The AnimalPak Guy

[quote]RickJames wrote:

You are such a weenie it is laughable. So is ANY passion okay? Can I take it to ANY extent and be okay? Boo fucking hoo, this dude has to eat chicken and go to the gym. Don’t we fucking all? He acts like he is some sort of damn soldier…newsflash, no one is shooting at him, and he’s doing this of his own volition. It is what he WANTS, so sitting there bitching and moaning with his faux superiority is fucking weak.

I lifted with a guy who sold his business, his house, and everything he owned besides his bulldog and his equipment to pursue his dream. He moved into what was essentially a shack to be able to live at his gym to pursue his goal. This man gave up his whole fucking life for his sport and would NEVER whine on to no end like the douche in these ads. Hard core? Please. This shit is just fucking silly.

With all the important shit going on in the world, taking something so trivial as this practice in narcissism we call bodybuilding so fucking seriously means you are quite out of touch with reality. If that is not clear, then I have to question your grasp on reality as well. It is a marketing scheme for christsake. Damn. [/quote]

While your rebuttle has good points, Captain Turbo would so rock your ass, you are lucky he is at such a high level he no longer speaks with the savage tongue nor does he type messages, just think how lucky you are.

Captain Turbo puts his ass on the line, just like the men and women in uniform do every day, he sacrifices so much for that bicep peak and those 13.9999" biceps.

Shut up and lift…or just tell us in long essays of your sacrifices, you choose bitch!

[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:
I most definitely criticized - and belittled - his attitude and his writing.[/quote]

Well, he’s obviously a bodybuilder, so I’d imagine that his writing and participating in the AnimalPak site is what pays his rent and buys his chicken breasts…

The two are not completely independent.

Are you a failed or frustrated writer or something?

[quote]vroom wrote:

Well, he’s obviously a bodybuilder, so I’d imagine that his writing and participating in the AnimalPak site is what pays his rent and buys his chicken breasts…[/quote]

And? So what? What does that have to do the fact that I think the guy is ‘off his rocker’?

Hilarious, Vroom - and nice try. The guy puts his stuff out for public consumption. I would have never read this crap unless directed to it. I said I think the guy is off his rocker, and said so and said why.

Go read TC’s bit on the fictional ‘Meat’ character, posted above. I have done nothing but echo the sentiments of that piece. Are you mad at TC for hurting the feelers of the Animal Pak guy?

[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:
Go read TC’s bit on the fictional ‘Meat’ character, posted above. I have done nothing but echo the sentiments of that piece. Are you mad at TC for hurting the feelers of the Animal Pak guy?[/quote]

I thought you said you were an independent thinker?

Anyway, what does TC’s piece belittle, if you are simply echoing it? Are you suggesting that “Wrath” had a career that he threw away? Perhaps he has a wife, child and related obligations that he has thrown away, in order to spend time in the gym?

Or, perhaps you are judging him for choosing his current path instead of a more mainstream path, involving the wife and family and other obligations? I thought it was very in vogue these days to throw around the idea that some people are not cut out for a standard career path and that it takes all kinds?

Is he not working hard enough to die with the most toys, is that his flaw?

[quote]vroom wrote:

(text)[/quote]

I am once again reminded that you can’t be taken seriously. Vroom, you are living proof of the Law of Diminishing Returns - the more you post, the less there is.

[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:
I am once again reminded that you can’t be taken seriously. Vroom, you are living proof of the Law of Diminishing Returns - the more you post, the less there is.[/quote]

Typical, don’t bother responding to any questions to elucidate your viewpoint… and throw in an insult or two for good measure.

[quote]vroom wrote:
thunderbolt23 wrote:

Typical, don’t bother responding to any questions to elucidate your viewpoint… and throw in an insult or two for good measure.
[/quote]

I’m happy to elucidate my viewpoint - but then, I have spent several pages doing exactly that. Read them, if you are truly interested in what I think - it’s all there. The questions you want answers to are all taken care of if you bother to read my posts.

As for your bizarre suggestion that somehow I am critical of the Animal Pak guy for not indulging in the rat race to die with as many material goods as he can - something I have never even remotely suggested and particularly odd, since I personally don’t even live that way - this is pure fiction from you and a waste of time to respond to.

As I have stated repeatedly, to the point I am tired of hearing myself say it - I don’t criticize Frank’s dedication to training per se, I criticize him for acting as though he is some kind of tragic martyr for deciding to bodybuild. He is not a martyr, nor is he sacrificing for some cause greater than himself. He trains hard for himself, but should can the melodrama - it makes him look flakey and insecure, the opposite of the manly ideal.

It is finished.

Who said anything about worshipping the guy. I just dont understand how you can say you respect his dedication and approach towards lifting and then call him a queen.

You would never read anything unless directed to it? What the fuck is that, you always do what your told? Here is some direction for you, go fuck yourself.

[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:
vroom wrote:

Well, he’s obviously a bodybuilder, so I’d imagine that his writing and participating in the AnimalPak site is what pays his rent and buys his chicken breasts…

And? So what? What does that have to do the fact that I think the guy is ‘off his rocker’?

Are you a failed or frustrated writer or something?

Hilarious, Vroom - and nice try. The guy puts his stuff out for public consumption. I would have never read this crap unless directed to it. I said I think the guy is off his rocker, and said so and said why.

Go read TC’s bit on the fictional ‘Meat’ character, posted above. I have done nothing but echo the sentiments of that piece. Are you mad at TC for hurting the feelers of the Animal Pak guy?[/quote]

[quote]Amsterdam Animal wrote:
Who said anything about worshipping the guy. I just dont understand how you can say you respect his dedication and approach towards lifting and then call him a queen.

You would never read anything unless directed to it? What the fuck is that, you always do what your told? Here is some direction for you, go fuck yourself.

thunderbolt23 wrote:
vroom wrote:

Well, he’s obviously a bodybuilder, so I’d imagine that his writing and participating in the AnimalPak site is what pays his rent and buys his chicken breasts…

And? So what? What does that have to do the fact that I think the guy is ‘off his rocker’?

Are you a failed or frustrated writer or something?

Hilarious, Vroom - and nice try. The guy puts his stuff out for public consumption. I would have never read this crap unless directed to it. I said I think the guy is off his rocker, and said so and said why.

Go read TC’s bit on the fictional ‘Meat’ character, posted above. I have done nothing but echo the sentiments of that piece. Are you mad at TC for hurting the feelers of the Animal Pak guy?

[/quote]

He didn’t call him a queen, he called him a drama queen. Difference.

I think (and I’m not speaking for him, as he has made nothing but good points on this thread) that Thunderbolt is pointing out that while these Animal pak guys might be respected for their dedication to their sport, they express it in overwrought, melodramatic ways.

Their purple, puerile prose and sub-Henry Rollins/Nietschze nonsense do a disservice to people who have dedication, who have commitment, but also have freaking lives.

From the crap they spew on that website, you’d think “Wrath” was doing something important like curing cancer or building homes for poor folks or…or…any-fucking-thing other than lifting heavy shit and eating chicken breasts.

Furthermore, while their logs might be real, I have no doubt whatsoever that some marketing guy wrote the rest of it. It’s a store. They’re trying to sell their vitamins or widgets or whaever.

Knock it off with the strawman argument that “people are intimidated by their determination.” That’s not it: people are amused by their bad writing.

[quote]M.B wrote:
If this guy “meat” isn’t hardcore nobody is.I think it’s “wrath’s” brother
He is an animal he is hardcore.

Atomic Dog
A Heap O’ Inspiration
by TC

My name’s Meat. It used to be Edward Worthington the 3rd, but I changed it to Meat — you know, one of those cool one-word names like my idol, Flex.

You might not know it to look at me, but years ago, I was a loser. I had a wife who worked part-time as a lingerie model, a kid, a big 7-bedroom house in the suburbs, a Jaguar XKE, and a “fulfilling” job organizing relief funds for starving children. Sure, I lifted weights, but I barely got in an hour a day. My body fat was a disgusting 9% and I could barely bench 300 pounds. Go ahead, say it. Loser.

Then one day, while reading Flex magazine and looking over a 15-page tribute to bodybuilder Tommi Thorvildsen’s ass, I realized what a waste my life was and that maybe, just maybe, it wasn’t too late to turn things around.

So I quit my job and devoted my life to the lofty and worthwhile goal of being a stone cold stud with buns, abs, pecs, etc., of steel. I sold my house and got rid of most of my possessions. I even traded in my car for a '72 Oldsmobile and moved into its trunk to save money. It’s not too bad except for when I throw a big dinner party or something and the guests have to sit on the wheel housings.

Anyhow, I started training twice a day for 4 to 6 hours at a time.

Don’t get me wrong, it’s not like I turned into some sort of leech on society or earned money by jumping out of cakes at gay birthday parties or anything. Hell, I’ve got my pride. After I quit my loser job, I was lucky enough to get a managerial position with a local restaurateur. Yep, I was in charge of security at the Denny’s on Main Street. You may not think that a place like that needs a bouncer, but let me tell you, when some a-hole starts complaining about how the eggs in their Grand Slam breakfast are a little runny, you want that bastard ushered out the door, and I mean fast before the big trouble starts.

Anyhow, the hours don’t interfere with my lifting, it’s not too stressful, and besides, I think it does our sport good when the public can see us working in positions of responsibility.

Sure, my wife freaked out after all this, left me, and got custody of the kid, but hey, who needs the aggravation? Shit, they were really selfish, anyhow. Take for instance the time I was doing some one-legged calf raises by our old pool. I was really grindin’ ‘em out, feelin’ the burn, when my wife comes out to show me some of the new lingerie she was going to be modeling. If that wasn’t potentially distracting enough, one of her damn 5-inch heels breaks off and she does a header into the pool.

So she starts with the, “Help me, help me, I’m drowning!” crap. I got really pissed.

“Help me, I’m drownnning,” I mimed. “What about me? What about my needs? Do you really think I’m going to build awesome calves if I have to come running every time you have a problem?”

I threw a lawn chair into the pool, figuring she could balance on it with one foot and keep her head above water until I was done. A couple of sets, later, I dragged her out of the pool but after she regained consciousness she got all attitudinal on me. Bitch.

And then there was that Friday night when my 7-year-old daughter calls me on the phone. The name on her birth certificate is Heather, but fuck that, I call her Nicole in honor of Nicole Bass, the most awesome female bodybuilder who ever lived.

I say, “Nicole, honey, what is it?”

She starts pouting something about her real name being Heather, but I ignore the brat. Then she throws out some crap about me maybe taking her out to the park the next day to kick a soccer ball around. Now Saturday’s normally the day I work on my serratus, so I lose it.

“Listen, whore spawn, while you may think that kicking a goddam soccer ball around the park is some big deal, I’ve got more important things to do! I’m not like some other ‘daddy’ that’s got such shitty serratus that her daughter has to cry herself to sleep at night out of shame!”

That’s when the waterworks start. A couple of seconds later her mother gets on the phone and starts screaming something about being insensitive, self-absorbed, yada yada. I don’t need all that catabolic aggravation, so I hang up on them, whip up a liver and whey shake, open up the trunk a bit so the light comes on and chill out by studying “The Education of a Bodybuilder,” the life story of the Oak.

The whole book’s inspiring as hell, but I especially remember the part where Arnold’s dad died. The Oak was training for the Olympia, so he just couldn’t be bothered with attending the funeral. So when my brother called the other day to say that our grandmother was dying and that I should come say good-bye, I instead went to the gym to train my left soleus muscle, which had been lagging a bit.

Besides, I couldn’t help remembering all the times the old hag had tried to undermine my bodybuilding efforts by serving me Sunday meals that were all fucked up glycemically. I mean, c’mon, sweet potatoes? Home made ice cream? Fuckin’ Jell-O with marshmallows floatin’ around in it? Burn in hell, Nana!

Screw ‘em all. To be a champion, you gotta’ dump all the superfluous stuff like family, girlfriends, friends, pets, jobs, sports, television, sunsets, vacations, hobbies, masturbation, dialysis, etc.

Sure, there have been drawbacks along the way. I kind of miss having dates where the girl and I didn’t take turns shaving each other’s backs, and I’ll admit that I probably overdid it a bit with the steroids. I only say that because my penis fell off during a set of rock-bottom squats and I now wear a wine bottle cork where my dick used to be. Pulling it out and hearing the pee slosh out just isn’t the same, but all I gotta’ do to make me forget all that is look in the mirror and check out the crisp separation between my upper pecs and the anterior delts.

Then there was the time I nabbed a crate of orals from Thailand. I filled up a bunch of Pez dispensers with them, and I was probably popping 200 of them a day. I started feeling a little punky, along with my skin turning the exact shade of yellow as Sesame Street’s Big Bird, so I flew out to see a specialist in Zurich, Switzerland.

He didn’t think there was anything he could do, short of “Removing my liver and burying it underneath Yucca Mountain in Nevada for 10,000 years or so until it cooled off,” so I took some milk thistle and decided to mask the color by going to one of those new style tanning places where you stand on an electrically charged plate and they spray you with tanning solution. I was a little wigged out from just having mainlined 2 grams of D-bol, so I mistakenly walked into an Earl Scheib where they bondo’d the crack in my ass and spray painted me metallic green.

I’ve had troubles with my diet, too, like the time I got really serious about my protein intake. I’d been taking in roughly 20,000 grams a day. That’s one gram of protein per ounce of body weight — fuck that one-gram per pound stuff. Then I’d collect my morning feces in a couple of Hefty bags and take them to the post office to be weighed. Hey, if you’re serious about bodybuilding, you want to make sure that your body is assimilating as much protein as it should. Like if my turds weighed more than, say, a Yugo, I’d know that I needed to take some extra digestive enzymes.

Problem was, after weighing it, the clerk mistakenly slapped some postage on it and over-nighted it to Iraq. I heard later that the Iraqi mistook it for some contraband fissionable material and tried to use it to further their nuclear weapons program, but it obviously failed. So, in a way, I sorta’ did my part for world peace, which I’m kinda’ proud of.

And even though I sometimes get a little lonely and cry so much that I wake up with the car mat all soggy, I wouldn’t trade any of it away. I mean, just look at what I’ve accomplished! Just last month I took third place in the Almost Light Heavyweight division (188 to 188 3/4 pounds) of the Mr. Animal Magnetism Championships held in the lunchroom of the Samuel Gompers Elementary School on the West Side of Akron, Ohio. And next month, next month, they’ll be running my picture in the “Up and Coming” section of the Portuguese edition of Flex.

Yep, I’ve got it all. I’ve got a trophy, got my picture published in a magazine, and I even correspond regularly with famous bodybuilders. For example, I got a letter recently from none other than Ox Ferguson, winner of the NPC States That Resemble Penises Championships. Ox offered me, his “special friend,” a “special one-time offer” of a one-on-one phone consultation for the “special unheard of price of 49 dollars.” And you know he doesn’t just do that for anybody. Fuck no.

Reach for your dreams. Don’t let rational thought stand in your way. Ignore the plaintive wailings of friends, family, and psychiatrists. You too can have it all.

— Meat[/quote]

This is by very very very far the hardest I have laughed at anything on T-Nation.

[quote]harris447 wrote:
He didn’t call him a queen, he called him a drama queen. Difference.

I think (and I’m not speaking for him, as he has made nothing but good points on this thread) that Thunderbolt is pointing out that while these Animal pak guys might be respected for their dedication to their sport, they express it in overwrought, melodramatic ways.

Their purple, puerile prose and sub-Henry Rollins/Nietschze nonsense do a disservice to people who have dedication, who have commitment, but also have freaking lives.

From the crap they spew on that website, you’d think “Wrath” was doing something important like curing cancer or building homes for poor folks or…or…any-fucking-thing other than lifting heavy shit and eating chicken breasts.

Furthermore, while their logs might be real, I have no doubt whatsoever that some marketing guy wrote the rest of it. It’s a store. They’re trying to sell their vitamins or widgets or whaever.

Knock it off with the strawman argument that “people are intimidated by their determination.” That’s not it: people are amused by their bad writing.[/quote]

I am now wishing the link to that site hadn’t been posted and I now see why I avoided it until now. When someone is trying hard to sell supplements, the drama comes across like the extra pages in a MuscleFleck ad.

I think where the lines are being crossed is the fact that there is a lot of dedication needed to train hard for years and actually make enough progress to stand out from everyone else in a crowd.

Is it heart surgery? No, and society doesn’t exactly even respect it outside of sports. You have guys who will freak over Greg Jones for his size and strength, but then turn around and throw jokes at the guy who lifts hard and jumps on stage. I personally stand neutral on the competition angle because one hand, the people I know who do compete seem to have balance in their lives.

They are serious and focused…and also have careers or real jobs. On the other hand, I know that I place little actual value in actually jumping on stage because there are some yahoos who look like crap and have no muscle mass at all who think they are the shit simply because they competed.

I agree, overhyped ad driven writing meant to sell an image. I don’t agree that some seem to think any guy who participates has this mentality. Does everyone even realize that the goal of those “journals”…is probably exactly what happened in this thread?

No publicity is bad publicity?

[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:
I’m happy to elucidate my viewpoint - but then, I have spent several pages doing exactly that. Read them, if you are truly interested in what I think - it’s all there. The questions you want answers to are all taken care of if you bother to read my posts.[/quote]

Forgive me for being confused. You referred to the article about Meat and I didn’t see the relevance.

That is where the questions came from… as it seemed to suggest one shouldn’t abdicate lifes responsibilities more than anything else.

There is no need to berate me because I don’t immediately understand your viewpoint after throwing such a curve.

[quote]harris447 wrote:
That’s not it: people are amused by their bad writing.[/quote]

If that’s all that is being argued about on this thread, then there is really no need for argument… as fun as it is.

[quote]vroom wrote:
harris447 wrote:
That’s not it: people are amused by their bad writing.

If that’s all that is being argued about on this thread, then there is really no need for argument… as fun as it is.[/quote]

That isn’t all that was being argued.

[quote]harris447 wrote:

He didn’t call him a queen, he called him a drama queen. Difference.

I think (and I’m not speaking for him, as he has made nothing but good points on this thread) that Thunderbolt is pointing out that while these Animal pak guys might be respected for their dedication to their sport, they express it in overwrought, melodramatic ways.

Their purple, puerile prose and sub-Henry Rollins/Nietschze nonsense do a disservice to people who have dedication, who have commitment, but also have freaking lives.

From the crap they spew on that website, you’d think “Wrath” was doing something important like curing cancer or building homes for poor folks or…or…any-fucking-thing other than lifting heavy shit and eating chicken breasts.

Furthermore, while their logs might be real, I have no doubt whatsoever that some marketing guy wrote the rest of it. It’s a store. They’re trying to sell their vitamins or widgets or whaever.

Knock it off with the strawman argument that “people are intimidated by their determination.” That’s not it: people are amused by their bad writing.[/quote]

Harris, very well said and exactly right.

[quote]Amsterdam Animal wrote:

You would never read anything unless directed to it? What the fuck is that, you always do what your told? Here is some direction for you, go fuck yourself. [/quote]

Hey genius, read what I wrote (highlighted for your convenience):

Now how does a person like you go from reading ‘this crap’ to ‘never reading anything without directions from someone else’? Do tell.

I read ‘this crap’ because the OP directed my (all of our) attention to it and asked for comments. Ordinarily, I wouldn’t be reading the Animal Pak website - so, out of curiosity, I decided to float over and see what the OP was talking about.

No more, no less. Do a better job of reading next time and save us the trouble.

[quote]Amsterdam Animal wrote:
You got me, I am an emotional person, what the fuck can I tell you.

I take this very serious unlike some people on this site and when I see people talking shit about someone giving their all to achieve a goal, it strikes a nerve with me. Call it pride, call it respect for a fellow lifter, call it whatever you want. Saying someone is insecure because they are trying to get their max out of their body is absurd to me as well.

I think this is whats wrong with this iron game and country and general, too many people are too busy shitting on other people’s achievements and approach to life instead of worrying about their own crap. And you are right most people would not talk to me like that to my face or to Frank’s for that matter. I rather have someone come up to me and call me completely full of shit than talk about me behind my back. At least you can look me in my eyes and show some fucking respect.

SirPhisticated wrote:
Amsterdam Animal wrote:
This thread has been infiltrated and officially gone to shit. Nominal prospect, Napoleon and SirPhisticated have all thaught us a lesson here. I know realize that it was insecurity and a need for friends that led me to gain 80 some pounds of muscle mass. WTF was I thinking? Dumb asses.

Look, I think it is one thing if you dont agree with the guy’s training philosophies etc. but you dont have to read his journal. To call him a queen though is quite sad. You guys talk about tough guys dont have to act tough and act like they are big etc. and I agree with that 100%.

So what the fuck does that make you shmucks calling someone names from behind a keyboard. True internet warriors. I guess I was raised differently than you boys. Dont say anything about someone you are not willing to say to his face.

Stop the whole you guys thing. I am only responsible for what I have written and I haven’t called any names or shown any disrespect. Unless you think questioning a post or journal is disrespectful. You however are calling me a schmuck and an internet warrior.

And you’re right I wouldn’t say this to your face because based on your reaction you would be the kind of guy who would feel the need to start a fight instead of using your brain and mouth.

You do seem to take a public discussion very emotional considering you’re a self declared hardcore man.

[/quote]

I’m with you.

I have a question for those who seem to think that dedication to stregth sports is absurd ~ Do you think that a lack of self worth, a lack of confidence, a person who is insecure could put 400lbs in their back and squat it? Someone can go to the gym everyday and where even in most gyms people look at you like a freak because you use big weights? I’ve been in the middle east for almost a year now as a civilian. I was first stationed at a Marine base, for the first two months I got stared down by every Marine in that gym, no one talked to me, stood in my way purposfully etc. I’m not complaining, but do you think that an insecure person could handle that? When I was in the States I lifted in a YMCA and caught a ton of shit for deadlifting, clean and jerking, snatching etc. You could literally see hate in peoples eyes. Why? Was I rude? No as courteous as I could be. Does it get old? Yes. Do I think T-Nation should be a place a guy like me should have to defend himself at? Hell no. We should be like minded. If you are not then why are you here? I don’t even understand why some of you guys come here. To pick fights on the internet with guys who stand for what this site is supposed to stand for? That makes no sense. Truely there are other sites out there that would probably fit better. What happened to real men? Men that spit, piss on a tree, could defend himself if it came down to it with out sueing each other? Men who are courteous to everyone until they come accross some asshole that needs to show some respect. I sometimes feel that I was born too late, but you know what? I’m glad I’m born in an age of weak bodied, weak minded people. Know why? I want to be a difference and even if I’m not I’m different and my kids will be different. This is a long rant so I’ll end now.

[quote]mdragon’s post
[/quote]

Good post. I honestly don’t get what the big deal is either. There is this much debate because they think the writing is “bad”? Shit, you can find much worse in the daily newspaper, but I don’t hear too many people complaining to this degree. Anyone who has put a lot of time and effort into bodybuilding knows that it takes more drive than most will ever be able to put together. How many people out of thousands can actually state they have trained CONSISTANTLY for over 5 years without extended time off? How does it make me “insecure” because I can state that I have?

[quote]harris447 wrote:
TDog305 wrote:
thunderbolt23 wrote:
At first I ignored this, then I decided to go have a look at this site, blog, etc.

What a melodramatic piece of trash. It reads like an insecure teenager’s diary and really, really bad poetry.

And who gives himself a code name of ‘Wrath’ when all he does is lift and stare at himself in a mirror? This is beyond parody.

I admire harcore lifting, training, and living - but the true tough guys don’t have to talk about it like this.

And as far as ‘getting it’, I get it - I just think you actually make yourself look weaker by acting like a narcisstic drama queen about your desire to have big muscles. Lift big, eat big, and be manly enough to be stoic about it.

Really? Because I would put some of the prose from Machine and Wrath in the same category as Dylan Thomas and Hemmingway.

Honestly, its not meant to be a literary masterpiece, it is meant to motivate you. If you are above it, so be it, but countless others find it inspirational.

I’m assuming you haven’t actually read Hemingway or Dylan Thomas if you can equate this babble to their writing.
[/quote]

Actually, that was a little known piece of literary prowess known as sarcasm.

[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:
What is pompous? Making an argument you don’t agree with? You’ll have to do better than that. [/quote]

Apparently I will not have to look far to do so. Please see below.

[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:
vroom wrote:

(text)

I am once again reminded that you can’t be taken seriously. Vroom, you are living proof of the Law of Diminishing Returns - the more you post, the less there is.

[/quote]