Two simple questions for the conservatives on this board.
Most conservatives support the legal right to own a gun. (Now, correct me if I’m wrong here) This leads me to believe that said conservative would use a gun to defend themselves, if needed. This, I imagine, would include foreign military invasion.
So my question is: If China, Russia, Japan, and a few other countries decided to invade and occupy America, would you violently resist the invasion/occupation?
Wouldn’t that make you a terrorist, since any Iraqi who does the same to the Americans occupying Iraq is labeled a terrorist?
I noticed a few posts aimed at user “Lixy” (and I’ve seen it before on other forums) asking why he (a)doesn’t speak up more in the muslim community against extremists, and (b) always seems to “blame America”.
The hypocrisy I see here is that while they claim that the muslim community can only be changed from within (i.e. “its their problem, they have to fix it”), they refuse to take the same responsibility about changing America, and attack those who do.
So, question: If its the responsibility of peace loving Muslims to change the Muslim community, isn’t it the responsibility of Americans to change America (and, as such, there should be less of “What they should do” and “What we can do”)?
Americans do change America. By voting. See, in this country we’re not in danger of getting jailed and tortured if we vote the wrong way, which is why Bush only barely won with a relatively slim margin of votes, as opposed to getting 99% turnout and 99% of the votes for him, because he is not a violent dictator like the one that got disposed.
As to your “Invasion: America” scenario, the governments of the invaders would almost certainly refer to us as terrorists. But then again, we would be directing all our efforts at killing the invaders, instead of blowing up other Americans most of the time.
But the guys we’re fighting clearly don’t just want us out of the country, they want to own that country, and they want whoever is against them to be afraid to resist them. Ergo - terrorists.
Well, I am no Conservative, but it must be said that the Conservatives can be broken up into several camps and so we must refrain from lumping them all into one viewpoint about the war. One camp are the Paleo-conservatives, many of whom (like Pat Buchanan) were not for the Iraq invasion. The other camp is the Neo-Conservatives. They believe that America has the historic imperative to spread democracy.
Wolfowitz is one of their main ideologues. Interestingly, another important Neo-con ideologue, Francis Fukuyama, has turned against the war.
Nonetheless, I agree with your point that there is a contradiction among those who would fight against a foreign invasion in our country, yet see fit that America should occupy another country.
[quote]Cunnivore wrote:
As to your “Invasion: America” scenario, the governments of the invaders would almost certainly refer to us as terrorists. But then again, we would be directing all our efforts at killing the invaders, instead of blowing up other Americans most of the time.
[/quote]
This does not address the question. The question is why do you think it is right to occupy another country, when we ourselves would oppose the occupation of our own country? Especially in light of the fact that we now know there were not the Weapons of Mass destruction that served as the pretext for the war.
You don’t get it. America is blessed by God. Only one other nation is blessed by God.
This is a very good thing. This means that everything you do is good. Since you’re good. Since you’re blessed by God.
And everything the others do, that you don’t agree with, is bad. Since they’re not blessed by God and you are.
See, it’s that simple.
People will think I’m kidding here. I’m not.
Did you see Wolfowitz’s explanation on tv? I told my dad he couldn’t watch his favorite show and I hogged the tv all evening, just to watch this. Yup, my mom and dad lead a miserable life, with me terrorizing them in their own house.
Anyway.
Wolfy didn’t think he did anything wrong by continuing to pay his gf after she left the world bank. And he didn’t think he did anything wrong by giving her a raise.
I believe him.
I believe he genuinely didn’t think he did anything wrong. That’s because he thinks the rules only apply to the little men. Certainly not to the elite, the chosen few.
The neocons really think they are better than anybody else just because they’re wearing a white hat. And that makes them privileged. They can get away with stuff.
If you look at it like that, it’s not hypocrisy at all. It’s a double standard, but when you’re open about that, it’s not hypocrisy.
[quote]Beowolf wrote:
Liberal Disclaimer: We are not this guy.
Response: What in the hell are you doing? These aren’t honest questions, they’re barely though out, unexplained insults that make little sense.
Please, think a little before you post. You’re making us look stupid by adding another mark under the left side of the troll counter.
[/quote]
Barely thought out, unexplained insults.
That those who would resist having their country invaded would be opposed to others resisting an invasion are hypocrits is a “barely thought out, unexplained insult”.
Those who challenge others to speak out against other members of their group, yet refuse to speak out about other members of their own group are hypocrits is a “barely thought out, unexplained insult”.
Why dont you explain to me how these are not valid points?
[quote]Cunnivore wrote:
Americans do change America. By voting. See, in this country we’re not in danger of getting jailed and tortured if we vote the wrong way, which is why Bush only barely won with a relatively slim margin of votes, as opposed to getting 99% turnout and 99% of the votes for him, because he is not a violent dictator like the one that got disposed.
As to your “Invasion: America” scenario, the governments of the invaders would almost certainly refer to us as terrorists. But then again, we would be directing all our efforts at killing the invaders, instead of blowing up other Americans most of the time.
But the guys we’re fighting clearly don’t just want us out of the country, they want to own that country, and they want whoever is against them to be afraid to resist them. Ergo - terrorists.[/quote]
So the governments (and probably citizens) of the invading countries would consider you a terrorist, when in reality you were not. This leads me to believe that many of the Iraqis who attack US soldiers in Iraq are in the same situation: That they had no intent to attack any Americans, but are resisting the occupation.
I thought most of the violence was directed towards the US military. The way you put it, it sounds like you’re assuming the same people would be commiting the same acts (such as blowing other people up) if the US was not occupying Iraq.
It just seems like reverse logic to me: Claim that Iraq is full of terrorists, invade Iraq, then label anyone who resists the occupation a terrorist and justify the occupation.
[quote]Cunnivore wrote:
Americans do change America. By voting. See, in this country we’re not in danger of getting jailed and tortured if we vote the wrong way, which is why Bush only barely won with a relatively slim margin of votes, as opposed to getting 99% turnout and 99% of the votes for him, because he is not a violent dictator like the one that got disposed.
As to your “Invasion: America” scenario, the governments of the invaders would almost certainly refer to us as terrorists. But then again, we would be directing all our efforts at killing the invaders, instead of blowing up other Americans most of the time.
But the guys we’re fighting clearly don’t just want us out of the country, they want to own that country, and they want whoever is against them to be afraid to resist them. Ergo - terrorists.[/quote]
We’re not at risk for jail for voting a certain way, the chads and computers fuck us enough. This country, in the past 7 years, has reverted back a hundred years! And why in the past few weeks are we all over rappers for something an old crusty fart like Imus said? If a homie from the hood wants to use “Ho” or N**** as a word, let ‘em!!! Its a song they are singin’! It’s not like they are in church!
Shit, I’m so sick of the sensitive fucks we have become! Lighten up America! If ya don’t like what you hear, turn down the volume. If ya don’t like what ya see, turn off the TV. Hell, the Govt. shut down Myspace and youtube to our troops to keep us from seeing any negative shit going on! We are going against everything the constitution ever protected us against. Over sensitive pussies