Ok when did you start the HCG in relation to stopping the AAS? What AAS were doing and how long were you on it? Did you run HCG during?
If you can answer those questions for me, hopefully I can shed some light on your situation.
I was on 35mg of Test E and 250iU of HCG eod for two years. I’m 41 years old.
I increased the HCG for to 1000IU 3 x week for a month after stopping the Test and started the nolva 4 days after stopping the HCG.
Appreciate any advice you can offer on either continuing on this path or starting over.
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You actually had a decent restart attempt, I suspect that the timing is what played a role in the failure. I would do the same exact same thing over, aim for 6 weeks. Get labs after a month while on the HCG. You only need TT so you can get it done really cheap. 50 ish bucks probably.
Long esters take a really long time to get out of your system, they build up over time a lot more than people realize. So I think if you would have waited 30 days after stopping your T you would have had more success.
Although HCG stimulates the testes and partially at the pituitary, it does so much much better when TT levels are below 400 ng/dl. So if you started right after, you could have “wasted” some of the effect.
The blood test is super important, if you don’t get a number proving your testes can produce a maximal amount of testosterone, then there is no point in stopping the HCG.
Not sure if your doctor can prescribe some type of GHRH/GHRP combo but they work really well at restoring HPTA function.
Hope this makes sense.
I thought I posted a Vitamin E comment here, anyways here is why that is important during a restart:
Abstract
The role of vitamin E in the endocrine system, in particular the pituitary-gonadal axis, was studied in humans and male rats by examining the hormonal differences between vitamin E deficient and supplemented conditions. In vitamin E deficient rats, pituitary content and basal plasma level of FSH and LH were significantly lower than those of the control rats, but testicular content and basal plasma level of testosterone were not significantly changed. On the other hand, in vitamin E supplemented rats, FSH and LH content in pituitary tissue was significantly higher than that of the controls, but there was no significant rise in basal FSH and LH level in plasma. The testosterone level was significantly elevated in both testicular tissue and plasma. It was also demonstrated that basal plasma testosterone and F.T.I. were increased in normal male subjects following oral vitamin E administration and the responsiveness of plasma testosterone levels to HCG was significantly higher during vitamin E administration than before administration. These results suggest that vitamin E may play an important and potent role in hormone production in the pituitary-gonadal axis in humans and rats.
Effect of vitamin E on function of pituitary-gonadal axis in male rats and human subjects.
Thanks a lot for this. I just don’t know anyone who I can reach out to for advice. Is there a generic GHRH / GHRP I can source through an UGL. How much do I need and at what point do I take it during the restart. My doc won’t prescribe anything other than T, HCG and Adex. I’m going to start the process again but want to have everything I need and a plan before I do.
For what it’s worth I pulled out my old labs and my pre TRT bloodwork was as follows:
LH 6.2 (1.8-9.2)
TT 20.9 (9.9-27.8)
FT 350 (170-670)
E2 125 (<160)
SHBG 49 (17-56)
In hindsight I wish I’d explored ways to lower E2 & SHBG but here I am.
I did androgel for 2 years when i was 36ish. I came off cold and my pre-gel numbers returned. I was less than 300 before and back in May of this year at 49 my numbers were between 350 - 550. I got tested 3 times and each time the number increased. So yes, anything is possible.
Any idea how long it took to get your numbers back up after going cold turkey?
Thats really good bro. Sorry I haven’t been on here much sense the semester started back up I get crazy busy. But are you having any current symptoms? So do you feel like your restart worked?
Yea I’m still on clomid. So this is what happen i was taking 50mg ED for a while and i was feeling great I did labs and everything came back good. So I decided it was time to move to half a pill which is 25 mg. So as soon as I did that about two days later my whole system got messed up. Erections were bad everything sexually got messed up and then the fatigue came pouring in. So I’m now back to taking 50mg now again. Im gonna stay on it for longer and then try to progress later but i defiantly like the fact of taking a pill then having to inject my self its just way more convenient for me. One thing that I notice is that i had anxiety but adderall helps a lot with that.
I have a quick question do you feel like being on TRT you feel way more better then when you were in your 20’s? Because for me and @sa22c were both in our early 30’s and i think we just want to get back to the point where we were at before. Nethier one of us want to take meds anymore cause its just not natural to have to at our age. There are a lot of older guys on this form and respect them a lot for there knowledge and there experience but one thing is for the younger guys that our not running cycles on here we are here for medical help that something went wrong and im speaking about my self that for somereson my body just shut down on me. A lot of people said a restart might not work and i have taken that well into consideration but there has to be a answer of what caused my body to stop producing testosterone at therapeutic levels on its own. To be honest my main symptoms thought out this journey have been sexual problems and fatigue i just need to get to the bottom of all of this
@oz_dude this is what im exactly going to do if my restart continues to fail then Im deffintly going to go back on HCG longer and give it another try. Listen to @increasemyt this man know what he is talking about.
@increasemyt can you give me more knowledge about this GHRH you’re talking about. What role does it play in the restart because I have a appointment with my doctor on Friday and if this is something that will increase my chances of a successful restart then I defiantly will want to bring it to his attention.
How much Vitamin E should i take? When should I take it and how often?
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No natural is better but it’s not like you are reaching the levels again naturally: especially since it’s common fact that the environment and toxins are damaging our Endocrin systems. What matters is I’m healthy today and not dealing with low t.
You feel almost as good as you did in your 20s. Then again there’s no comparisons because it’s never going to get you back there without trt.
You either need it or don’t. Most need it more than ever they jsut don’t realize it. 40 year old
Men today are like 60 yr old men 50 years ago. It’s not good but men are getting used to it.
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You need trt man. If your doc couldn’t fix you up you find a better doc. Your body is being bombarded by toxins daily. EDCs and diet and radio waves and blur light and so much more.
Trt works just fine. I feel like I’m 21 again in terms of vivality, health and etc.
If you have serious fatigue you need to check thyroid. I had 4.2 free t3 and I was fatigued to hell. I put this up towards 5 (max range) and all my symptoms disappeared and trt finllay started to work.
Most men who start trt and stop saying it didn’t work is Becusse they either didn’t take enough dose, didn’t give it enough time or thyroid was not optimized.
Trt works for all men. Your body needs it. For any man to say trt didn’t work for me is like saying “that food didn’t take away my hunger” surely you’d tell them to give it time and or eat another?
Testostorone is what makes a male a man. Without it we are fkd.
I don’t know how else to answer your comment.Hope it helps.
I don’t know if it’s been a success. Too early to tell. I know I started Nolva too early, I know I should of tried a higher dose, I know I should of ran it longer, but I did what I could. If I didn’t start early, I wouldn’t of been able to hold down my job, if I did t stop Nolva when I did I think I would of lost my mind lol. And for the higher dose, I guess i’ll never know.
I actually got blood drawn again yesterday. It’s too early too tell, but I wanted to know my estradiol level. It’s been 2.5 weeks since the last nolva.
I’m starting to feel my test levels dropping now that nolva is ceased. That’s a given. Where they’ll land and steady out in the next few weeks is the Q.
I took 0.5mg of anastrozole on Monday. Blood wa taken Tuesday, today is Wednesday. Results tomorrow.
I took arimidex as I was getting high e symptoms, (emotional, hot flushes) that’s because my test is dropping without Nolva.
It could simply be that yes TT is dropping without Nolva and now the body has to adjust again as it finds it new found functional level. So there’s a fairly decent adjustment period once meds are stopped. I can assure you of that. It’s starting for me now.
So I figured if I lower e2 one more time right about this point in time. As my body sees that it can try and steady out a decent e2 to TT level if that makes sense.
So see what my levels are 2.5 weeks since last Nolva, but about 4 weeks since I stopped at 20mg per day…
So ill see if I should lower e2 anymore, And then that’s it. Just have to let my body do its thing and test in a couple of months.
Transitioning off TRT too Nolva was the hardest, my body is doing OK off Nolva, how well, I don’t know yet 
Testosterone replacement therapy to some. Is more than just a couple of shots a week of Testosterone and all is well.
Of course we felt the beneficial feelings off TRT. How the fuck would we be typing here knowing the difference?
I had to personally stop because of hCG. It’s all written here in the posts above.
You need to stop being nieve. I’m glad it’s going great for you. I hope you never run into any hiccups, never need hCG or an AI and then you’re most of the way there.
Everyones anatomy is different. Hormone replacement therapy didn’t sit well with me. As a whole I feel better off it. But I miss parts of it for sure. Will I get hung up on that. Fuck no. My mind is made up. I cannot continue TRT or ever attempt again. My life is easier without it, I didn’t say better, I said easier. It’s as simple as that for me.
@zsub154 Hard to say on the Vitamin E cause everyone is so much different. Start with the recommended dosage on the label, that is usually plenty strong enough because the tend to put the max dosage on there.
More important try to find the Vitamin E in powder form that has to be refrigerated. This is in the fridge at the health foods store.
For the peptides there are many different combos available, we like the CJC/IPAM this best. Def bring this up to the doctor, tell him they stimulate the pituitary like HCG stimulates the testes.
You sound so angry and frustrated. You are then saying that you didn’t need trt in the first place if you can consider quitting. There is zero comparison. I can’t sit here and read your whole post roll. It’s too much.
I wasn’t able to wake up. I wasn’t able to focus . My business was falling apart. I couldn’t get out of my house and into my car. Eventually I stopped setting my alarm. I was so depressed I thought about suicide everyday for years. I couldn’t spend time with my kid. My family: my employees weren’t being mentored and guided. The list goes on.
4 months into trt I found reprieve and normalcy of life. I can function now. I wasn’t looking for better. I was looking for normal.
That’s the difference. You were trying to find better.
I also spent 4 months with a clinic that gave me HCG and cypionate and an ai. Nothing worked until I switched to my doctor Keith Nichols at tier1. He literally saved my life. The guys my friend now and I have been blessed to learn from him and be guided by him so that I can help others as I go about my life. He doesn’t help men who want to optimize their normal life. He helps men who have low T and thyroid and cannot function.
If one doctor doesn’t work you go to another. Especially when doctors want to give HCG and ai. It’s a simple process. Increase dose until symptoms resolve. If one doesn’t have that many symptoms there’s really nothing to aim for is there.
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I’m not angry or frustrated lol. I 100% respect what you’re saying and what TRT has done for you. I would of loved to continue but my body doesn’t agree with hormone replacement therapy. I can see we’re not going to see eye to eye completely and that’s all good.
I wasn’t looking for better. Looking for normal aswell, like yourself. Here are my bloods now off of Nolva. Like I thought my levels were dropping off of Nolva. My levels have dropped to where they were pre TRT. So I’m like 95% of people, and once SERM is stopped, levels are back where they were pre TRT.
I could of ran a longer restart but I can’t look back now, it probably wouldn’t have helped anyway.
I was being optimistic and hoping they’d stay higher off of Nolva but not the case.
The transition back to no test with Nolva, I’m very grateful for, it would of been hell without it.
I’ll see where they’re at in 3 months, more than likely the same.
So yes I have the same symptoms etc etc before TRT. But for me I cannot continue TRT. Life was harder on it, not better, but harder. I’m just going to accept my levels and move on with life, I’m grateful that I can with those levels.
Well that’s shit you gotta do this. Work on increasing your naturally levels . Read up on EDC, clear the home of toxins, use blue light glasss: un plug and turn off electronics when not using them. Anything that can cause endocrin issues I’d zap them for a good while and optimize my health with supplements, lifting, a perfect diet and the sauna often. The sauna will help your body rid of toxins as well.
There’s potentially more T your body can produce. I think you can do it if you cancel out all variables.
I believe having low t naturlaly due to the environment can be brought back up to a better range, but who knows how much higher.
When I take HCG my levels double from 200mg cypionate so that’s promising. If I ever get off my meds I might have some relief knowing I could potentially get off if the zombie apocalypse hits don’t want to though.
Good luck and keep us in the loop if you are able to get levels higher. Would be a nice story to hear.
Thanks brother. Really appreciate the advice and suggestions. I will definitely post in months ahead.
So you plan on staying off of TRT and not going back on despite our levels are that low?