Science vs the Fructose/HFCS Conspiracy

Nutrition
121

[quote]staticx wrote:

[quote]Stronghold wrote:

[quote]staticx wrote:

[quote]Stronghold wrote:

[quote]honkie wrote:

[quote]Mikael LS wrote:
Can you people post the studies supporting your claims? It is considered bad argumentaion to talk about studies without actually referencing them. [/quote]

You’re kidding right? Have you not even read “Seeds of Deception”? There are a ton of studies and references in that book alone.

Then there is “Genetic Roulette” That goes through many of the studies and breaks them down more simply.

There are just too many to put them up here but all it takes is 5 minutes of research to find them. I recommend you get the books and read them.

Here is some more info.

http://www.celsias.com/article/monsanto-submitted-fake-scientific-data-says-forme/

http://foodfreedom.wordpress.com/2010/02/22/health-scandal-of-the-decade-�??�??�?�¢??-monsanto�??�??�?�¢??s-gmo-perversion-of-food/

http://corporatecrime.wordpress.com/2009/10/17/monsanto-lies-again-and-again-and-again/

http://www.infowars.com/gmo-scandal-the-long-term-effects-of-genetically-modified-food-on-humans/

http://www.infowars.com/death-of-the-bees-gmo-crops-and-the-decline-of-bee-colonies-in-north-america/

[/quote]

So your sources are 4 amateur websites (wordpress, anyone?), Huffington Post, and TWO links to Alex Jones’ website?

(For those who don’t know who Alex Jones is, he’s the head conspiracy nutjob around the US and thinks the gubment is responsible for 9/11 and for spraying the population with mind control chemicals from airliners.)

Another perspective:

Oh, and for the idiot claiming Alan’s opinion wasn’t valid because he wasn’t an MD, your argument is faulty. There are THOUSANDS of MD’s who completely disagree with the fructose alarmism hypothesis.[/quote]

What are your views on GMO then?

In regards to the 9/11 comment, if you honestly believe the BS that’s been fed to you by mainstream media outlets and the governments lies, I feel sorry for you.

[/quote]

By identifying yourself as a 9/11 truther, you are qualifying that you have little regard for actual science but rather cherrypick information that seems to support your paranoid conspiracy theories. There are numerous threads on this board devoted to truthers so let’s not get our whackjob conspiracies mixed up in this thread.

I don’t believe everything that the “gubment” says, but I believe the science and the real science says 9/11 truthers are wrong. If your idea of “do your own research” is to read some partial or irrelevant information from some conspiracy nut’s blog, then you should probably get off of the internet and go find yourself a job with your name on your shirt because this science and learnin’ thing isn’t for you.

My views on GMO are a very scientific “it depends”. There are so many applications to which that term applies, it is intellectually dishonest to throw everything under one label and call it bad. Running around thinking the sky is falling because food is GMO is about as general and idiotic as running around thinking that the sky is falling because your food is “processed” or “unorganic”.[/quote]

And you are a naysayer desperately clamoring for anything to stop the wild runaway popularity and growing credibility of the 9/11 Truth Movement.Watch the video before assuming anything else about me.

Actually I happen to read a lot more than just Alex Jones websites,and you know nothing of my qualifications and background.

Do you have any idea of the science involved in producing genetically engineered products?
[/quote]

I’m done arguing with you. I don’t need to know about your qualifications and background because if you do happen to be in a science related field, chances are, by your posts here, you are VERY bad at your job.

The truther videos that I am familiar with are incomplete, inconclusive, and a total sham. Truthers routinely cherry pick information and leave out things that don’t fit their proposed scenarios. ALL of those myths have been routinely debunked, but its hard to argue with paranoids who really do think the sky is falling.

There is no run away popularity of the “Truther” movement. It’s been nearly 9 years since the attacks and the majority of the population still thinks the .0005% of you who believe that shit are idiots.

I don’t have enough knowledge of the process behind creating GMO foods to comment on SPECIFIC situations, so unlike you, I am refraining from making GENERAL, UNQUALIFIED statements on it. Like I already stated, it’s a blanket term that paranoids like yourself throw out there because you think that everyone is out to get you.

Do you also believe that the government has been spraying us with mind controlling chemicals via the high altitude vapor trails left by airliners?

Now run along and play with your trucks, Chicken Little.

122

They don’t need to even spray you. What do you think is in your water. The Nazi’s used fluoride in the concentration camps to control the prisoners. Anyone with half a brain can research how toxic fluoride is.

Building 7 was not hit by any plane and only had a few small fires so care to explain how it manage to collapse at the rate of free-fall - which has never seen in any fire before anywhere in the world in history.

Why no one comment on the underwear bomber? Because the FBI finally admitted that he was led onto the plane bypassing security by a US agent and boarded the plane with no passport.

How about the Iraq war - weapons of mass destruction… NO. Links to al-Qaeda… No. So these were the reasons for going in there but both were lies.

Why don’t you look back in history a little… how about the Vietnam war - what was the event that brought the US into that war?

I guess you believe JFK was killed by Oswald.

Let’s just look at last years H1N1 “scare” that claimed millions of lives… oh wait another lie… why does the CDC refuse to release data on those that did die if they had received the H1N1 vaccine… last year was the lowest death rate for a flu season in 20 years yet was the lowest vaccines given in 20 years… strange???

123

[quote]supertrain-int wrote:

[quote]honkie wrote:

So explain what happened to building 7[/quote]

Seriously dude. google it - popular mechanics is a good start (World Trade Center 7 Report Puts 9/11 Conspiracy Theory to Rest). Even wikipedia because it at least references it sources!

Please surprise me with a non-conspiracy theory response![/quote]

The 9/11 truth movement has debunked Popular Mechanic’s experts, and their false 9/11 claims.

Popular Mechanics is owned by a war profiteer.

Enough said

124

After this I’m done with you. Do some real research on the “small fires” and “collapse at the rate of free fall”-both of which are things fabricated by the truther movement.

If the CDC had not pushed the swine flu vaccine as they had and an outbreak occurred that killed millions, paranoids like you would be screaming conspiracy at the top of your lungs claiming that the gubment covered up the threat in order to thin the population.

Flu vaccinations do not protect from all strains of the virus and I want to see citations of those statistics you are throwing out there since the only ones I have found point to HIGHER vaccination rates for the standard influenza vaccination.

Now, since you don’t know what the fuck you are talking about in regards to anything, ESPECIALLY fructose since you’re ranting about mind control and wild conspiracies, please bow out of this thread unless you have something worthwhile to contribute.

125

[quote]Stronghold wrote:

[quote]staticx wrote:

[quote]Stronghold wrote:

[quote]staticx wrote:

[quote]Stronghold wrote:

[quote]honkie wrote:

[quote]Mikael LS wrote:
Can you people post the studies supporting your claims? It is considered bad argumentaion to talk about studies without actually referencing them. [/quote]

You’re kidding right? Have you not even read “Seeds of Deception”? There are a ton of studies and references in that book alone.

Then there is “Genetic Roulette” That goes through many of the studies and breaks them down more simply.

There are just too many to put them up here but all it takes is 5 minutes of research to find them. I recommend you get the books and read them.

Here is some more info.

http://www.celsias.com/article/monsanto-submitted-fake-scientific-data-says-forme/

http://foodfreedom.wordpress.com/2010/02/22/health-scandal-of-the-decade-�??�??�??�?�¢??-monsanto�??�??�??�?�¢??s-gmo-perversion-of-food/

http://corporatecrime.wordpress.com/2009/10/17/monsanto-lies-again-and-again-and-again/

http://www.infowars.com/gmo-scandal-the-long-term-effects-of-genetically-modified-food-on-humans/

http://www.infowars.com/death-of-the-bees-gmo-crops-and-the-decline-of-bee-colonies-in-north-america/

[/quote]

So your sources are 4 amateur websites (wordpress, anyone?), Huffington Post, and TWO links to Alex Jones’ website?

(For those who don’t know who Alex Jones is, he’s the head conspiracy nutjob around the US and thinks the gubment is responsible for 9/11 and for spraying the population with mind control chemicals from airliners.)

Another perspective:

Oh, and for the idiot claiming Alan’s opinion wasn’t valid because he wasn’t an MD, your argument is faulty. There are THOUSANDS of MD’s who completely disagree with the fructose alarmism hypothesis.[/quote]

What are your views on GMO then?

In regards to the 9/11 comment, if you honestly believe the BS that’s been fed to you by mainstream media outlets and the governments lies, I feel sorry for you.

[/quote]

By identifying yourself as a 9/11 truther, you are qualifying that you have little regard for actual science but rather cherrypick information that seems to support your paranoid conspiracy theories. There are numerous threads on this board devoted to truthers so let’s not get our whackjob conspiracies mixed up in this thread.

I don’t believe everything that the “gubment” says, but I believe the science and the real science says 9/11 truthers are wrong. If your idea of “do your own research” is to read some partial or irrelevant information from some conspiracy nut’s blog, then you should probably get off of the internet and go find yourself a job with your name on your shirt because this science and learnin’ thing isn’t for you.

My views on GMO are a very scientific “it depends”. There are so many applications to which that term applies, it is intellectually dishonest to throw everything under one label and call it bad. Running around thinking the sky is falling because food is GMO is about as general and idiotic as running around thinking that the sky is falling because your food is “processed” or “unorganic”.[/quote]

And you are a naysayer desperately clamoring for anything to stop the wild runaway popularity and growing credibility of the 9/11 Truth Movement.Watch the video before assuming anything else about me.

Actually I happen to read a lot more than just Alex Jones websites,and you know nothing of my qualifications and background.

Do you have any idea of the science involved in producing genetically engineered products?
[/quote]

I’m done arguing with you. I don’t need to know about your qualifications and background because if you do happen to be in a science related field, chances are, by your posts here, you are VERY bad at your job.

The truther videos that I am familiar with are incomplete, inconclusive, and a total sham. Truthers routinely cherry pick information and leave out things that don’t fit their proposed scenarios. ALL of those myths have been routinely debunked, but its hard to argue with paranoids who really do think the sky is falling.

There is no run away popularity of the “Truther” movement. It’s been nearly 9 years since the attacks and the majority of the population still thinks the .0005% of you who believe that shit are idiots.

I don’t have enough knowledge of the process behind creating GMO foods to comment on SPECIFIC situations, so unlike you, I am refraining from making GENERAL, UNQUALIFIED statements on it. Like I already stated, it’s a blanket term that paranoids like yourself throw out there because you think that everyone is out to get you.

Do you also believe that the government has been spraying us with mind controlling chemicals via the high altitude vapor trails left by airliners?

Now run along and play with your trucks, Chicken Little.[/quote]

You really dont have a clue, and I wont stoop down to your level of flying off insults.People are waking up to the truth everyday,except for those that are blinded by their own ignorance.As for being paranoid, I just want to be informed and educate my family and the clients I train.

If you knew even a little bit about the science behind genetic engineering you’d be really concerned for yourself and your family.

126

[quote]Josh Rider wrote:

[quote]honkie wrote:

No that is not what we are saying - if you read the original post he gives the impression the HFCS is safe… it’s not - not even looking at the fructose factor you must take in to account the GMO concerns that have been scientifically (but covered up in the US) shown to cause a number of serous health risks… HFCS is all GMO.
[/quote]

“Genetically Modified Organisms” is a buzz word that easily scares people who have no science background since it sounds evil and scientific. Just because something is genetically modified, doesn’t mean it has an increased health risk to humans (although, I’ve heard in some cases, it does). However, I’d be happy to see some solid evidence that HFCS is bad because it is genetically modified and not because of it’s fructose content or the fact that it’s empty calories (I doubt “solid” evidence exists in this regards but still).[/quote]

[quote]Train4sport wrote:
I actually watched about an hour of the video that Deb posted. Maybe he talks more about HFCS near the end, but his point from what I watched was that fructose is bad for you. It doesn’t really matter if it’s from HFCS or sucrose, fructose is metabolized differently by the liver than glucose, and can only be metabolized in the liver (regardless of the source). According to the studies he cited, we are consuming far more fructose (from increased sucrose, HFCS, and fruit juices) than in the past, and that is a factor in the obesity epidemic. His point wasn’t that HFCS causes obesity, it was that an increase in total fructose consumption from any source causes obesity. In regard to athletes, I thought it was interesting that he did say fructose consumption actually works well for quickly restoring depleted liver glycogen stores in high level athletes.

And honkie, while I agree that HFCS is unhealthy, I can’t figure out why you think sucrose is so much better. It’s only 5% difference and as supertrain-int pointed out, in the small intestine it’s already broken down into monosaccharides. So if you consume 100 grams of sucrose or 100 grams of HFCS, in the small intestine the only difference is 55 grams of fructose from HFCS instead of 50 grams of fructose from sucrose. But structurally, the fructose in either case is the same at this point in the digestive system. Also before questioning his education perhaps you should critique your own. Check out this grammar and spelling.

[quote] honkie wrote:
Your assumptions are wrong about the process in which HFCS goes through is the same as sucrose. I will post the studies latter as heading out for brunch (organic restaurant of cause)…More on this latter - have to run… They are not the same as already pointed it out and if you even bothered to read even one of the biochemistry books you say you have you would know this…I can’t believe the level of stupidity on this form especially when I hear comments like this. [/quote] And come on, how hard would it really have been to pull several pertinent references from your books and cite them here? You did say you would post the studies, yet when asked to deliver, you accused supertrain-int of being lazy? Unbelievable
[/quote]
good replies.

127

[quote]Stronghold wrote:
After this I’m done with you. Do some real research on the “small fires” and “collapse at the rate of free fall”-both of which are things fabricated by the truther movement.

If the CDC had not pushed the swine flu vaccine as they had and an outbreak occurred that killed millions, paranoids like you would be screaming conspiracy at the top of your lungs claiming that the gubment covered up the threat in order to thin the population.

Flu vaccinations do not protect from all strains of the virus and I want to see citations of those statistics you are throwing out there since the only ones I have found point to HIGHER vaccination rates for the standard influenza vaccination.

Now, since you don’t know what the fuck you are talking about in regards to anything, ESPECIALLY fructose since you’re ranting about mind control and wild conspiracies, please bow out of this thread unless you have something worthwhile to contribute.[/quote]

I don’t know what I am talking about?

Video does not lie? it’s all on video idiot. Maybe you should do 10sec of research to find the truth.

No one took the H1N1 vaccine - they have hundreds of millions of the vaccine unused because no one would take them.

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/10090/1046768-28.stm

Funny how you didn’t comment on my other points?

128

Coke and orange juice have the same effect on postprandial glucose response.

129

[quote]Stronghold wrote:

Coke and orange juice have the same effect on postprandial glucose response.[/quote]

Nice, just hide your head in the sand.

Why don’t you comment on the points you attempted to debunk - Just try it because we have the truth on our side.