Come on, you gave him the referral suggestion, that’s on you. Of course, he can decide what to do with it. Re-read my previous post, #78.
By the way, there is a saying in medicine which you may appreciate. It goes like this:
If you think you are healthy, you haven’t had enough tests.
Do you think $8k in tests will not include iron, ferritin, TIBC, transferrin, saturation testing?
came here randomly and somehow read through all this…and daaamn wtf is going on here lmao
This can sum up this whole thread. Thank you
I would try lose dose arimidex first. See if you can lower your E2, which should increase FT a bit.
To reduce estrogen, cruciferous veggies. DIM. Low dose ai. Zinc.
May wanna look up boron as it could help you as well.
Jumping on TRT isn’t needed here.
Why? Bc he’s telling you what you want to hear?
The rest on here are telling you what you need to hear.
You’re not funny you know. Did @Newbie1 get 8K testing done? If @Newbie1 had gone to Defy Medical, this thread would not have gone in this direction.
No, he actually got $6,000 in testing.
I’m more impressed his insurance covered as much as it did frankly. I know mine wouldn’t have.
This course of action can lead to a train wreck and is terrible advice. The little Free T that @Newbie1 has floating around in his bloodstream, should this crash or knock estrogen low, recovery could take longer than usual since most of our E2 comes from the conversion of testosterone or more to the point Free T, which is already rock bottom.
This comes with too much risk!
If @Newbie1 isn’t interested in TRT at this time, the best course of action would be to improve his diet, because everyone’s ideal diet is different due to genetics and start working out if not already.
Little FT? He’s not exactly low dude. He’s low average. Taking an ai would likely free up some test to convert to FT as opposed to being aromatized. Low dose ai is the key to start with here.
Stop cramming TRT down his throat. You say I give bad advice… but yours would likely be seen as malpractice by most medical professionals. He’s not out of range for ANYTHING.
Usually I agree with most everything you say. But here, I cannot. You’re giving bad advice. Advice that should only be given as a LAST resort.
And i also didn’t see your usually “where are the thyroid” tests at. . as that could very well explain lack of energy/being tired.
Everyone’s normal range is different, that’s why we have such a broad normal range. Unless you know this guys gene CAG repeat lengths, you don’t know if this Free T level is normal for him.
For a guy who is naturally at the top end or higher for Free T, low normal for him can be midrange and someone that’s normal at midrange, low normal for him is low. Gene CAG repeats play at part in androgen sensitivity at the receptor level, which differs in men, and if you can assimilate this information and continue to ignore medical literature and medical science, you shouldn’t be dishing out advice period!
So to say this guy isn’t low, that’s a bit premature without knowing other factors, such as genetics, AR gene CAG repeat lengths.
Your comments of late makes me wonder how deep you dive into these forums, reading medical literature, taking it in, because your posts indicated you don’t spend much time at all assimilating the available information on these forums.
However, some experts advocate for treatment in clearly symptomatic men regardless of serum testosterone levels, including those with levels > 350 ng dl−1.77Within this group, experts attribute benefit of treatment to modulation of the androgen receptor, mediated by genetic polymorphisms in exon one of the androgen receptor gene in the form of increased cysteine adenosine guanine (CAG) repeats. Certain data have shown increased CAG repeats are associated with decreased sensitivity in the receptor to testosterone and manifestation of TD symptoms despite “normal” serum testosterone levels.
You’re showing our members you can’t even comprehend anything. I posted this in a prior post and you still fail to take it in.
Those are all, quite literally, in range.
Sure, they could be optimized, but that was never the ask here. And yes, the range is bullshit for most of these things, but harmonized ranges and effective treatment ranges have not yet been implemented. As such, he still is “in range” by every metric, except Iron apparently.
Look at the pot calling the kettle “black”. You hitched your horse to the wrong rail and now you’ve dedicated yourself to a bad position, as everyone in this thread has said.
I read your post, and though you’re poking holes in the current reference ranges - that does not disprove those reference ranges at all.
Most here have gotten to the point of realizing TT is a near-useless metric and that a better metric to go by would be fT, but the folks who literally comprise the endocrine society have not yet adopted such practices. Until they do - the reference ranges are the yardstick to which we must measure.
For the fact the experts are saying to offer TRT to those 350> with signs and symptoms of TD should tell you the yardstick is broken and you can’t continue using a broken yardstick for measurement.
Agree wholeheartedly, but that doesn’t mean we can make up new units of measurement and do whatever the hell we want in lieu of proper guidance.
I hope not. This isn’t funny. Hey, we agree!
Again, do you think there were any iron tests ordered in those 19 vials? For ~$6k? I bet your guy ordered it. Fatigue, he’s tired. Rule out anemia. Any doctor would do that, especially one who is “stellar”.
Wait, maybe not, as you, in your infinite wisdom, already took an “iron problem” out of the differential.
We have a winner! Readalot wins smartest guy in the thread.
I’m a plant
Whaaaaat? Did you just leave t-nation?
Most appropriate thread heading I could find to post this.
Just got labs back. What do you guys make of this?
Been on 175mg Test/wk pinned daily, shallow IM, no AI, for 8 weeks now. Feel like shit all the time (tired, moody, hopeless, zero motivation, zero gym aggression, sore joints. Labs look relatively good. Total T is 1268, calculated free T is 35.2, E2 is 41.6. Wondering WTF? I should feel pretty damn good with these numbers.
