I’m on 100mg a week injected EOD, 250 iu HCG EOD and no AI. Been on this protocol for a year and feel pretty good but not great. I was thinking of dropping HCG to lower estrogen a bit and see if I can get dialed in a bit more. If I drop HCG how much do I have to raise my Test C dose to compensate? Recent labs are below.
LabCorp Results:
TESTOSTERONE, SERUM 784 NG/DL
TESTOSTERONE,FREE 33.16 NG/DL
% FREE TESTOSTERONE 4.23
ESTRADIOL, SENSITIVE 38.8
HEMATOCRIT 50.9 %
What problem are you looking to solve with this plan? You feel good now, your numbers seem fine, and you’re not having any problems. Why are you attempting to alter that? What is the end goal that you’re wishing to achieve?
Honestly, I just want to see if I can go from good to great. I’m curious to see if I would do better without the HCG. I’m not worried about fertility right now.
If you want to feel great then I’d suggest cocaine and a few hookers.
TRT isn’t about feeling great, it’s about feeling normal. Normal is rarely great. I know everyone wants instant gratification and great sounds better than good, but keep in mind that tons of guys would kill to have a protocol that makes them feel pretty good.
That being said, you can drop the hcg to twice a week and pump the test up by 20% for four weeks and assess how you feel. If that doesn’t do the trick then you can go up again. I’ll tell you I found no difference (in feeling) between 200mg where I started to 120mg that I’m on now, and also no change at 450mg. Sometimes more isn’t better, it’s just more. You may respond immediately to a small increase. You may be like me and feel nothing. Just be careful how fast you make changes and monitor everything so you can make an objective decision once you’ve tinkered with various doses.
I won’t disagree that hookers and cocaine are great! What is your experience with HCG if any? I noticed that you didn’t recommend dropping the HCG simply scaling it back. I’m not looking for instant gratification, just trying to be on the best protocol best suited for me. I don’t mind experimenting for a few months then going back to my original protocol if it doesn’t work out.
I love hcg, so keep that in mind when you read my thoughts on it. I use 1,000iu/w now, but I started at 500iu initially. I took a break for six weeks a little bit ago, just to see if there was a measurable difference. I found my mood wasn’t as good and certain bodily functions were not the same. I’ll leave it at that because nobody needs to hear about some of these fluid-related things.
I think keeping some kind of baseline testicular function is a net benefit and if a person doesn’t have any side effects from using it then there is no reason to not include it into a protocol. You should be able to get away with two doses a week and a higher test dose without any major disruption in your e2. Should. No promises, as your body is not the same as mine.
What is the lab range for e2 on your particular panel?
The values are from Labcorp and they range from 8.0-35.0 so I tested on the high side just above range.
How do you feel at that range? Any issues?
I feel ok. I have insomnia, high blood pressure, trouble losing visceral fat, some moodiness and depression. My libido is pretty good and I’m not sure about ED as I’m on 5mg cialis daily. The reason I started TRT was for my depression and ED.
I believe your levels to be in excess, I feel as you describe when my levels are in excess. Also when my levels are in excess I have water retention and blood pressure problems and I feel not great.
Which levels?
Your estrogen is above range and FT percentage 3%> the normal value. I would just drop the HCG and see where levels land, this way there is no waiting 6 weeks for levels to become stable.
Your estrogen will drop and you may actually feel better once its stopped, very common. If in the weeks to come you still feel blah, decrease T dosage a little.
Thank you for your response. I appreciate it.
I’d drop the HCG and bump the test up a bit to say 150mg/week and see what happens
The better way would really be to only drop HCG and give it 6-8 weeks to see where you land on your current T dose, then increase T dosage to 150mg or whatever and give that 6-8 weeks and see which way works better for you
Yes, agreed. For now I’ve dropped the HCG and bumped up my dose to 125mg a week. I’m hoping that will do the trick.
I think you will feel better in a month or two
I’m hoping that too. I take it you’re just on Test with no AI or HCG?
Correct. Well, kind of. I’m actually on test cream (not gel) 2x a day. No AI, no HCG.
I am prescribed HCG but I feel better without it so I haven’t been using it. I guess I’mg going to just have to suffer through it next year when it’s baby making time
Did you experiment with and without HCG? How do you know you do better? What about atrophy, do you have any pain?
Yeah I tried HCG in the beginning for the first 4-6 weeks and felt crappy. A few times since then I’ve tried it and every time I use it the day after I feel like crap and then a few days after that I’m back to fine… It’s possible I didn’t give it enough time of consistently taking it though to be honest. I just don’t really want to find out now that I actually feel good. I’ll probably try it again at some point but want to leave things alone for a bit
Very minimal atrophy if any, they may be slightly smaller/higher but it’s not something anyone else would notice and I’m not even sure I could tell the difference.
No pain whatsoever.