I’m the keyboard warrior??? wow.
Bro i’ll post studies all damn day.
Increased estrogen level can be associated with depression in males - ScienceDirect.
https://www.bodylogicmd.com/blog/recognizing-high-estrogen-symptoms-in-men-and-regaining-balance/
“Can be associated”
Correlation does not prove causation. But a smart guy like you should know this, right?
Here is how dumb you are. Did you read the study?
Correlation does not prove causation as I already stated. How to Interpret Studies 101
The depressed men were all obese. Of course they had high E2. E2 does not cause depression. Being obese causes high E2.
Their free testosterone range was 5-9 ng/dL. I’d be depressed as all hell if I had a free T of 5 and so would you!
This has nothing to do with estradiol. You’re literally intellectually inadequate to interpret a study.
This one actually demonstrates everything I’m saying. Did you read it?
How did they raise estradiol here to have 'high e2" They prescribed Estradiol! They didn’t raise estradiol by raising testosterone. They manually raised E2 which completely threw off the ratio the body was trying to maintain. Are you serious right now? You can’t be this dumb. You can’t be.
Other than that they say estradiol has huge health benefit implications in men. How about that?
Send me more. Please.
Danny, the point is your studies are no better actually way worse, abusing people by giving them 2.5 mg of letrozole a day. And then saying see, Estrogen is good no matter how high! Your simple mind is dispensing checks you just can’t cash.
they had to abandon the study hahahaa. You didn’t read it did you hahahah
I agree Estrogen is necessary Danny. Whats your point?
Where do the studies I provided state “No matter how high”
They were unable to find a level that caused harm so did not report any. If there was a level that caused harm, it would have been stated. Why is this so difficult for your mind to grasp?
Of course the study was abandoned. What man in his right mind would want to get manually jacked up on estradiol without raising testosterone? Nobody would last long. You would be feminizing them. Is this not evident to you?
Not only that, look at what they used!!
This trial, which employed high doses of conjugated equine estrogens, was subsequently abandoned, and the subject has not been studied in detail since.
Conjugated equine estrogens??? Lol!
Danny, I don’t tell anyone what to do on here. But you do, based on irrelevant studies. That’s the dilemma. You shouldn’t be telling anyone what to do. That’s why you’re being called out.
I’m literally sitting here in absolute hysterics as to what you’re sending me. This is basic level 1 TRT knowledge that you don’t even understand… and you want to interpret studies??
The joke is on you. You have a TON of catching up to do on a multitude of subjects.
Enjoy the rest of your day and thanks again for the laughs. I have the physicians in my group chat in stitches over what you’re providing here. All the papers I sent are irrelevant! All of them lol!
Have a good one! 
I’m not proving anything. I’m just stating traditional clinical knowledge. The burden of proof is on you to chain the medical practices that you claim are required.
Don’t delete that post Danny! Now GTFO haha
I just fail to understand how these threads invariably turn in to this kind of absurd behavior. How can anyone be so ideologically tied to the management of a single hormone?
Without regard to piles of research papers:
How is any of this more complicated than that?
I have no clue man. This is crazy. You pretty much summed it all up.
I just read through this thread, and I’m amazed at the willful ignorance that @dixiewrecked is showing. There’s not a single study that @dixiewrecked posted, not a single shred of evidence that was shown that disproves what @dbossa is saying. They’re all straw man arguments. @dixiewrecked, please actually read what @dbossa is saying, because you’re arguing against a straw man.
I’m not trying to disprove dbossa. He’s making a claim. I’m not. I’m simply stating different things work for different people. I think alot of time he’s probably right. But alot of times people like hcg. Sometimes people prefer Viagra over Cialis. I prefer Motrin over aspirin. It’s not a big deal. There’s more than one way to skin a cat.
The ‘claim’ is that we have no evidence, after 80+ years of research, that states any level of estradiol causes harm in the presence of sufficient androgens.
There is no evidence. How do I provide someone with evidence to prove there is no evidence? Someone would have to provide me with evidence that there IS. What I’m saying is that I am yet to see any compelling evidence to support that position.
If you want to make a claim that higher levels of estradiol are potentially harmful, in the presence of sufficient androgens, then the onus would be on you to provide evidence to support that claim.
This is the crux of the whole debate for me. There are subjective side effects that seem to vary between individuals, but that is not the same thing as “harm.” Whatever I may think of your tactics, no one that has taken you up in debate has shown E2 to be harmful. It seems to me the debate needs to be laser focused from the outset on this instead of subjective sides.
The debate is indeed laser focused. I don’t know how I can be more clear. I’m being as specific as I can be.
There is NO HARM demonstrated due to estradiol (specifically) in the presence of sufficient androgens.
Lots of harm in men with insufficient androgens in associative studies yet we raise androgens and they improve so E2 is not the cause. Prostate harm is demonstrably false as low androgens cause harm. I want to see evidence of HARM caused specifically by estradiol in a man on TRT or one with sufficient androgens.
Since we have sufficient androgens because we are all on TRT, there is zero evidence of estradiol causing harm regardless of level. If you purposely raise estradiol to throw off the balance with said androgens, you’re upsetting the balance and that will cause issues.
Let the body regulate aromatase based on what it needs. There are varying levels of aromatase throughout the body so you have no idea where you are blocking the conversion when you take an AI.
Being a paracrine hormone in men, with estradiol being formed in the tissue, you are only measuring a very tiny amount that leaks into the bloodstream and have zero indication as to what the varying levels are throughout the body which makes measuring it inherently useless.
I can’t be more any specific than this.
What about the harm that an AI does?
@dbossa has shown this in his videos. Multiple doctors have explained this.