[quote]Yo Momma wrote:
addwaves wrote:
In the off-season, I think rugby would be a good way to cross-train for soccer.
Wilkinson shows how it’s done.
[/quote]
Rugby is an incredible and tough sport. I wish they’d televise it here, but its not mainstream enough I guess.
In order to settle this debate we should get a soccer player to fight the toughest representatives of the American sports.
I think soccer’s representative should be a man who once played in the Croatian second division.
Here’s a photo of him in action…
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Dr Stig wrote:
There is a distinct Pavlovian quality to the posts round here these days.
Word.
Note that I have been to China (Beijing, Foshin, and Guanzhou) and I didn’t see ANYONE playing soccer. They were too busy either making things to sell to us, begging, or raiding the dumpster behind the McDonald’s.
All I did was note an odd correlation between soccer and Test levels…kind of like smoking and cancer, maybe?
[/quote]
More like the decline of pirates with the increase in global warming.
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Yo Momma wrote:
addwaves wrote:
In the off-season, I think rugby would be a good way to cross-train for soccer.
Wilkinson shows how it’s done.
Rugby is an incredible and tough sport. I wish they’d televise it here, but its not mainstream enough I guess.
[/quote]
I tend to think there’s three major reasons for the lack of televised rugby in the US. First, it’d compete with American Football, and football would win as it’s already got such a strong foothold in the market. Plus, the games are similar enough that most people find the one they don’t know to be very confusing.
Why no forward pass in rugby? What’s the deal with the offsides thing? Why can’t they block? Why do they ruck instead of stopping play and scrimmaging? Etc… The ideas behind the games are too similar, but the rules too different.
Second reason is that there’s no professional rugby in the states. Super league is the top level, but it’s still not pro, hence there’s not enough money involved and not enough advertising interest to make it worthwhile to televise. And lastly, and probably most importantly, it has the same problem as soccer.
The game doesn’t stop for 40 minutes. There’s no breaks for commercials. American football is practically designed for advertising. Play is constantly stopping for a minute or two at a time. More than enough time to go to commercial.
Rugby only stops for 10 minutes at half time. It’s hard to make 90+ minutes of television time cost effective when you can only advertise for 10 of those minutes.
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
I just think its an interesting anomaly. Americans, for the most part, don’t view soccer as a serious game. And c’mon, I watched some of the World Cup farce, guys flopping to the pitch, screaming, “Ref, he broke my pinkie nail! How will I hold up that pinkie while drinking my soy latte?!” Then the moron who head butts another. Then people celebrating a tie! I know that meant that one team advanced but celebrating a TIE?? Americans rarely celebrate a tie, we play to win.[/quote]
Just a few things HH, since you don’t seem to know too much about soccer, and while I am not an expert, I do enjoy playing and watching the game even though I am a rugby player (we also tie in that game too).
Simply put, unlike American sports where the win-loss record is what counts, most professional soccer (and rugby) leagues work on a points table. The EPL (English Premiere League) gives 3 for a win, 1 for a draw, and 0 for a loss. If 2 teams have the same number of points, the goal difference is used to determine the winner (that is the difference between goals for and goals against for a particular team). Rugby uses a similar thing for points for and against in case of a tie (at least in the Super 14).
If the system revolved around a win/loss record, there would be no ties, it’s as simple as that. And to say that you play to win is asinine, I am pretty sure professional soccer players don’t walk onto the field going “Man, I am really aiming for a draw today, winning is for douches!”
I hope this post educated you a little bit more.
[quote]Ren wrote:
Headhunter wrote:
Dr Stig wrote:
There is a distinct Pavlovian quality to the posts round here these days.
Word.
Note that I have been to China (Beijing, Foshin, and Guanzhou) and I didn’t see ANYONE playing soccer. They were too busy either making things to sell to us, begging, or raiding the dumpster behind the McDonald’s.
All I did was note an odd correlation between soccer and Test levels…kind of like smoking and cancer, maybe?
More like the decline of pirates with the increase in global warming.[/quote]
Piracy is on the rise and the global temp has actually slightly cooled since 1998. Hmmm.
Still small compared to soccer. The pool from which soccer draws its players is much larger than any other sport in the world. To be a pro in, for example England, you are competing not only against English born players but some of the best players from around the world. I would bet that cricket is more popular than rugby.
I found this on a UK based forum.
Is there any truth to the points the poster offers as reasons?
[quote]My belief as to why Football won’t take of in the United States is down to Class Structure and Sex.
Whilst in Jamaica for my sister’s wedding in 1998, I ended up in a Holiday romance with a Boston Socialite. As the days went by it became more apparent I was sleeping with a Millionaires Daughter, but being British, I decided it was best to play the gentleman and not offer to marry her. Anyways, this is a Football in the US Thread, what am I chatting about. Yeah that’s right, so after a good session in bed one afternoon, I switch the TV on to see what was on, I eventually found ESPN 2 who were broadcasting a live MLS Soccer game, so I asked her “Do you ever watch the Footie back home?” (bang! goes my James Bond gimmick in full Scouse glory) She replied very disgusted “NO!!!..thats something our Cleaners and maids families watch! Do I look like a wetback (Mexican) to you?”
Eventually she explained that not many people admit to liking Soccer down to two things;
I was amazed by this to be honest, and most Americans I’ve spoken to since back up these sentiments to a degree (mainly white Americans).
And to back it up even more, MLS (up to 2004 and might still do) assign players to clubs based on Ethnic backgrounds (Mexicans = Texas,LA, Europeans = New York, New England and so on). Chivas USA is a club that was placed in the MLS to strictly appeal to Hispanics, so in reality, Americans won’t see this game as something they can get involved in. Maybe in 20/30 Years time, when 2nd/3rd Generation migrants grow up, it will take off more, but we’ll have to wait and see.[/quote]
[quote]zecarlo wrote:
Still small compared to soccer. The pool from which soccer draws its players is much larger than any other sport in the world. To be a pro in, for example England, you are competing not only against English born players but some of the best players from around the world. I would bet that cricket is more popular than rugby.[/quote]
Rugby is the number two sport in the UK, and I believe the same in France. I think it’s third in Ireland behind Hurling and Gaelic football (but I could be wrong on that). It’s the national sport of Wales, last I checked. To get a spot on a pro rugby team in England means you’re competing against English, Welsh, Scottish, Irish, French, Italian, and even New Zealand and Australian born players. I believe there’s even a few Americans playing in the RFU now (not that any of the brits will admit it).
And that’s just England. Look at the southern Hemisphere. Rugby is the national sport in NZ and South Africa, number 2 or 3 in Australia, growing in South America (Argentina’s ranked 6th in the world) Fiji, Samoa, etc… Pretty much all the island nations have good international squads.
I’m not saying it’s as big as soccer, but I promise you, it’s quite a bit bigger than you’d imagine.
[quote]zecarlo wrote:
Still small compared to soccer. The pool from which soccer draws its players is much larger than any other sport in the world. To be a pro in, for example England, you are competing not only against English born players but some of the best players from around the world. I would bet that cricket is more popular than rugby.[/quote]
In the summer it obviously is, in the winter, not so much.
[quote]Mr90210 wrote:
I found this on a UK based forum.
Is there any truth to the points the poster offers as reasons?
My belief as to why Football won’t take of in the United States is down to Class Structure and Sex.
Whilst in Jamaica for my sister’s wedding in 1998, I ended up in a Holiday romance with a Boston Socialite. As the days went by it became more apparent I was sleeping with a Millionaires Daughter, but being British, I decided it was best to play the gentleman and not offer to marry her. Anyways, this is a Football in the US Thread, what am I chatting about. Yeah that’s right, so after a good session in bed one afternoon, I switch the TV on to see what was on, I eventually found ESPN 2 who were broadcasting a live MLS Soccer game, so I asked her “Do you ever watch the Footie back home?” (bang! goes my James Bond gimmick in full Scouse glory) She replied very disgusted “NO!!!..thats something our Cleaners and maids families watch! Do I look like a wetback (Mexican) to you?”
Eventually she explained that not many people admit to liking Soccer down to two things;
I was amazed by this to be honest, and most Americans I’ve spoken to since back up these sentiments to a degree (mainly white Americans).
And to back it up even more, MLS (up to 2004 and might still do) assign players to clubs based on Ethnic backgrounds (Mexicans = Texas,LA, Europeans = New York, New England and so on). Chivas USA is a club that was placed in the MLS to strictly appeal to Hispanics, so in reality, Americans won’t see this game as something they can get involved in. Maybe in 20/30 Years time, when 2nd/3rd Generation migrants grow up, it will take off more, but we’ll have to wait and see.
[/quote]
Well, I believe those points were a lot more valid in 1998 than they are now. Soccer has gained a lot of ground in the US over the past 5 or 10 years. In '98, the only games ever televised were on spanish TV (Telemundo around here), so yes, it was associated with foreigners and the hispanic population.
Now the MLS is on ESPN every weekend, FSN does a lot of premiership games, the world cup was covered completely for the first time last year, etc… As to the second point, yeah, 10 or 15 years ago soccer was more of a kids game in the US. But guess what, all those kids have grown up now and many still love the sport. MLS is growing in popularity every year, especially right now with Beckham signing with LA (god I can’t wait to watch the revs destroy them).
The following is very different than the rest of the world though. From what I’ve heard, soccer matches in Europe have the same sort of atmosphere as football games in the states. Drinking, tailgating, loud raucous behavior, etc… Soccer in the US has become more of a family oriented event. You go to an MLS game and the majority of the fans are younger families. The kids play soccer, so they want to see it.
The games are never that crowded, there’s always tickets available day of game. And they’re cheap. In New England, you pay at least 70 bucks for a standing room only ticket to a Pats game. The most expensive Revs tickets are 34, and the cheap 18 dollar seats are lower level, just in the corners not center field.
I dunno, I like the game, I’m by no means a die hard fan. I like more violence (I play rugby, used to play hockey, and love football). But I see soccer gaining more popularity every year as more and more kids who played it when younger grow up with the game.
Headhunter:
Brilliant thread! Responses are absolutely Pavlovian. I love it. Wow, soccer is played by more people in the world than any other sport?
Yo Mama:
My respect for you grows and grows. A rugby playing, weightlifting, rock 'n rolling, soccer player eatin, Yale trained biochemist. Damn.
[quote]Mr90210 wrote:
I found this on a UK based forum.
Is there any truth to the points the poster offers as reasons?
… She replied very disgusted “NO!!!..thats something our Cleaners and maids families watch! Do I look like a wetback (Mexican) to you?”
Eventually she explained that not many people admit to liking Soccer down to two things;
[/quote]
This is bullshit
This is true.
MLS would be smart to appeal to its existing fan base but I have no idea if they do this.
The main reason Americans don’t watch it is because w efind our other sports more exciting.
[quote]deputydawg wrote:
Headhunter:
Brilliant thread! Responses are absolutely Pavlovian. I love it. Wow, soccer is played by more people in the world than any other sport?
Yo Mama:
My respect for you grows and grows. A rugby playing, weightlifting, rock 'n rolling, soccer player eatin, Yale trained biochemist. Damn.[/quote]
Thanks, Dawg. Just trying to stay out of jail and under the radar. You gotta do something to make a legal living.
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
I just think its an interesting anomaly. Americans, for the most part, don’t view soccer as a serious game. And c’mon, I watched some of the World Cup farce, guys flopping to the pitch, screaming, “Ref, he broke my pinkie nail! How will I hold up that pinkie while drinking my soy latte?!” Then the moron who head butts another. Then people celebrating a tie! I know that meant that one team advanced but celebrating a TIE?? Americans rarely celebrate a tie, we play to win.[/quote]
Don’t you have some kids lives to ruin with your “teaching”?
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Then the moron who head butts another.
[/quote]
Are you seriously that ignorant? I assume you are referring to Zidane, one of the most gifted players of his generation.
And I doubt that any team gets ready for a game and says “You know what, I think I’ll just aim for a tie today.” Of course you play to win, that’s the point.
Here’s a reason why this guys testosterone might be decreasing. Although until tonight I never realized that grabber was the same guy who was in movies like Snatch, X-Men, Gone in 60 Seconds etc.
[quote]Kuz wrote:
Headhunter wrote:
I just think its an interesting anomaly. Americans, for the most part, don’t view soccer as a serious game. And c’mon, I watched some of the World Cup farce, guys flopping to the pitch, screaming, “Ref, he broke my pinkie nail! How will I hold up that pinkie while drinking my soy latte?!” Then the moron who head butts another. Then people celebrating a tie! I know that meant that one team advanced but celebrating a TIE?? Americans rarely celebrate a tie, we play to win.
Don’t you have some kids lives to ruin with your “teaching”?[/quote]
Pavlov strikes again!!! :>
[quote]burntfrenchfry wrote:
Headhunter wrote:
Then the moron who head butts another.
Are you seriously that ignorant? I assume you are referring to Zidane, one of the most gifted players of his generation.
we play to win.
And I doubt that any team gets ready for a game and says “You know what, I think I’ll just aim for a tie today.” Of course you play to win, that’s the point.[/quote]
The soccer players were celebrating a TIE! Sure, that meant they got to go on in the tournament, but they were whooping it up over a TIE! “Wow, we fought the Nazis to a TIE!! High fives everybody!!” Pathetic…
Who Invented Soccer?
“Soccer was invented by European ladies to keep themselves busy while their husbands did the cooking.”
— Hank Hill
(King of the Hill)
