I recently started (2 days ago) a TRT with topical gel of 2ml/day. I am experimenting with this therapy because I have low testosterone levels, and after months of trying to identify the cause, am still uncertain as to what is to blame. I have high energy levels and no impotency problems, but was willing to try this TRT to see if I saw any noticeable difference in my mood, sex drive. etc. (as well as take the opportunity to loose fat and build more lean muscle mass that could increase my baseline testosterone levels)
I am still on the fence about whether to continue the therapy because i’m worried about the process of getting off. I do not plan to take this for more than three months at most, and i’m worried that, if I were to stop after this, that I would experience serious withdrawal symptoms including depression and impotency that could last for a significant period of time.
I have sought advice from doctors about the best way to come off a cycle of this medication, and am, thus far, not happy with what I have been told.
Does anyone with experience cycling TRT have any advice about the best way to get off this type of treatment without hitting a low of some kind?
TRT is forever. It sounds like you really do not know what you are doing.
You are actually seeking to understand steroid cycles and PCT. Read the stickies on the steroid forum. This is not something that you are going to understand in short order. Best to stop now.
2ml/day of 1% T-gel? That is not going to do anything other than repress your HPTA a bit. Your T levels may not increase, but your estradiol levels will. TRT with T-gels requires 5-10 ml/day. You can’t just add a little supplemental T.
Read the ‘protocol for injections’ sticky. Read the “The Testosterone Syndrome” by Shippen. Search and read Wikipedia for terms that you do not understand.
Ok. I have stopped after three days and ordered the book you recommended. I have a 58 year old friend who has used TRT at these very low doses and seen increased overall T to levels of 650 (with 1 ml/day) from mid 200’s (I don’t remember what the free levels were, and it sounds like you are saying that free may get depressed because estradiol increases if I am understanding that correctly).
I had been temporarily on anti-depression/anxiety medication and my first doctor who had looked at my original blood work where my testosterone levels were below normal did not take this into account when suggesting that I should go on TRT. I cut the medication, and my testosterone levels have increased significantly, but my overall is still just under 400 (and I am 28 years old). I have a large varicocele in my left testicle (3+ according to standard measurements and thus very large). Although I have never had a problem getting or maintaining an erection, I have decided to have microsurgery to remove this as a possible solution to my low levels (according to the literature 70% of men who get this surgery see an increase in T as well, while those with larger varicoceles like mine often see even better results). My pituitary hormone levels are normal and I do not have an adenoma (checked with MRI).
I exercise regularly and do not have problems with impotency nor do I feel fatigued. I have been told that these T levels may in fact be normal for my particular body as I may be producing just as much as my receptors need.
You are right, my idea of experimenting with TRT was done with very little thought. I was basing it entirely on a friend’s experience who has had excellent results with 1ml. He is into his 4th month and plans to stop after this bottle and check his blood levels once off and then again after a few months to see what his level are at one his pituitary kicks in.
Why do you say that TRT is forever though? My assumption was that if body builders can cycle at much higher levels of T and then get off, that I could do the same with lower levels.
With TRT you stay on that and then there are no issue about getting off and restarting the HPTA [PCT].
Guys needed TRT have impaired HPTA’s and restarting a impaired HPTA seems to be beating a dead horse. Younger normal guys doing PCT after a cycle of gear are depending on a functional HPTA.
What is the %T in your T-gel?
AD meds and other, Rx and OTC, can increase E levels by impairing the livers ability to remove estrogens from the blood. Ditto grapefruit, alcohol, marijuana, lavender…
You need to know your serum E2 levels. If elevated, you may need to lower E2 to allow your HPTA to work best.
No, I’m not using statin drugs. I am only 28 years old. I don’t know the %T in the T-gel, but I have since discarded it anyway and was only on it for 4 days. If E2 is estradiol then those levels are within the normal range (don’t have the results in front of me, but according to the doctor they were normal).
Both free and overall are also within the normal range, but for someone my age they are low. I don’t have the paperwork in front of me, but overall testosterone was somewhere in the high 300’s and I don’t remember about the free.
I’m not on any sort of medication. I’m just concerned about these T levels when I compare them to those of others my age. The TRT was a stupid idea. I thought I might be able to see a difference early on and gauge whether or not my levels were in fact low for my own body. Right now, the micro surgery i’m having on this varicocele may make a big difference.
Although I have never had ED in my life, I have had this varicocele since puberty, and has caused significant atrophy of my left test (it’s roughly half the size of my right). Since my HPTA is functioning normally, the cause may be the testes and this may be a solution.
I am also exercising more and removing excess fat and trying to eliminate any fat from my midsection entirely. My body fat is right now around 15% so I am also hoping that as this drops, I will see an increase.
IMPORTANT: Get and retain copies of your labs… and retain! Post the numbers, units and ranges.
Know what you are doing and taking. That means knowing mg’s, not volumes.
You have a lot to learn about doctors, labs and “normal”. Do you feel normal? Normal on labs means that you fall into a statistical range, nothing more. That does not mean that guys in the lower T range are well physically, sexually or mentally. Most doctors are idiots when it comes to these things. You need to know your labs and need to have a better understanding of issues like these than the doctors you deal with. You need to manage your own health care. You cannot be passive.
When is the surgery? Something positive to focus on.
Low thyroid levels can contribute to low T levels. What is your iodine intake. You could test TSH, fT3, fT4.
Your DHEA levels might be low as a result of reduced testicular production of pregnenolone.
Test LH & FSH. If low, consideration need to be paid to pituitary adinoma or physical damage from a blow to the head or whip lash. LH and FSH can be driven down by E2 and prolactin.
At your age, you need to find causes for low T, not do TRT from the start.
The surgery is on the 18th of February. It’s not clear how long after the surgery I should see a change. Right now my T levels are at 350 ng/dl. They increased over 100% since I got off of an anti-anxiety medication (effexor) that I was on. It had decreased my LH and FSH levels which are now right around the middle of the ‘normal’ range. The second blood test was done 5 months after getting off the meds, which is a good deal of time. It may be possible that there are lingering effects, but I do not know.
I was told about a Dr. Overbeck on this site that might be helpful in providing natural treatments, so that I don’t have to go on any type of TRT. There is also a therapy that involves the use of clomiphene (Clomiphene citrate is a weak estrogen receptor antagonist and thus may be considered a selective estrogen receptor modulator (SERM).
It competes with estradiol for the estrogen receptors at the level of the hypothalamus and blocks the normal negative feedback mechanism of circulating estradiol on the hypothalamus, preventing estrogen from limiting the production of GnRH [5]. The increase in GnRH level then stimulates the pituitary gland to release more FSH and LH, resulting in an increase in sperm and testosterone production by the testes.), that I am looking into as a possible solution.
I am not comiting to anything at this time, but am not particularly optimistic about what the varecocele surgery will bring, not because it may not increase T, but that this increase will not get me far above my current levels. Even a 400 is not something that I am happy about if I am still experiencing depression and low libido.