Surprising Bloodwork, 16 Days on HCG Monotherapy

Pharma / TRT Testosterone Replacement
1

Hello all,

Since I`m essentially my own doctor, but a lousy one at that, I could really need some input here.

My first post is here, so this is a follow up on that: Should I Try TRT? Bottom Range Levels - Testosterone Replacement - Forums - T Nation

I just got back from the doctor with a receipt on Nebido. I also got the bloodwork from the 18th of May, 16 days after the first shot of HCG. 500 IU, Monday, Wednesday, Friday. To my surprise, testosterone had increased substantially, but my doctor did not seem to think much of it and just handed over the prescription. Weird.

At the end of last week prior to blood work, I was feeling fairly desperate, as my symptoms of brain fog, fatigue, lack of energy and general tiredness was overwhelming. Thats why I rushed to get bloodwork since I was desperate to find something that worked and had no reason to believe that my testosterone was elevated. I took the last shot of HCG on Friday and the last days Ive been feeling slightly better.

Slight increase in libido and morning erections is the only improvement, but having been even stronger in periods in the past without using anything, it could be random. I do however think it could be due to increased E2, which I think have been on the low end in the past.

Disclaimer, I drank 5 beers the day before the blood work, but I hope it did not affect the blood work by too much. I`ve heard of estradiol spikes.

27th of January:

Total testosterone - 14 nmol/l (8-35 nmol/L) - 403 ng/dl
Free testosterone index - 6,7 (2,3 - 9,9)
Free testosterone - 23,6 ng/dl - This is calculated using an online calculator. Not sure if its the same as the free testosterone index on my lab report, but with different numbers. SHBG - 17 nmol/l (8-60 nmol/l) LH - 3 ie/l (2 - 12) FSH - 2ie/l (1 - 12) Estradiol - 0,06 nmol/l (<0,15 nmol/l) - Not sure how accurate this test is, having heard of sensitive tests in the US, but its the only one we got.
Prolactin - 165 mIU/L (45-375)

18th of May:

Total testosterone - 25 nmol/l (8-35 nmol/L) - 720 ng/dl
Free testosterone index - 20,2 (2,3 - 9,9)
Free testosterone - 12,5 ng/dl - This is calculated using an online calculator. Not sure if its the same as the free testosterone index on my lab report, but with different numbers. SHBG - 13 nmol/l (8-60 nmol/l) LH - <1 ie/l (2 - 12) FSH - <1 ie/l (1 - 12) Estradiol - 0,20 nmol/l (<0,15 nmol/l) - Not sure how accurate this test is, having heard of sensitive tests in the US, but its the only one we got.
Prolactin - 123 mIU/L (45-375)

Any thoughts on this bloodwork? What from here?

Could it be that the elevated E2 prevents me from enjoying the effects of the increase in testosterone? Should I give it more time? Or just go with Nebido?

Could it be that there is something else in my body that is causing me to feel like crap?

Im thinking that using an AI to lower E2 might be worth a shot, but I did not get anything from my doctor, nor do I think he knows what it is. Im tempted to start with Nebido and continue with a substantially lower dose with HCG, hopefully reducing the E2, and then entertain the thought of getting off Nebido at a future date.

Im not sure if I have the time to keep fooling around for much longer, not to mention the money it costs me since this is a private doctor and Im not exactly wealthy at the moment.

Thankful for any input.

Regards,

Johan Nes

2

So this is on hcg monotherapy and not on the nebido, right?

Nebido is an awful drug–I can’t imagine how a drug that requires injection every 3 months or whatever ridiculous lag time, ever got approved for release.

Yes your E2 appears high even on the wrong test.

Before geting an AI, I would knock my dose down to 250 iu 3x/week. This is the normal replacement dose–you may be trying to overdrive your testicles at the current dose (more than you are capable of producing) with the excess going to E2.

I would cruise at 250 iu 3x/week for a few weeks and retest to see if E2 has fallen at all. If not, and T still looks good as it currentyl does, add in the AI.

3

HCG monotherapy only.

I was not properly prepared during the first shot, so I took 2500 IU on day 1. Then 500 IU Monday, Wednesday, Friday. Bloodwork after 16 days.

So, you recommend that I just lower the HCG and see what happens? Im not sure if I can get a hold of an AI. I dont think my doctor even know what it is. Bloodwork is also hard to get frequently.

As for Nebido, do you have any first or second hand experience with it? I also heard a lot of bad stuff about it first and it seemed like a bad idea to me as well, but then Ive read about countless guys who feel great on it, including one Ive been talking to directly. Most of them coming from weekly shots or transdermal gel.

The only thing is that some guys need their shot after 9 weeks and not 10-14 weeks like the literature suggests, although some goes as long as 14 weeks. There are many studies on Nebido that prove it`s efficacy.

Regards,

Johan Nes

[quote]VTBalla34 wrote:
So this is on hcg monotherapy and not on the nebido, right?

Nebido is an awful drug–I can’t imagine how a drug that requires injection every 3 months or whatever ridiculous lag time, ever got approved for release.

Yes your E2 appears high even on the wrong test.

Before geting an AI, I would knock my dose down to 250 iu 3x/week. This is the normal replacement dose–you may be trying to overdrive your testicles at the current dose (more than you are capable of producing) with the excess going to E2.

I would cruise at 250 iu 3x/week for a few weeks and retest to see if E2 has fallen at all. If not, and T still looks good as it currentyl does, add in the AI.[/quote]

4

Please show me hte study in question, and I will shoot it full of holes. It is no different than the asinine literature used to justify once a month shots of Test Cyp.

You are injecting an amount of fluid into your body that takes you above physiological ranges for a while, before slowly tapering off to just above the bottom of the range. Doctors do not seem to view this as a problem, but huge swings and barely getting into range is NOT optimal treatment.

Some guys may do well with it, but others are not so lucky. The point is, it can be easily rectified with proper dosing so why would one not do this?

5

[quote]VTBalla34 wrote:
Please show me hte study in question, and I will shoot it full of holes. It is no different than the asinine literature used to justify once a month shots of Test Cyp.

You are injecting an amount of fluid into your body that takes you above physiological ranges for a while, before slowly tapering off to just above the bottom of the range. Doctors do not seem to view this as a problem, but huge swings and barely getting into range is NOT optimal treatment.

Some guys may do well with it, but others are not so lucky. The point is, it can be easily rectified with proper dosing so why would one not do this?[/quote]

I have read a lot of guys who function great on it, including one guy I`ve been talking to personally here in Norway who used to do weekly shots.

EDIT: Posted a link, but it was removed, so I`m not sure what to do about that. :slight_smile: