Everyone should be eating organic chicken breasts and broccoli 6 times a day anyway. Maybe some olive oil when you feel frisky.
I respects Alan’s work, I subscribe to his blogs and research reviews but I clearly think that not taking into account HFCS being highly GMO and disastrous to our health is very worrying. Sorry to sound like I’m beating a dead horse here.
“For every expert there is an equal or opposite expert”
[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
Everyone should be eating organic chicken breasts and broccoli 6 times a day anyway. Maybe some olive oil when you feel frisky.
[/quote]
How dare you. I almost died because of olive oil. there should be warnings on the bottle. Doing a shot, if done improperly will make you choke, lol
[quote]jehovasfitness wrote:
To say HFCS is the cause of obesity is one thing, but to deny it’s harmful effects on the body is ludicrous.
Sounds like typical dietitians recommending margarine over butter[/quote]
I love that… They actually are still teaching that.
[quote]honkie wrote:
[quote]jehovasfitness wrote:
To say HFCS is the cause of obesity is one thing, but to deny it’s harmful effects on the body is ludicrous.
Sounds like typical dietitians recommending margarine over butter[/quote]
I love that… They actually are still teaching that.[/quote]
Whats wrong with eating plastic? (LOL), and a favourite of some dieticians is that saturated fat is bad for you! Just goes to show there are always a few bad grapes on the bunch.
But getting back on topic, is it simply okay to say “Dont sweat the small stuff a little bit of HFCS is okay for you” To me that’s like saying a bit of crystal meth is good for you, newsflash both are detrimental to ones health
[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
Everyone should be eating organic chicken breasts and broccoli 6 times a day anyway. Maybe some olive oil when you feel frisky.
[/quote]
x2 Or else your GOING TO DIE…
Eventually like the rest of us.
[quote]staticx wrote:
…
But getting back on topic, is it simply okay to say “Dont sweat the small stuff a little bit of HFCS is okay for you” To me that’s like saying a bit of crystal meth is good for you, newsflash both are detrimental to ones health…
[/quote]
Are you fcken stupid? Equating Crystal Meth to HFCS,niceeee.
I could have used a better EXAMPLE. My only COMPARISON is that HFCS is highly addictive,highly refined and has side-effects,not to mention an effect on neuro-transmitters.
[quote]staticx wrote:
I could have used a better EXAMPLE. My only COMPARISON is that HFCS is highly addictive,highly refined and has side-effects,not to mention an effect on neuro-transmitters.[/quote]
Is there really any research that says a MODERATE dose of HFCS is detrimental to a HUMAN’s health? When I say moderate, I’m talking 50 g or less.
I don’t get why HFCS is made out to be the scapegoat when the real problem is eating too much damn food.
[quote]honkie wrote:
Your assumptions are wrong about the process in which HFCS goes through is the same as sucrose. I will post the studies latter as heading out for brunch (organic restaurant of cause).
[/quote]
How are you going with those references please?
Here Ponce;
This study showed diets isocalorically sweetened with HFCS and sucrose had differences in fat gain.
Also, to chime in on Alan v. Ludwig. Their disagreement seems to be about semantics, references, and application of said knowledge.
However, can we look at target audiences? Those who routinely listen to Alan are athletes and eat healthy diets, their body can probably handle fructose intake and may have degrees of glycogen depletion in the liver (which then, fructose would be fine to ingest)
Ludwig is an endocrinologist, and I believe he stated that he worked with children. Low levels of activity compounded with the excess of HIS target population (people who see an endocrinologist for health reasons aren’t in the best shape) make extrapolating from these studies valid, or so I believe. (As Alan critiqued the studies, saying that the doses were too high to extrapolate from)
Athletes, and most people posting on this site, do not fully understand how eating at a restaurant with family can equate to fructose overload; many people subconsciously go through 2-4 glasses of pop with a meal, something that our demographic would be acutely aware of, but the people Ludwig is trying to reach would not.
HFCS is not the sole problem, it’s part of it as that shit is nearly in EVERYTHING. I avoid the stuff and if you take a look at the ingredient profiles of most foods people eat nowadays, alongside other crap (e.g. hydrogenated oils) you see it right there next to all of it.
Bottom line most people are eating over maintenance with their calorie intakes and way too much sugar. HFCS is contributing to this because of how cheap and great it’s shelf life is. To deny that, is naive.
[quote]silverhydra wrote:
Here Ponce;
This study showed diets isocalorically sweetened with HFCS and sucrose had differences in fat gain.
Also, to chime in on Alan v. Ludwig. Their disagreement seems to be about semantics, references, and application of said knowledge.
However, can we look at target audiences? Those who routinely listen to Alan are athletes and eat healthy diets, their body can probably handle fructose intake and may have degrees of glycogen depletion in the liver (which then, fructose would be fine to ingest)
Ludwig is an endocrinologist, and I believe he stated that he worked with children. Low levels of activity compounded with the excess of HIS target population (people who see an endocrinologist for health reasons aren’t in the best shape) make extrapolating from these studies valid, or so I believe. (As Alan critiqued the studies, saying that the doses were too high to extrapolate from)
Athletes, and most people posting on this site, do not fully understand how eating at a restaurant with family can equate to fructose overload; many people subconsciously go through 2-4 glasses of pop with a meal, something that our demographic would be acutely aware of, but the people Ludwig is trying to reach would not.[/quote]
Interesting rat study, I’ll try to pull it and get more details if they will follow up in humans and see if they discuss why their research doesn;t agree (which usually happens in the discussion session). Not sure if you would normally be convinced with animal studies - especially when human data is available. Sounds like it is hot off the presses, so they may have doone something different.
Not understanding your issue with Alan’s work, he may work with athletes but the research he was quoting wasn’t done on athletes, nor was he sharing personal anecdotes to support his hypothesis.
[quote]supertrain-int wrote:
[quote]silverhydra wrote:
Here Ponce;
This study showed diets isocalorically sweetened with HFCS and sucrose had differences in fat gain.
Also, to chime in on Alan v. Ludwig. Their disagreement seems to be about semantics, references, and application of said knowledge.
However, can we look at target audiences? Those who routinely listen to Alan are athletes and eat healthy diets, their body can probably handle fructose intake and may have degrees of glycogen depletion in the liver (which then, fructose would be fine to ingest)
Ludwig is an endocrinologist, and I believe he stated that he worked with children. Low levels of activity compounded with the excess of HIS target population (people who see an endocrinologist for health reasons aren’t in the best shape) make extrapolating from these studies valid, or so I believe. (As Alan critiqued the studies, saying that the doses were too high to extrapolate from)
Athletes, and most people posting on this site, do not fully understand how eating at a restaurant with family can equate to fructose overload; many people subconsciously go through 2-4 glasses of pop with a meal, something that our demographic would be acutely aware of, but the people Ludwig is trying to reach would not.[/quote]
Interesting rat study, I’ll try to pull it and get more details if they will follow up in humans and see if they discuss why their research doesn;t agree (which usually happens in the discussion session). Not sure if you would normally be convinced with animal studies - especially when human data is available. Sounds like it is hot off the presses, so they may have doone something different.
Not understanding your issue with Alan’s work, he may work with athletes but the research he was quoting wasn’t done on athletes, nor was he sharing personal anecdotes to support his hypothesis.
[/quote]
I’m aware the research wasn’t done on athletes, and that is my point. I suggested the entire disagreement is due to the studies not being able to be extrapolated to Alan’s demographic (athletes) due to their healthy, moderate fructose diets, but being able to be extrapolated to Ludwig’s population (non-athletes) due to their (assumed) unhealthy diets of excess.
Alan and Ludwig are both intelligent individuals, I have no issues with either of their work.
[quote]jo3 wrote:
[quote]staticx wrote:
I could have used a better EXAMPLE. My only COMPARISON is that HFCS is highly addictive,highly refined and has side-effects,not to mention an effect on neuro-transmitters.[/quote]
Is there really any research that says a MODERATE dose of HFCS is detrimental to a HUMAN’s health? When I say moderate, I’m talking 50 g or less.
I don’t get why HFCS is made out to be the scapegoat when the real problem is eating too much damn food.[/quote]
Firstly I believe HFCS is only part of the problem and to say that its due too eating too much food I dunno I think it may be more complicated than that,what about fluorides effect on the thyroid gland leading to its possible effect on fat-gain this is just one example, so that’s just another angle to look at other than eating too many calories. there’s more to it than that.
But it goes deeper than just financial implications much deeper, and that is just my opinion.Dont forget HFCS is highly genetically modified.
Have a look at this video, you will see how corrupt the government is trying to hide and manipulate the effects of GMO
The world according to Monsanto
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6262083407501596844#
[quote]silverhydra wrote:
However, can we look at target audiences? Those who routinely listen to Alan are athletes and eat healthy diets, their body can probably handle fructose intake and may have degrees of glycogen depletion in the liver (which then, fructose would be fine to ingest)
Ludwig is an endocrinologist, and I believe he stated that he worked with children. Low levels of activity compounded with the excess of HIS target population (people who see an endocrinologist for health reasons aren’t in the best shape) make extrapolating from these studies valid, or so I believe. (As Alan critiqued the studies, saying that the doses were too high to extrapolate from)
Athletes, and most people posting on this site, do not fully understand how eating at a restaurant with family can equate to fructose overload; many people subconsciously go through 2-4 glasses of pop with a meal, something that our demographic would be acutely aware of, but the people Ludwig is trying to reach would not.[/quote]
This is actually a very good point. Never thought of it this way.
[quote]staticx wrote:
[quote]jo3 wrote:
[quote]staticx wrote:
I could have used a better EXAMPLE. My only COMPARISON is that HFCS is highly addictive,highly refined and has side-effects,not to mention an effect on neuro-transmitters.[/quote]
Is there really any research that says a MODERATE dose of HFCS is detrimental to a HUMAN’s health? When I say moderate, I’m talking 50 g or less.
I don’t get why HFCS is made out to be the scapegoat when the real problem is eating too much damn food.[/quote]
Firstly I believe HFCS is only part of the problem and to say that its due too eating too much food I dunno I think it may be more complicated than that,what about fluorides effect on the thyroid gland leading to its possible effect on fat-gain this is just one example, so that’s just another angle to look at other than eating too many calories. there’s more to it than that.
But it goes deeper than just financial implications much deeper, and that is just my opinion.Dont forget HFCS is highly genetically modified.
Have a look at this video, you will see how corrupt the government is trying to hide and manipulate the effects of GMO
The world according to Monsanto
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6262083407501596844#
[/quote]
What are your thoughts on GMOs (only one that comes to mind is corn, but I’m sure there are other common ones out there)? Are these just as bad as HFCS since they’re also genetically modified?
I think the confounding factor is that HFCS is in a lot of junk food, and that eating too much junk food is bad for you. You know, duh.
JO at a glance Currently Commercialized GM Crops in the U.S.Soy (85%), cotton (76%), canola (75%), corn (40%), Hawaiian papaya, and(more than 5O0I0), zucchini and yellow squash (small amount), and tobacco (Quest Brand)
Other Sources of GMO:
Dairy products from cows injected with rbGH.
Food additives, enzymes, flavorings, and processing agents, including
the sweetener aspartame (NutraSweeP) and rennet used to make hard
cheeses.
Meat, eggs, and dairy products from animals that have eaten GM feed.
Honey and bee pollen that may have GM sources of pollen.
Jo I get what you are trying to say I’m of the strong belief to stay away completely from all GMO contaminated foods, and will go out of my way to consume organic,local markets,farms etc…
So I guess one would say why dont you have the same gripe towards other GMO products?..well its that major food companies,corporations etc… are saying HFCS is safe and okay for us to consume. Seeds of Deception is a good place to start.
Just throwing this out there, I have seen scattered sources mention that the isomer in HFCS is a much higher concentration of D-fructose than regular fructose (combination of D and L isomers) should be.
I don’t know the validity of these claims, but they are usually followed with saying that the D-isomer goes through de novo lipogenesis much easier then the L-isomer. (Either than, or they produce more Glycerol-3-phosphate via DHAP; thanks Wikipedia!)
If anyone could shed light on this topic it would be much appreciated.