But they’re just GOOD COPS doing their jobs, right? [/quote]
It appears at this point the good cops are either out numbered by the assholes, or just not good decision makers.
The escalation here is unreal, and this hopefully doesn’t end in a WACO type situation. It’s really the last thing we need as a country. I’m trying to stay neutral here (outside of the looters), but it is increasingly hard not to come down against the cops the more I see, and even though it doesn’t justify the looting, almost accept it.
You can count me thoroughly in the “fuck the PO-lice” camp for the way this was handled.
Now, that’s not taking into account the mob action and looting. That is absolutely despicable and they’re low-life scum that I would not be sorry to see gone. That also means that the cops are going to come down on you when you’re rioting. I have no beef with that specific action either. Riot = shit goes down.
HOWEVER, the cops arrested two reporters–who were in a McDonald’s writing and recharging their shit–for failing to give identification. The cop bashed one of the reporters’ head agains the glass on the way out. They were shouting “stop resisting! Stop resisting!” even though the two reporters were a) seated and b) completely limp. Oh and here’s the great part, the cops refused to give their names even though they were arresting these two reporters for not giving them id’s on a random walk up when they were writing at a table. (“Paperie bitte”).
The cops have arrested a St. Louis alderman as well, and gassed a state senator. (I have mixed feelings on this because the facts are not complete here…but the state senator says the protest group she was part of was seated and peaceful when they were gassed while the cops say “they were shot at”). The phone operator for the police station refuses to give his real name.
[quote]UtahLama wrote:
I think that the militarization of the police is finally reaching a head in this country…and it is bad news.
But come on now, why riot and loot your own neighborhood? What can that accomplish except reinforcing existing stereotypes. [/quote]
So criminals should stop being criminals and join the peace protest? or are all the rioters looting?
I guess the only way black people can protest without being stereotyped as a whole is if they protest with their hands up. Maybe one day in the future they will.
[quote]UtahLama wrote:
I think that the militarization of the police is finally reaching a head in this country…and it is bad news.
But come on now, why riot and loot your own neighborhood? What can that accomplish except reinforcing existing stereotypes. [/quote]
So criminals should stop being criminals and join the peace protest? or are all the rioters looting?
I guess the only way black people can protest without being stereotyped as a whole is if they protest with their hands up. Maybe one day in the future they will.
[/quote]
OH SNAP!!
Strong take there…juuuuuust dripping with sarcasm. Loved it!
How about this…while you protest, don’t burn down your neighborhood stores and steal a bunch of shit, before you burn the place down on the way out the door…that might be a good start.
And now that the good “reverend’s” Sharpton and Jackson on the scene for facetime, shit is about to get real.
According to MSNBC, police allege Michael Brown was involved in robbery before shooting.
According to the police report (embedded below), video surveillance allegedly showed Brown and his friend, Dorian Johnson, in an altercation with a store employee on Aug. 9. Brown and Johnson grabbed cigars from the store and behind the counter, the police report said. Before they left the store, the employee attempted to stop Brown from taking the merchandise, according to the report. Brown grabbed the employee by the shirt and pushed him into a display rack in the store, the report said, and Brown and Johnson left the store with the cigars.
In an interview with MSNBC shortly after the report was released, Johnsonâ??s lawyer confirmed that Brown had taken cigars from the store.
â??We see that thereâ??s tape, that they claim they got a tape that shows there was some sort of strong-armed robbery,â?? said Freeman Bosley, Johnsonâ??s attorney. â??We need to see that tape, my client did tell us and told the FBI that they went into the store. He told FBI that he did take cigarillos, he told that to the DOJ and the St. Louis County Police.â??
I would submit for your consideration that the militarization of the police across the country as a whole makes what is happening here FAR more likely to happen anywhere. In other words, I don’t view this as an isolated incident. I feel that this would be a typical response in many areas of the country to civil unrest. The federal government is turning local police departments in to small standing armies. And we’ve seen how they respect the rights of those in Ferguson…
I’m a little surprised that our local T-Nation law enforcement buddies are staying silent on this one… Could it be that they can’t find any excuses for the behavior of this department?
I think this is a prime example of how the police in our country are out of control.
The $64,000.00 question is: HOW DO WE TAKE BACK CONTROL AND DE-MILITARIZE OUR LOCAL POLICE DEPARTMENTS???
Looks like Mr. Brown was a ROBBERY suspect minutes before he was stopped.
I guess they got the crime on video.
Hmmmm[/quote]
Emphasis on the word, “SUSPECT”. UNARMED SUSPECT…[/quote]
Yeah, robbery or not, still not seeing a reason to shoot the kid.
While the robbery issue certainly sheds light on why an altercation/escalation occurred, if it did, still not justification for shooting someone without a weapon that isn’t in the process of destroying you with his fist/feet.
[quote]angry chicken wrote:
I would submit for your consideration that the militarization of the police across the country as a whole makes what is happening here FAR more likely to happen anywhere. In other words, I don’t view this as an isolated incident. I feel that this would be a typical response in many areas of the country to civil unrest. The federal government is turning local police departments in to small standing armies. And we’ve seen how they respect the rights of those in Ferguson…
I’m a little surprised that our local T-Nation law enforcement buddies are staying silent on this one… Could it be that they can’t find any excuses for the behavior of this department?
I think this is a prime example of how the police in our country are out of control.
The $64,000.00 question is: HOW DO WE TAKE BACK CONTROL AND DE-MILITARIZE OUR LOCAL POLICE DEPARTMENTS???[/quote]
I hope more than anything on the face of earth the cop was black so what you write about here becomes the national conversation.
Even though the press will call him white-black, we need to address the fact the police are a bit over the top right now.
[quote]pushharder wrote:
"Amid the rioting that followed the shooting death of Michael Brown in the St. Louis suburb of Ferguson, business owners and supporters stood armed to protect against looting and vandalism.
Store owners of Riverfront Tattoo stood armed with AR-15s to keep their business from being looted. Similarly, “men with concealed 9mm handguns and revolvers” gathered to defend Mally’s Supermarket.
According to Top Right News, while “Target, Dollar General, and Walmart” were looted and “a QuickTrip was burned down,” Riverfront Tattoo owners Mike Gutierrez and Adam Weinstein “brought AR-15s, body armor, and lots of high capacity magazines … to guard their store against mayhem.” At the same time, armed men stood outside of Mally’s.
As they exercised their Second Amendment rights, the “rioters passed them right by.”
But what about that judge that recently ruled AR type weapons are not protected by the 2nd Amendment because they aren’t “defensive weapons?”[/quote]
They are the pinnacle of defensive weapons, if nothing else because they look intimidating, just ask the anti-gun guys. Sometimes looking like a “Don’t Fuck with me” type badass holding a weapon that you know how to use is just as good of deterent as actually using said weapon. And a lot less hassle.
[quote]angry chicken wrote:
I’m a little surprised that our local T-Nation law enforcement buddies are staying silent on this one… Could it be that they can’t find any excuses for the behavior of this department?
[/quote]
Could it possibly be that we don’t know all of the facts? When I give an opinion, I usually try to make an informed one. It’s curious to see the persumption of innocence doesn’t apply here. Let me make this clear: It appears to be excessive force given what we know. Emerging facts can counter that appearance, so why render an opinion? Can anyone imagine, even if it’s a slim chance, that maybe, just maybe that the officer was justified? The crediblity of the witness needs also to be examined.
Did anyone ask why this video just now became public? If he gave false statements and/or ommissions, this will be cruicial. Maybe not in the court of public opinion, but in the court of law. Again, I don’t defend nor condone the actions of the officer. I simply don’t know the facts and circumstances. Since I’m a detective, I appriciate and understand complexities of an investigation. If he was wrong, I say convict his ass like any other criminal. I don’t excuse criminal conduct, whether it’s a co-worker or a family member.
Looks like Mr. Brown was a ROBBERY suspect minutes before he was stopped.
I guess they got the crime on video.
Hmmmm[/quote]
Emphasis on the word, “SUSPECT”. UNARMED SUSPECT…[/quote]
Yeah, robbery or not, still not seeing a reason to shoot the kid.
While the robbery issue certainly sheds light on why an altercation/escalation occurred, if it did, still not justification for shooting someone without a weapon that isn’t in the process of destroying you with his fist/feet.
[/quote]
If he chose to get into an altercation with a cop (not saying he did but the cop obviously had reason to stop him to question him) then that cop has to win that altercation at all cost, regardless if the guy is armed or not, which he would have no way of knowing. If that means shooting him then so be it. I figure the truth is somewhere in the middle here. As in the first shot or two was self defense and the cop then kept on shooting after he had gotten some separation, either due to adrenaline, rage, or fear.
[quote]jbpick86 wrote:
I figure the truth is somewhere in the middle here. As in the first shot or two was self defense and the cop then kept on shooting after he had gotten some separation, either due to adrenaline, rage, or fear.
[/quote]
Eh… I’m 100% speculating here but my money is on:
Once the cop decided to fire he decided on lethal force. Brown was something like 6’4" 290+, and the cop likely carrying a 9mm. The cop knowingly unloaded his mag into this kid.
I’m saying, unjustified shooting or not, every single trigger pull was the result of a conscious action. As in, if its self defense, it was going to take as many rounds as he could get off to stop someone this size, and even if its murder, its going to take as many rounds as he can to make sure someone his size dies.
