Scholars for 9/11 Truth

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
21

[quote]BigPaul wrote:
I would suggest that those who may have a legitimate claim to be scholars are too committed to their treasured models that they claim proove that the towers could not have collapsed on their own. There is also the related issue that there were no measurements taken (temperature, etc.) of the kind that are needed to support their claims, as such these figures can only be estimated.

People like these give real scholars and acadmeics a bad name.[/quote]

No temperature measurements? Wait, this might be a clue - FLOWING MOLTEN STEEL

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[i]
The observation of molten metal at Ground Zero was emphasized publicly by Leslie Robertson, the structural engineer responsible for the design of the World Trade Center Towers, who reported that “As of 21 days after the attack, the fires were still burning and molten steel was still running.” (Williams, 2001, p. 3; emphasis added.)

Sarah Atlas was part of New Jersey’s Task Force One Urban Search and Rescue and was one of the first on the scene at Ground Zero with her canine partner Anna. She reported in Penn Arts and Sciences, summer 2002, ‘Nobody’s going to be alive.’ Fires burned and molten steel flowed in the pile of ruins still settling beneath her feet. (Penn, 2002; emphasis added.)

Dr. Allison Geyh was one of a team of public health investigators from Johns Hopkins who visited the WTC site after 9-11. She reported in the Late Fall 2001 issue of Magazine of Johns Hopkins Public Health, “In some pockets now being uncovered they are finding molten steel.”

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The government reports admit that the building fires were insufficient to melt steel beams – then where did the molten metal come from?

Metals expert Dr. Frank Gayle (working with NIST) stated:
“Your gut reaction would be the jet fuel is what made the fire so very intense, a lot of people figured that’s what melted the steel. Indeed it did not, the steel did not melt.” (Field, 2005; emphasis added.)

None of the official reports tackles this mystery. Yet this is evidently a significant clue to what caused the Towers and WTC 7 to collapse. So an analysis of the composition of the metal is required by a qualified scientific panel. This could well become an experiment crucis.

Prof. Thomas Eagar explained in 2001 that the WTC fires would NOT melt steel:
“The fire is the most misunderstood part of the WTC collapse. Even today, the media report (and many scientists believe) that the steel melted. It is argued that the jet fuel burns very hot, especially with so much fuel present. This is not true… The temperature of the fire at the WTC was not unusual, and it was most definitely not capable of melting steel.” [/i]

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Ground Zero’s fires still burning
New Scientist
December 2001
Almost 12 weeks after the terrorist atrocity at New York’s World Trade Center, there is at least one fire still burning in the rubble - it is the longest-burning structural fire in history.
http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn1634

Trade Center Debris Pile Was a Chemical Factory, Says New Study
September 10, 2003
The new work helps explain the very fine particles and extraordinarily high concentrations found by an earlier UC Davis study, the first to identify very fine metallic aerosols in unprecedented amounts from Ground Zero.

“For each of these four classes of pollutant, we recorded the highest levels we have ever seen in over 7,000 measurements we have made of very fine air pollution throughout the world, including Kuwait [oil fires] and China,” Cahill said.
http://delta.ucdavis.edu/WTC.htm

Unit Plans Closed Hearings on Collapse of the Towers
New York Times
12 November 2004
The federal agency investigating the collapse of the World Trade Center said this week that some of its deliberations would take place in secret, including discussions on possible changes to national building codes and standards.

The announcement has been sharply protested by advocates for families of the 9/11 victims, who said they were considering a lawsuit to force the agency to open the meetings to the public.
http://www.911readingroom.org/bib/whole_document.php?article_id=355

22

You know as soon as I read the title of the thread I thought “oh no not another nutty conspiracy theory by someone who has been doing this ad nauseum.” And sure enough…I was right :slight_smile:

23

I looked at the seismic readings – they DO spike early, then trail off. It would seem reasonable that the readings would ascend, as the buildings begin to collapse, then peak as the ultimate collapse happens. The readings do not match what the videos show.

Wow.

Flame me too guys. I can’t argue with science (in this case seismology), being a science teacher.

24

[quote]JustTheFacts wrote:

You would have no problem calling the French - “cheese eating surrender monkeys” but defend Israel as if somehow we derive some huge benefit from their spying on us, taking billions of our tax dollars and then selling our advanced weapons technology to China.

[/quote]

That’s all pretty fair actually. But there’s a difference between getting pissed about America getting worked by the Israelis and thinking that Israel, Mossad, and legions of Jewish fifth columnists are behind every problem in the world, which has been your theme from day one. And I’m just curious, have you EVER posted in a training or nutrition thread on what’s ostensibly a weightlifting website?

25

[quote]JustTheFacts wrote:
No temperature measurements? Wait, this might be a clue - FLOWING MOLTEN STEEL
[/quote]
That is why I said it could only be ESTIMATED buddy. Pay a little more attention before you get your panties in a bunch buddy.

26

[quote]JustTheFacts wrote:
Headhunter wrote:
JTF,

This is NOT a flame: Can you provide the link detailing how explosions were detected about one second before the planes hit? It was from the US Geological Survey, or something like that.

Other guys: JTF seems like a sincere guy trying to find the truth and share it with us. Cut him some slack. Remember, if he didn’t care, he wouldn’t give a shit about us at all and wouldn’t post.

Thanks for the support H - you know I don’t do this just for the accolades : )

I think this is what you were referring to:
Seismic Waves Generated by Aircraft Impacts and Building Collapses at World Trade Center, New York City

It documents and compares the measured seismic activity of the initial impacts and explosions with the seismic activity of the collapses.

The actual impacts of the planes hitting the towers barely registered on the seismograph but the collapses registered with very large spikes at the BEGINNING and lessened through the duration of the collapse.

The oddity being that if the seismograph was truely measuring the collapse of the buildings - then the graphs should have been ASCENDING with the spikes at the END when the buildings hit the ground.

Not to mention one of the stations to record the collapses was 428 km (265 miles) away.
[/quote]

Alright, I just put in the time to read this link and do not see it stated ANYWHERE that the seismic readings should have been ascending with the building collapse. Is there some other place it is stated that the readings should have been ascending? I would gladly check it out.

27

As the towers come down, the intensity of the waves would increase. They should be increasing, until the climactic moment we all remember so well. The seismographic record doesn’t match this pattern.

I hope that I’m wrong. Please prove me wrong. I don’t want to believe that my country is being run by a bunch of evil pricks who would perpetrate such a vile thing.

Can someone with more knowledge of seismology weigh in here?

28

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
As the towers come down, the intensity of the waves would increase. They should be increasing, until the climactic moment we all remember so well. The seismographic record doesn’t match this pattern.

I hope that I’m wrong. Please prove me wrong. I don’t want to believe that my country is being run by a bunch of evil pricks who would perpetrate such a vile thing.

Can someone with more knowledge of seismology weigh in here?[/quote]

Oh lord. Don’t buy into ANYTHING jtf ever posts:

29

[quote]bigflamer wrote:
Major TSB.

Face it jtf, we were attacked, and good prople died. Quit pissing on their memories with all this tinfoil hat shit.[/quote]

obviously Im not american and I know no one that died that day but I would have thought it sick to NOT question what exactly happened… . hey lets just let them rot without a second thought eh? good idea. …

now I guess its of no surprise that the rest of the world trusts your american government a lot less than you guys do… . a friend recently returned from america and some of the ideas he heard from the locals about 9/11 seem rationale enough. …

do you think that the american government would be keen to further show its lax security?

its entirely possible that on 9/11 not only did a handfull of guys hijack some planes and crash them… . but in fact prior to that dozens perhaps hundreds of explosive packages had been carried into the wtc buildings and placed stragetically with the plan to collapse the buildings… . this would show a massive gapping weakness of the government to prevent such acts. …

30

[quote]doogie wrote:
Oh lord. Don’t buy into ANYTHING jtf ever posts:

[/quote]

Ok, this is fucking hilarious, The site above attributes the huge spikes at the beginning of the towers’ respective collapses to the detination of subterranian explosives. The site JTF posted earlier with respect to seizmic readings noted the fact that the 1993 bombing of the WTC did not even register at seizmic measuring stations that were even closer than those mentioned in the article

A truck bomb at the WTC in 1993, in which approximately 0.5 tons of explosive were detonated, was not detected seismically, even at a station only 16 km away.

31

[quote]Gl;itch.e wrote:
bigflamer wrote:
Major TSB.

Face it jtf, we were attacked, and good prople died. Quit pissing on their memories with all this tinfoil hat shit.

obviously Im not american and I know no one that died that day but I would have thought it sick to NOT question what exactly happened… . hey lets just let them rot without a second thought eh? good idea. …

now I guess its of no surprise that the rest of the world trusts your american government a lot less than you guys do… . a friend recently returned from america and some of the ideas he heard from the locals about 9/11 seem rationale enough. …

do you think that the american government would be keen to further show its lax security?

its entirely possible that on 9/11 not only did a handfull of guys hijack some planes and crash them… . but in fact prior to that dozens perhaps hundreds of explosive packages had been carried into the wtc buildings and placed stragetically with the plan to collapse the buildings… . this would show a massive gapping weakness of the government to prevent such acts. …[/quote]

Complete horseshit. Do you really believe this?

32

Still my favorite, and required reading for this discussion:

33

JTF you should be ashamed of yourself for spreading these dirty lies.

34

[quote]harris447 wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:
JTF believes in a vast global jewish conspiracy.

If it weren’t so disgusting it would just be pathetic.

tsb

JTF is waaaaaaay off about most of his allegations. The other night, when I as at the meeting with the bankers, media-people, and half-lizards, we laughed about him for hours.

I wish there was a vast Jewish conspiracy; maybe I’d have better health coverage.

[/quote]

hahahaha!

35

[quote]JustTheFacts wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:
JTF believes in a vast global jewish conspiracy.

If it weren’t so disgusting it would just be pathetic.

tsb

What’s with the Jew stuff? I don’t have a problem with Jews, I have a problem with Israel. Do you also think all Italians are Catholic?

You would have no problem calling the French - “cheese eating surrender monkeys” but defend Israel as if somehow we derive some huge benefit from their spying on us, taking billions of our tax dollars and then selling our advanced weapons technology to China.

I have a feeling you could give two shits about Israel if you didn’t think Jesus needed a spot to land so he could take you back in his spaceship.
[/quote]

Mmm…so what do you think of Palestine. I hope you think they are at least as blameworthy

36

“Mmm…so what do you think of Palestine. I hope you think they are at least as blameworthy.”

I share a lot of JTF’s views about how the Israeli’s have taken us for the biggest hose job in history. All because the majority of our politicans are greedy, self-serving jack-asses who vote based on which lobby group gives them the most money. And the strongest, most powerful lobby in the country, by far, is the Jewish lobby. I wish some of you guys would do some reading to understand what a stranglehold the Jewish lobby has on Washington DC. If someone dares to criticize “sacred” Israel, in any way, shape or form, they are immediately deemed “anti-Semitic” and the smear campaign begins by the various Jewish organizations.

Am I pro-Palestinian?? Of course not. I am simply an OBJECTIVE observer and the fact of the matter is that both the Israelis and Pals have plenty of dirty blood on their hands. No one side stands on higher moral ground than the other, but thanks to the Jewish-controlled media in our country (a fact- look it up), when we turn on the TV we get the impression that the Israelis are innocent victims and the Pals are the devil incarnate.

I woke up to this issue after I saw the video of those dirty, rotten Israeli spies dancing on the roof of a white van and smoking cigars while celebrating as the Twin Towers burned in the background (20/20 did a segment on it a few years back). 9/11 was a horrible thing but those fuckers knew it was great for Israel that we were attacked.