Seal Team Six...Again!

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
61

[quote]Sloth wrote:

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:

[quote]Sloth wrote:

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
You can disparage me but you cannot disparage logic.

The government has lied in the past which makes it untenable as a source of information regarding itself.

The news media gets all of its information about government from government so then…?

I’ll let you figure it out on your own.

Nothwithstanding, even if this story is true how does it change the fact that it could have been a different outcome that would have been better for US government foreign relations?[/quote]

What the heck is wrong with you?
[/quote]

I like to ask questions that spit at your value system.
[/quote]

But they don’t even accomplish that, being so detached from reality.
[/quote]

Just because you cannot conceive of a reality where they can be answered does not mean they are detached from reality.

64

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:

[quote]TheTexican wrote:

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
Yeah, I know…but…and just hear me out: could they have used nonlethal ways to capture these individuals?

Sure. The benefit would have served US propaganda much better around he world.

Instead of having just an American Hero propaganda story for Americans it could have been a message to the rest of the world that the American military is actually “fighting for justice”.

Just saying…seems like most of these “adventures” are poorly thought out – at least in terms of international PR.[/quote]

Non-lethal ways to conduct hostage rescue operations from kidnappers in Somalia? You can lead the first non-lethal raid into a hostile area like that and let us all know how this ends up. Have you ever been shot at? Faced a hostile individual with a weapon? Wake up from your dream and realize the world doesn’t work that way. I take it your time in the military/law enforcement gave you the experience to understand these ideas are valid ones?[/quote]

So you’re telling me these super-top-secret-ninja-warrior-assassins are not actually that badass?

My time in the military taught me not to trust people that ask me to “jump on grenades” for their causes.[/quote]

One: When did I say anything wasn’t badass? Don’t create new debates.

Two: How does “jumping on a grenade” even apply to rescuing hostages, one of whom, would have died soon without medical care, from their captors??

America DID serve justice in this case. Humans had been abducted, against their wills, held at gunpoint, and without basic necessities. There was NO other way to free them than what had already taken place. The hostage takers were NOT going to free them. Maybe you should have written them a nice letter requesting a trade for some muffins or possibly even offer the hostage takers asylum in the US and free citizenship. I’m sure there are a few homes in your neighborhood who could take them in. Even you, oh champion of the world, would you be willing to take them in and educate them in the humane and fair treatment of others?

65

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:

Just because you cannot conceive of a reality where they can be answered does not mean they are detached from reality.[/quote]

Seriously though, some of the stuff you say is just to mess with folks, right? Right?!

66

What is the point of noncontroversial debate?

Don’t get me wrong, I am being completely honest about my beliefs.

67

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]Gkhan wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:
Also, I am pretty sure that the original seal team died in a helicopter crash.

That pilot was, dare I say it, mediocre…[/quote]

he fucking got shot down, idiot.[/quote]

He was the first to lose a Chinook since 2005.

Just saying.[/quote]

Seems like we had a good run, eh?

68

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:

[quote]Gkhan wrote:

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
9 people died for 2 people. [/quote]

didn’t the pirates understand the risk when they took these people hostage?

They played,

they paid.[/quote]

No doubt. Just seems like all criminals should be afforded a trial by jury.

This is just one more feather in Obama’s cap and nothing more.[/quote]

Who’s gonna try um? The Hague?

70

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
Yeah, I know…but…and just hear me out: could they have used nonlethal ways to capture these individuals?
[/quote]

How on earth would they do this? Walk up to a camp, every guy has an AK-47 or RPG, and say, “Please drop your weapons and put your hands behind your back, you are all under arrest.”? They would be blasted to hell before the could even start the miranda rights…

and if these guys did lay down their weapons, what would the odds be that they would be allowed to leave the country unharmed?

Serious, how would you capture these guys to try them?

71

[quote]TheTexican wrote:

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:

[quote]TheTexican wrote:

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
Yeah, I know…but…and just hear me out: could they have used nonlethal ways to capture these individuals?

Sure. The benefit would have served US propaganda much better around he world.

Instead of having just an American Hero propaganda story for Americans it could have been a message to the rest of the world that the American military is actually “fighting for justice”.

Just saying…seems like most of these “adventures” are poorly thought out – at least in terms of international PR.[/quote]

Non-lethal ways to conduct hostage rescue operations from kidnappers in Somalia? You can lead the first non-lethal raid into a hostile area like that and let us all know how this ends up. Have you ever been shot at? Faced a hostile individual with a weapon? Wake up from your dream and realize the world doesn’t work that way. I take it your time in the military/law enforcement gave you the experience to understand these ideas are valid ones?[/quote]

So you’re telling me these super-top-secret-ninja-warrior-assassins are not actually that badass?

My time in the military taught me not to trust people that ask me to “jump on grenades” for their causes.[/quote]

One: When did I say anything wasn’t badass? Don’t create new debates.

Two: How does “jumping on a grenade” even apply to rescuing hostages, one of whom, would have died soon without medical care, from their captors??

America DID serve justice in this case. Humans had been abducted, against their wills, held at gunpoint, and without basic necessities. There was NO other way to free them than what had already taken place. The hostage takers were NOT going to free them. Maybe you should have written them a nice letter requesting a trade for some muffins or possibly even offer the hostage takers asylum in the US and free citizenship. I’m sure there are a few homes in your neighborhood who could take them in. Even you, oh champion of the world, would you be willing to take them in and educate them in the humane and fair treatment of others?[/quote]

Just because something happens does that make it necessary that it happened that way?

This is a legitimately philosophical question.

If we cannot discuss what ought to be versus what is then there is no point to PWI or any philosophical debate in general.

The point I am trying to make is whether it is in the interest of American foreign policy that it happened this specific way?

What if it did not even really happen?

What if this is just a propaganda story for the Obama administration to sell to the American public?

I don’t see why I should be marginalized for these perfectly legitimate questions.

73

[quote]pushharder wrote:
I think in your perfect anarchic state where one day you had to defend yourself and your loved ones you’d be such a worthless pussy asking all these questions that your loved ones could never count on you for their lives. You’d pontificate while they died. You wouldn’t be noble and provocative, you’d be a dumbass who sacrificed those who depended on you.

Or maybe not? If not, we’d all know that your foolish talk here was just demagoguery.[/quote]

Your worldview is dominated by fear.

Make sure to check for monsters under your bed before you go to sleep tonight.

75

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:

[quote]Mufasa wrote:
Nice “Thread Kill” attempt, Lift.
[/quote]

If you want to masturbate over the military that is your right. By all means. Continue.
[/quote]

Sounds like somebody got the Big Chicken Dinner. Amiright Lifty?

76

Push, do you sometimes dream about being a super hero – someone who is not afraid of big bad monsters?

77

[quote]Sloth wrote:

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
You can disparage me but you cannot disparage logic.

The government has lied in the past which makes it untenable as a source of information regarding itself.

The news media gets all of its information about government from government so then…?

I’ll let you figure it out on your own.

Nothwithstanding, even if this story is true how does it change the fact that it could have been a different outcome that would have been better for US government foreign relations?[/quote]

What the heck is wrong with you?
[/quote]

Eh…
This is the guy who was talking about how it was super fun to go drunk driving.

Want a nightmare?
Just think of all those who agree with him but don’t post.

78

[quote]mcdugga wrote:

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:

[quote]Mufasa wrote:
Nice “Thread Kill” attempt, Lift.
[/quote]

If you want to masturbate over the military that is your right. By all means. Continue.
[/quote]

Sounds like somebody got the Big Chicken Dinner. Amiright Lifty?[/quote]

Nope. I followed orders and kept my costume neat and tidy.

80

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:

[quote]TheTexican wrote:

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:

[quote]TheTexican wrote:

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
Yeah, I know…but…and just hear me out: could they have used nonlethal ways to capture these individuals?

Sure. The benefit would have served US propaganda much better around he world.

Instead of having just an American Hero propaganda story for Americans it could have been a message to the rest of the world that the American military is actually “fighting for justice”.

Just saying…seems like most of these “adventures” are poorly thought out – at least in terms of international PR.[/quote]

Non-lethal ways to conduct hostage rescue operations from kidnappers in Somalia? You can lead the first non-lethal raid into a hostile area like that and let us all know how this ends up. Have you ever been shot at? Faced a hostile individual with a weapon? Wake up from your dream and realize the world doesn’t work that way. I take it your time in the military/law enforcement gave you the experience to understand these ideas are valid ones?[/quote]

So you’re telling me these super-top-secret-ninja-warrior-assassins are not actually that badass?

My time in the military taught me not to trust people that ask me to “jump on grenades” for their causes.[/quote]

One: When did I say anything wasn’t badass? Don’t create new debates.

Two: How does “jumping on a grenade” even apply to rescuing hostages, one of whom, would have died soon without medical care, from their captors??

America DID serve justice in this case. Humans had been abducted, against their wills, held at gunpoint, and without basic necessities. There was NO other way to free them than what had already taken place. The hostage takers were NOT going to free them. Maybe you should have written them a nice letter requesting a trade for some muffins or possibly even offer the hostage takers asylum in the US and free citizenship. I’m sure there are a few homes in your neighborhood who could take them in. Even you, oh champion of the world, would you be willing to take them in and educate them in the humane and fair treatment of others?[/quote]

Just because something happens does that make it necessary that it happened that way?

This is a legitimately philosophical question.

If we cannot discuss what ought to be versus what is then there is no point to PWI or any philosophical debate in general.

The point I am trying to make is whether it is in the interest of American foreign policy that it happened this specific way?

What if it did not even really happen?

What if this is just a propaganda story for the Obama administration to sell to the American public?

I don’t see why I should be marginalized for these perfectly legitimate questions.[/quote]

You created answers and quetions on my behalf… that’s just ridiculous.

I do believe this was in our best interest. We rescued hostages in a life threatening situation with precision. No unnecessary lives were lost. You may think, or at least debate, the captors should have been spared, but I see no way for that scenario to play out. They had been given a chance to surrender. Multiple, if memory serves correct.

Aswer my legitimate question, then. Do you believe we should have offered them citizenship in return for the captors? You value their lives don’t you? Do you want them to have a fair shake in life?

This event did happen. I know that for a fact.