Thanks for the reply. I’m thinking of incorporating a few sessions/week as the fitness/athletic component of my training lately has taken a backseat. Will check back in a few months to give an update on the progress.
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Hope I’m not intruding with this question, but I recently gave gym a break due to work. Bought two KBs , I saw you posted a 8x8 program and mentioned that your friend had a lower 8x8 and was curious what it was, or if you had any suggestions. Thanks for the golden nuggets you’ve shared, thank you
Hi Odin,
The 8x8 weighted vest experiment was interesting.
My friend started it and I even gave it a 4-6 week go.
The lower 8x8 sessions were:
Session 1 -
Agile 8 + Jumps.
Vest split squats or lunges
Vest + db good mornings
Vest + db standing calf raises
Vest planks and stability ball ab work
Conditioning.
Session 2 -
Agile 8 + Jumps.
Vest + db goblet squats
Vest + db stiff legged deads
Vest + db seated calf raises
db woodchops and side bends
Conditioning.
Started vest only and added dumbells to movements for more weight.
Reps were done slow and controlled on concentric and eccentric. The goal being ‘feeling’ the muscle work under a load rather than feeling strong and powerful with every rep.
Difficult to explain, but I guess it’s less ‘athletic’ training and more ‘muscle tension’ training.
Having said that, there is still some carry over to either goal, as you’re still training, and that’s the key.
The sets and reps, however, weren’t always 8x8. Gironda sometimes did 4 sets of 20 with lower body work and my friend did 5-6 sets of 15-20.
Again, 60 seconds maximum rest between sets. He worked down to 40 seconds rest.
It worked for bodybuilding goals - getting him into condition and him looking in great shape for his holiday. Guessing with the reps, limited rest between sets, slower reps, added db weight etc. it worked for him.
I’ve said it before - how he looked / the goals he achieved probably came down more to how he was eating.
If he ate like he was about to hit a ‘physique show’, he probably wouldn’t gain any weight. He would lose fat, and we’d look at this as a failure to ‘build mass’ but a great way to bodybuild for competition.
However, if he ate like a horse, he would have gained weight and we’d look at him and think that is the best routine and method to become a ‘mass monster!’
By the way, months later, he ate in a calorific surplus, gained weight and looked bigger.
I remember him saying how conditioned he felt. He looked more muscular, vascular and his muscles were ‘shapely’ - again hard to describe. He did look very ‘Vince Gironda’ in that he had a bronze/silver - era look about him.
He trained 4 times a week. I’ve never trained 4 times a week!
I wonder how vascular/ huge / conditioned I may be if I did…
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@aaronru Just to piggyback on your comment about the lack of Walrus training leading to sluggishness. I deviated for a couple of weeks to try something else, and couldn’t figure out why I was so tired and unmotivated. Revisited this thread and got my mojo back ASAP!
Thanks again for the inspiration!
How’s your training and diet going leading into summer?
P.S. I’ve settled into a nice “Warrior-esque” diet approach. One light meal around noon, and the rest of my calories at dinner.
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Hi Camaro,
Glad you are doing well with training and one main meal.
My posts are just what Wendler preached to all of us through his Walrus work. I happened to lock in, buy in, give it time and experience it. It helped me a lot. The beauty is in its simplicity and rawness.
My training and diet don’t change much from winter to summer. Most changes are based around commitments/time, work or family related, for example.
I only make a slight change here and there after a number of months.
I have started with training 3 days a week for April through to the end of July.
All ‘Walrus’ style, in that they will have a push, a pull and a lower with 3-5 rounds or sets.
The 2 changes are:
a) on the last circuit/round/set, push reps beyond ‘10’ so that I “fail” with good form.
b) each session will be using a different ‘tool’.
One session is with heavy dumbbells ( I have a pair of dumbbells that max out at 50kg each).
Another session using weighted vest (I have a 30kg vest and a 20kg vest).
The third session with heavy sandbags (I have a 60kg sandbag and another at 80kg which can be filled to a huge 125kg).
I have an A and B for each, so alternate them every 2 weeks.
Monday Dumbbells:
DB Floor Press or Overhead Press
DB Row or Shrug
DB Squat or Stiffs
Wednesday Weight Vest:
Chin up or Inverted Row
Dip or Pushup
Goblet Squat (with 40kg dumbbell) or lunges
Friday Sandbag:
Clean and Press or Floor Press
Row or Clean
Hip lift or Bearhug Squat
Conditioning includes Weight vest walks, sprints, sandbag carries, db farmers walks, Burpees, mile run. I pick 3 to do per week, usually after each of the 3 Walrus sessions.
One day in the week I add just one set of neck work, cuff work Is Ys Ts, calf work and arm work.
In terms of diet, I’m still going with:
6:00 am - 6-8 scrambled eggs in the morning with turkey rashers, cheese and spinach.
6:00 pm - huge dinner with family, for example, chicken rice salad or mutton chops, potatoes, boiled veg etc
(When adding weight, I sometimes have a shake at 12 midday, milk, oats, banana/berries, peanut butter, greek yoghurt, single cream. Currently, I’m leaving it out until August.)
I’ll update you on my progress at the end of July.
Keep it up.
Aaron.
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Fantastic! I may steal some of your ideas.
How do you determine whether you do 3 or 5 rounds? Just by feel that day?
‘Stat light, progress slow’
I start first 2 weeks with 3 rounds. Get a feel for it. Next 2 weeks 4 rounds.
From then on, 5 rounds of each exercise. Done in 30 mins.
Basically a round every 2 mins.
After that, I keep the weight in the vest and sandbags for a number of months, with strong reps. As I own the weight and get through the reps and rounds quicker, the weight gets bumped up a little.
Over a number of years, the ‘small’ weight increases add up.
Progressive overload in a patient way.
With the less frequent meals, if you want to gain weight, eat more in each sitting. Slowly add more items/calories.
Just as we add weight in the gym slowly over time with good reps to gain strength, the same must be done with eating. Add food slowly over time with natural, wholesome sources to gain weight/size.
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Sorry to keep asking questions, but I’m getting really excited to plan out my summer training (at my age, any motivation helps)!
How do you program the conditioning options like burpees (sets/reps) and weight vest walks (time/distance)?
Also, do you do any direct ab work after a WALRUS session?
Conditioning options are based on a mix of:
- what’s available to me naturally
- certain goals or standards top coaches have mentioned
and - What I firmly believe is bare minimum I must be able to do regardless.
(So I’m not concerned about building up my conditioning, but rather more interested in maintaining a base level. Luckily for me, I have been able to build up naturally to a good level from a young age so I just want to maintain that as I head towards 40 and beyond. )
So I’ll now mention a few conditioning methods.
Sprints -
Done for X 10 sets.
I run for around 10 seconds at about 70-80%.
So 10 x 10 seconds sprints and 20-30 secs rest between them.
Once every 4-6 weeks, I may go up to 100% effort and do 15 or 20 sprints.
Vest Walks -
Done with 30kg vest for 25-30 mins. As it just so happens, I can walk a longer route of my block which is around 2.5 miles. That’s how I program it - what I have access to… My block!
In terms of goals, I read Dan John once mentioned he recommended rucking a certain weight for 3 miles in 45 minutes, so that also works out that I’m on track for that.
Burpees -
A top goal/level I’ve heard from a number of top coaches is 100 in 5 minutes.
I do full, 6 count (?? I think) Burpees: squat down, kick out, pushup, kick in, vertical jump and land, repeat.
Base level I expect of myself is 50 in 3 minutes.
Mile run -
Again, the ‘short’ route around my block, what I have access to, is pretty much 1 mile. So I just run my block fast.
Aim for between 5 and 6 minutes as a base level I should be able to run at any time.
This goal/ standard I got from reading Wendler’s ‘Average to Athlete’ article.
Farmers Walk / Sandbag carry-
Just walk the length of my road, place dumbbell/ sandbag down, take a breather, and return.
Do this 3 times over for 6 lengths in total.
Etcetc.
I rotate these methods as they resonate with me, are easy to implement and can be done at any time. Sometimes I do them first thing in the morning, sometimes after my walrus session, sometimes once it gets dark out and my family have gone to bed. Vest Walks I often do with the kids as I walk to the park/ shops.
As you can see, just use what you have available to you, have a base level of conditioning you need to hold regardless of time of year or circumstance, and be consistent.
I do an abs circuit once or twice a week.
Hanging leg raises, sit up, side bend. Repeat X2.
Again, a Wendler idea, about not neglecting ab work and doing it in a circuit. Slowly build up from once a week to twice. Or one circuit to two to three.
I’ve gone from zero ab work to currently twice a week, 2 circuits over past 2 months.
Hope that helps,
Aaron.
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This is awesome! Thanks so much for taking the time to write all that out!
Do you do the original Agile 8 exactly as written? What’s your favorite nightly stretching routine?
In the morning, it is:
Agile 8
Wrist circles, ankle circles, neck circles, shoulder circles, hip circles etc.
Sometimes I add skipping rope x 500 in the morning.
Usually done in 5-10 mins while I wait for my eggs to cook and my coffee to be ready.
Evening:
Stretches include hamstrings, hips, quads, wrists, calves. Mainly on the floor, yoga style stretches - downward dog, pigeon, cat cow etc.
Usually 5 mins while reading / watching a sports game, and I’m done.
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Great that you updatet this topic again. I’m doing something similar in terms of training.
- How long does your dinner take?
- When did you see results?
- Did you test barbell lifts or other feats of strength the last couple of years?
I’m also wondering if you could share a picture of your physique.
Thanks,
Novag
Hi novag.
No disrespect, could you make the questions a bit more clearer.
How long does dinner take to eat or cook?
I’m a fast eater and eat with my kids, so just usual meal time. 15-20 minutes?
How long to see what results?
Strength builds slowly over months and years.
Weight gain of around 10kg or 20-25lbs was 18-24 months.
Getting leaner before my weight gain phase was matter of months.
No barbells have been used.
Feats of strength - linked to results.
Strength takes time to build.
I increase weight little at a time. Few kgs every few weeks in dumbells. 5-10kg in vest every 6 months.
My goals are set and appropriate time is given.
I use my birthday week to 'test".
I didn’t do Walrus to get results. Nor to improve feats of strength. But, you can still make progress slowly over time.
Walrus training gives you a solid balanced baseline where you are able.
EG able to move friends washing machine down apartment stairs or run 8 miles home randomly, with no notice.
Nothing extraordinary, but surprisingly ‘easy’.
Finally, I don’t take pictures of myself.
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@aaronru How’s your training going? I’ve bumped from 2x/week to 3-4x/week. Conditioning is thru the roof!
Just wondering what your set/rep scheme for the ab circuit is like. I just dug out a dusty old Ab Wheel haha
Hi Camaro,
Good to hear you are doing well with training.
I’m at 3x a week, as I’ve said before.
Walrus with dumbells, walrus with vest, walrus with sandbag. This is the priority. The bread and butter.
Each session ends with some form of conditioning.
A 4th session I add for ‘extras’ - cuff, calf, abs, neck, arms.
Dependent on time, I may do the ‘extras’ twice a week. I just run through the exercises and blast away these little areas in little time.
Sometimes, I may not have the time to do the extras so I catch up the week after.
Ab circuit (go through twice)
Hanging leg raises x 10-20 reps, weighted sit up x 10-20 reps, weighted side bends x 10-20 reps.
Not much, but just at least that area gets worked. Don’t need to go super heavy with the weight.
Jim Wendler had a great, funny article - ‘Neckwork Network’. Years and years ago. I had a pencil neck but got it up to respectable using some of his ideas. Went through a period of time where I did neck work 2-3 X a week. With every session I did. Now I do it once or twice a week to maintain.
Touch wood, I don’t seem to get the neck pain that nearly the whole working population in the Western world do with our current jobs, lifestyle, screen time, posture issues etc.
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@aaronru Just curious - how’s your training & diet been? I’ve ramped up the frequency to 3x/week, and divided my calories evenly across two meals (lunch around noon, dinner around 7PM), and everything’s coming up aces! I’m still working through 5 sets of each movement, and have added ab exercises at the end of each session. In addition, I’m just doing “easy” conditioning (8000+ steps daily, sometimes with the weight vest), and maybe some jump rope intervals here and there. I love it!
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Sorry Camaro ,
Been away on holiday with the family.
Nothing to add about the last few months, just plugging away with the vest.
Looking forwards, may up calories and go through another weight gain time period.
Perhaps back to lifting weights twice a week, and using weight vest walks on off days, and walrus once or twice a week.
Calories will be bumped up through adding a peanut butter and banana whole wheat sandwich (or two ) tracking weight gain monthly. Got that idea from Paul Carter, but it’s been around since day one.
Glad your training is keeping you engaged.
That’s the number one to making progress - training and eating using key methods and the way YOU want and YOU believe in.
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