22, 23 in June
~230lbs
~14-15%bf
Bench (raw) 390
Squat (raw) 500+
Deadlift (raw) 600+
2nd cycle, first was Test E 500mg/wk for 10 weeks, ran PCT of Nolva 2 weeks after. Front loaded the cycle with a large first Test E injection (maybe 750?) then ran Dbol for the final 4 weeks until just before PCT. I had no sides except I did get maybe 3 really deep ingrown hairs or zits on my left Glute Medius from the elastic band on my compression shorts that I had worn all day. Did well on the cycle, gained some good weight but ended up losing a lot due to high stress of moving states and poor acclimation here.
I’ve begun really focusing on strongman/raw powerlifting but am still interested in leaning up a bit, not really cutting but staying aesthetically pleasing.
1-10 Test Prop 75-100mgED
1-8 Tren Acetate 50mgED
3-10 HCG 250IU 2x weekly
AI: Aromasin start 12.5mgED possibly going to 25mgED depending on need.
B6: I think I read 200mgED is not toxic and may help keep prolactin in check, I know it will not prevent it.
Pramipexole on hand for possible prolactin induced gyno. Take .25mgED when symptoms arise until they are gone, correct?
I have read that it is more effective, or at least has less potential side effect, if you run low Test with high Tren. Honestly, I don’t really want to do that, I really just want to see if I’ll react poorly to Tren before I kick it up high and drop down the Test.
Any input about the cycle would be great!
I’m pretty sure I can just draw both the test and the tren into the same syringe correct? It would go something like this?:
Swap both vials
Draw air into the syringe and put amount of air equal to that of desired CC into both vials
Draw desired CC from Test vial then (without switching needles) draw the desired CC from the tren vial.
Switch needles after drawing in air to hopefully clear any good stuff that has been left in the needle (.13ml I believe)
My personal experience this is true. I have ran up to 150mg/day of TA with Dianabol instead of Test on a 2-weeker without significant negative side effects. Once I get Test in there, even with much lower doses of Tren (such as 75/day) really give me issues. The problem is that, for me at least, Tren doesn’t pack the mass on nearly as much as Test does. What it does provide is an awesome recomping effect and a very “hard” look to the muscles.
They say once you run Tren you will include it in all your cycles. But, I’m pretty sure if I ever go for another “all out bulk” cycle again, I might just ditch the Tren altogether (or at least dose it really low) to avoid the harsh sides so I can run high Test. Maybe stack some Masteron, Turinabol, or Anavar to get a similar “hardening” effect without the harsh sides. Just throwing that out there since it sounds like your goals might be in this ballpark. You might get lucky and not even have harsh sides with Tren regardless of your Test dose.
EDIT:
Yes, you can draw the Test and Tren into the same vial. Some people even thinks it helps dull the pain from Prop when mixing it with another compound. Hasn’t really helped me, though, Prop always hurts no matter what.
As for cortisol control, there are a few OTC products out there that many people swear by. Lean Xtreme, LeanFX, X-Lean, and Suppress-C are some that come to mind.
My primary goal is strength for strongman. That being said, I 1) need to stay within the 231 weight rage to keep competing as a light weight, so I don’t want to bulk huge (in weight). Aesthetics are important to me, however I’m by no means a bodybuilder. I will be trying to lean out a bit simply by eating cleaner and pushing the anaerobic cardio.
Goal: Get stronger for strongman competition and stay within the 231 dieting zone.
Talked to my buddy/dealer and we think it would be best for my wallet to do:
** = changes
**1-10 Test Ethanate 600mg/wk so 300mgE3D?
**1-2 Test Prop 500mg/wk
**1-8 Tren Acetate 350mg/wk (Shoot 50mg ED) (total of 2800mg in cycle)
OR
**1-10 Tren Acetate 300mg/wk (Shoot 50mgED but Sunday) (total of 3000mg in cycle)
[I’m not sure why most people end Tren A 2 weeks prior than Test…so 4 weeks before PCT. Wouldn’t having such a short halflife allow you to stop shooting CLOSER to PCT? Someone please clear this up if you can]
NO CHANGE:
3-10 HCG 250IU 2x weekly
AI: Aromasin start 12.5mgED possibly going to 25mgED depending on need.
B6: I think I read 200mgED is not toxic and may help keep prolactin in check, I know it will not prevent it.
Pramipexole on hand for possible prolactin induced gyno. Take .25mgED when symptoms arise until they are gone, correct?
If you want strength, many people consider Tren to be king in that department. Especially if you want to lean out and/or improve your strength to weight ratio. If it were me in that situation, I’d opt for the high dose Tren, 700mg/week range and either low-dose Test or Dinabol. I imagine it will be tough to stay under the weight you want running that much Test as you only have 1 pound of breathing room. Few compounds out there have the reputation for accelerating body recomposition like Tren. It’s common for people running Tren to hover around the same overall weight while reducing body fat.
I understand this type of cycle would be problematic for many considering the price of Tren and the scary reputation Tren has for sides. But, that’s just my opinion, which really barely means jack shit compared to many folks at this forum.
Either way, the cycle you laid out looks like it will give you great results so long as the sides remain tolerable. While running Test relatively high might increase the sides from Tren, I also suspect it substantially increases the positive gains.
Maybe the reason why people stop the Tren early is because they don’t feel comfortable running it that long. Couldn’t tell you from personal experience as I’ve only used it in 2-weekers. But yes, you are correct, the half-life is very short. I’m pretty sure Bill Roberts suggests using 1 day as the half-life when estimating blood levels.
[quote]jMill2 wrote:
If you want strength, many people consider Tren to be king in that department. Especially if you want to lean out and/or improve your strength to weight ratio. If it were me in that situation, I’d opt for the high dose Tren, 700mg/week range and either low-dose Test or Dinabol. In understand this type of cycle would be problematic for many considering the price of Tren and the scary reputation Tren has for sides. But, that’s just my opinion, which really barely means jack shit compared to many folks at this forum.
Either way, the cycle you laid out looks like it will give you great results so long as the sides remain tolerable. While running Test relatively high might increase the sides from Tren, I also suspect it substantially increases the positive gains.
Maybe the reason why people stop the Tren early is because they don’t feel comfortable running it that long. Couldn’t tell you from personal experience as I’ve only used it in 2-weekers. But yes, you are correct, the half-life is very short. I’m pretty sure Bill Roberts suggests using 1 day as the half-life when estimating blood levels.[/quote]
X2
600mgs of test is alot for somebody who doesn’t want to gain any weight. Why not just ~200mgs, a TRT dose, and then tren or masteron. Less weight, lean out, get stronger.
Maybe I should have been more clear with my description of trying to keep my weight low. It isn’t uncommon for guys at 240-245 to cut 15lbs of water and weigh in at 231 the day before the show then bloat back up. I guess that is what I meant by “231 dieting zone”. I don’t expect to gain more than 15 lbs on this cycle, and if I do I’ll just diet off some fat, I have my fair share to lose :-p.
jMill2: I had actually thought about running the high Tren low Test…but I didn’t want to fork out that extra cash for the Tren :-. I didn’t have any issues running test last time, hopefully I will not have any issues again. I will be keeping a close eye for tren sides…if I get any that I can’t handle…which I guess would just be bad acne or gyno that I can’t take care of, I’ll just drop the tren for a bit and come back in for a lower dose. Who can really tell at the moment, but I did think about everything you said.
Karl Marx: Pretty sure I cleared up the weight issue in this post :-p.
Would you guys run the tren for 6 weeks or 8 weeks as I’ve outlined above?
My personal experience this is true. I have ran up to 150mg/day of TA with Dianabol instead of Test on a 2-weeker without significant negative side effects. Once I get Test in there, even with much lower doses of Tren (such as 75/day) really give me issues. The problem is that, for me at least, Tren doesn’t pack the mass on nearly as much as Test does. What it does provide is an awesome recomping effect and a very “hard” look to the muscles.
They say once you run Tren you will include it in all your cycles. But, I’m pretty sure if I ever go for another “all out bulk” cycle again, I might just ditch the Tren altogether (or at least dose it really low) to avoid the harsh sides so I can run high Test. Maybe stack some Masteron, Turinabol, or Anavar to get a similar “hardening” effect without the harsh sides. Just throwing that out there since it sounds like your goals might be in this ballpark. You might get lucky and not even have harsh sides with Tren regardless of your Test dose.
EDIT:
Yes, you can draw the Test and Tren into the same vial. Some people even thinks it helps dull the pain from Prop when mixing it with another compound. Hasn’t really helped me, though, Prop always hurts no matter what.
As for cortisol control, there are a few OTC products out there that many people swear by. Lean Xtreme, LeanFX, X-Lean, and Suppress-C are some that come to mind.[/quote]
jMill,
Which sides specifically are more pronounced when you run the test?
When I used Dianabol instead of Test I don’t experience those sides either. The first and last I mentioned are actually the opposite, even when Tren is at 150mg/day.
[quote]LR wrote:
jMill, at risk of sounding obvious and arbitrary, it might be worthwhile to experiment running all three?
[/quote]
Yes, it would be, and I might try that. It seems as though it doesn’t take a lot of Dianabol to “neutralize” the sides from Tren. On my last 2-weeker I ran Tren, Anavar, and only around 15mg/day of Dianabol and still felt good.