Do you have a consistant type of stretching/ soft-tissue regime? What’s your pelvic alignment like? If you’re struggling with anterior pelvic tilt, when you squat your knees will probably start to cave, which all-in-all would be an indicator of weak glutes (weak, at least, in terms of relative strength.) Tight calves/ peroneals will also make it harder to maintain proper lower-limb positioning, alongside overactive/ tight hip flexors (which will overpower the activity of your glutes.
When your knees cave (go into valgus) you’re placing a lot of load on the wrong muscles, and probably causing your kneecap to maltrack. This can also happen in your vastus medius (inner quad) is weaker than your outer quad muscles (vastus lateralis.)
Another possibility is that you’re loaded with trigger points in your hips and thighs. Get on the foam roller, and hammer your IT-Band, Rectus Femoris, TFL and Glutes. Excess tension in all these muscle groups will contribute to knee-pain.
Just some things to think about- it may be more than just a form issue…
[quote]caveman101 wrote:
powerlifters do not use “straight toes”, anyone who is trying to squat a respectable weight points their toes out a # of degrees
maybe you need to re-evaluate why you have chronic pain in your knees[/quote]
Dude every power lifter starts with toes strait and ends up moving them out a little bit in the squat part. But 35-40 degrees is WAY, WAY to much for the most part, Just check out some of these worlds lifters and decide for yourself. I had 2 surgeries and i know why I have chronic pain… lack of physical therapy. Truth is my form with a squat is better than most so chill out.
that video, show OLYMPIC WEIGHTLIFTERS, not powerlifters. they still angled their toes out when they squatted anyway. How are supposed to open up your hips with your toes pointing straight forward? contribute when you can squat 1.5x bodyweight
that video, show OLYMPIC WEIGHTLIFTERS, not powerlifters. they still angled their toes out when they squatted anyway. How are supposed to open up your hips with your toes pointing straight forward? contribute when you can squat 1.5x bodyweight[/quote]
your a punk, you will never get far with that worthless attitude. Thanks for repeating me as well, Im glad your so intelligent. You do not need to squat with a huge angle, it also depends on why you are lifting. I train for athletics and I know that there is no way or reason for me to be doing open hip sumo squats for the type of activities I do.
Okage, gotta say man, you’re on the wrong side of this argument. Nothing personal. But the fact that you’re confusing Oly-lifts with powerlifting tells the T-Nation community everything they need to know about you.
People on T-Nation always over analys the wrong shit. The fact that I ment Olympic and said powerlifting at 430am at work means absolutely nothing in about the truth. dont be get so caught up on one word.
But ill admit when I make a meat head mistake. lol. headscratch
But also I dont like seeing everyone with wide ass stances not getting down far enough. I was taught by an Olympic lifter from 16-18, sorry on the confusion but I dont agree with only doing wide stance squats.
Do you use a wide stance when you clean? when you front squat? when you jerk, or push press…?
Agree with Caveman and Flipcollar. A video olympic lifters doing clean and jerks is not analogous to a powerlifting squat. The squat portion of the clean is more analogous to a vertical jump, where the stance is narrower (therefore toes have to be more parallel to one another) and weight shifts to toes as the bar passes the knees. A powerlifting squat uses a wide stance, knees tracking over toes (toes pointed out), and a greater degree of hip flexion and extension to involve the low back, glutes and hamstrings to a greater degree.
Not to be rude and steer this conversation back on-topic, but I have a follow-up question. If the pain on the knees is not manageable through form, what is the next recourse? As I have the same problem, I’m thinking of abandoning the back squat in favor of the leg-press, weighted walking lunges, and leg curls (and calves, and deadlifts). Would this approach be appropriate for rounding out my legs or would there be something missing that I can only get from back squats?
[quote]qsar wrote:
Not to be rude and steer this conversation back on-topic, but I have a follow-up question. If the pain on the knees is not manageable through form, what is the next recourse? As I have the same problem, I’m thinking of abandoning the back squat in favor of the leg-press, weighted walking lunges, and leg curls (and calves, and deadlifts). Would this approach be appropriate for rounding out my legs or would there be something missing that I can only get from back squats?
[/quote]
One of the best thing ive ever read on knee pain said, “Knee pain? Work on the stuff above and below.” I believe that if we can strengthen the quad, hamstring, calves and gluts then you will see your pain lessen. I read this about 3 weeks ago and have made it my new motto.
Id say switch it up a bit. I like leg extensions BUT i make sure only to go from strait leg down to a 45 degree and back up with very light weight. They are not great for knees but can be great for quad activation.
Also, love strait leg deadlifts for hamstring. cant have enough deadlifts they dont hurt my knee much.
Also this article on squatting I read from CT makes sense to me. I thin that to build a solid base for the legs high reps is great. read it and take what you will from it, not saying to do it but… knowledge is power shit.
[quote]qsar wrote:
Not to be rude and steer this conversation back on-topic, but I have a follow-up question. If the pain on the knees is not manageable through form, what is the next recourse? As I have the same problem, I’m thinking of abandoning the back squat in favor of the leg-press, weighted walking lunges, and leg curls (and calves, and deadlifts). Would this approach be appropriate for rounding out my legs or would there be something missing that I can only get from back squats?
[/quote]
One of the best thing ive ever read on knee pain said, “Knee pain? Work on the stuff above and below.” I believe that if we can strengthen the quad, hamstring, calves and gluts then you will see your pain lessen. I read this about 3 weeks ago and have made it my new motto.
Id say switch it up a bit. I like leg extensions BUT i make sure only to go from strait leg down to a 45 degree and back up with very light weight. They are not great for knees but can be great for quad activation. [/quote]
Sorry, don’t mean to hijack the thread - just some background info. The cartilage on my knees is pretty much gone. I have bone grinding against bone. There is no good-form that will compensate for that. I worked out a good setup with a physical therapist for the leg press.
Today I worked out legs and it went poorly. That’s why I’m asking about hitting the legs a different way.
