[quote]BantamRunner wrote:
I remember watching a TUF episode a few seasons ago when two guys were going at it outside by the pool throwing kicks and shit and it got taken down and the dude on bottom tried an armbar and got his ass lifted up and his skull through the concrete. The other guys were making jokes about high kicks and BJJ in a streetfight.
Two things you can’t do in an MMA fight these days but would be highly effective in a street fight: thumb in the eye, thumb in the throat…preferably in that order…then a nice elbow or kick to the back of the head.[/quote]
[quote]rundymc wrote:
Groin manipulation as well.[/quote]
and fish hooking
and grabbing the hair and using it to control opponent’s head/body
and kicking the head of a downed opponent
and attacking the back of the head/spine area
and small joint manipulation (finger/toe locking)
and downward elbows strikes with the point of the elbow
and using the nostrils to manipulate opponent’s head
and using the ears to manipulate opponent’s head
etc…
etc…
etc…
Let’s face it, the UFC is a sport with rules. It is not real combat, and not a true “fight”. Anyone who argues against that fact is simply living in a fantasy land.
That doesn’t mean that many of the techniques/skills found within MMA competitions can’t be applied to self defense/combative situations though. You’ve just gotta know the difference and actually train specific to whichever goal you choose to pursue, be it sport or reality.
[quote]legendaryblaze wrote:
Big_Boss wrote:
legendaryblaze wrote:
jiujitsumania wrote:
break his clavicle and his arms stop working
How does this work?
and how do you break a clavicle?
With hammerfist…elbow strikes…at least in my training background. But I have no idea in what context they are talking breaking a clavicle.
That i understood, but i think it would be somewhat difficult to actually break a clavicle in practice.[/quote]
That I’m not so sure about that either…but the way the clavicle sits,I could see it with a well-placed strike…more so the force of an elbow strike. But within a “tussle” I think that would be difficult to make happen…but still possible.
clavicle snatch- jam the fingers into the base of the throat and snatch straight down. I’ve never tried it but it seems like it might work as a last resort.
I am a bit late to the party on this thread but my $0.02 is that pretty much all of the useful self defence applicable techniques that you will learn in BJJ will be the ones they teach you in the first 2 or 3 lessons. Everything after that is teaching you how to compete in a sport against someone else using the same rule set.
There are BJJ schools that have a ‘self defence’ focus but as Irish has mentioned, most of this is talking physical techniques when they should be talking about the mental side.
That said, BJJ does teach you some attributes that might be useful in a self defence situation. You are used to being in very uncomfortable or painful positions, you can scramble well and have trained to stay on your feet when someone is trying to take you down, you have a good understanding of leverage and which directions bits of the human body don’t like to be bent in and you should be in good physical condition.
Having stated all of the above, most of the guys who train systems that are designed ‘foor the streets’ are being totally ripped off and given a false sense of security. And for most people that consider that they need to be training for the streets, there first concern should be addressing their lifestyle as this is probably contributing to this need.
In terms of increasing your chances of living to old age in health, for most people, the money spent on a self defence course would be far better spent on an advanced driving course and ensuring that the tyre pressures on their car are correct.
I agree for the most part, but just to expand on your point, I’d say its not the submissions taught so much as knowing the basic positions in ground fighting and how to get them (or out of them).
Take a beginner in BJJ, like those currently at my school. Their base is weak, they have little concept of a scramble and even less on how to control its outcome. When they get a good position they have trouble holding it. When they get in a bad position, they don’t know how to escape.
In three months or so, however, many of them start to understand the positional game. Their base strengthens. When two of them get in a scramble there is an actual battle for positional dominance as opposed to a wait and see approach. They reach that point where they might be able to handle themselves on the ground if a real fight got there. In a year or two, they might be formidable in a ground fight.
You can teach all a guy has to know about groundfighting for self defense in three good days, but for him to reach a point where any of this knowledge can applied takes time.
[quote]Big_Boss wrote:
rundymc wrote:
Groin manipulation as well.
Yeah,HolyMac speaks highly of this. [/quote]
yeah well, imagine you’re about to have to fight this crazy 225+lb dude, when all of a sudden he drops his pants and starts wanking.
fuck yeah you’re gonna freak. kept me out of a lot of fights.
irish, i really don’t see the problem of home defense with a carbine sized gun in 5.56. it’s what i train with the most, especially under CQB senarios, and would feel very confidant with it. if i’m going to investigate crazy shit in my house, you bet i’m walking down with my rifle and not my pistol.
[quote]rundymc wrote:
I agree for the most part, but just to expand on your point, I’d say its not the submissions taught so much as knowing the basic positions in ground fighting and how to get them (or out of them).
Take a beginner in BJJ, like those currently at my school. Their base is weak, they have little concept of a scramble and even less on how to control its outcome. When they get a good position they have trouble holding it. When they get in a bad position, they don’t know how to escape.
In three months or so, however, many of them start to understand the positional game. Their base strengthens. When two of them get in a scramble there is an actual battle for positional dominance as opposed to a wait and see approach. They reach that point where they might be able to handle themselves on the ground if a real fight got there. In a year or two, they might be formidable in a ground fight.
You can teach all a guy has to know about groundfighting for self defense in three good days, but for him to reach a point where any of this knowledge can applied takes time.[/quote]
I wasn’t talking really about submissions. I was talking about standing up in base, the hip bump sweep, the upa, the prayer position and wrapping someone up. Of course someone that has been training a long time should be far better at these however it is these basic movements that would be most likely to save your life.
[quote]HolyMacaroni wrote:
Big_Boss wrote:
rundymc wrote:
Groin manipulation as well.
Yeah,HolyMac speaks highly of this.
yeah well, imagine you’re about to have to fight this crazy 225+lb dude, when all of a sudden he drops his pants and starts wanking.
fuck yeah you’re gonna freak. kept me out of a lot of fights.
[/quote]
LOL.
[quote]
irish, i really don’t see the problem of home defense with a carbine sized gun in 5.56. it’s what i train with the most, especially under CQB senarios, and would feel very confidant with it. if i’m going to investigate crazy shit in my house, you bet i’m walking down with my rifle and not my pistol.[/quote]
Could be. I’m sure you know more about guns than I do. I was just suggesting the basic nature of the weapon.