly how I read it too, cuz I’d pound a whey shake & a banana immediately post work out, then have steak with a side of steak & some wings a few hrs. later.
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I agree. I saw the best progress doing this. Have a shake after/during your workout, then a big meal an hour after. Like steak, potatoes, and broccoli. Or chicken, rice, peas, whatever.
Having the protein is why I liked Surge Recovery and have been meh on Surge Workout Fuel.
I temember a story about some guy in the gym who realized he was working out next to an IFBB pro he recognized. I think they were doing curls in the dumbbell section.
This guy was really proud that he was liting heavier weights than the pro, but then later he realized “Holy shit. He’s twice my size and lifting like that? What don’t I know?”
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#2, Sheiko is too light for meet prep, 70-80% isn’t heavy enough.
I think this is an awesome example of Science vs Bro Science.
Egg heads and lab coat guys say moderate weights are enough, and meat heads in the gym want to lift more!
This is almost universal! From the high school kid who goes to heavy and won,t follow the program all the way to the famously successful Bulgarian weight lifting coach who said to max out every day.
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Vic was huuuuge… ifkyk
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It depends on that template you’re using . The advanced large load has much more heavy work built in.
The intermediate def doesn’t go heavy enough often enough, but I still made good progress doing it
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