[quote]dmaddox wrote:
So what do you think we should do then?
[/quote]
Lobotomize those who produce in order to replace their selfish desire for self-improvement with altruism.
I am aware that we probably don’t have that capability at this time, but I believe that if we give the Government more power, It will soon develop the capability. (Praise and glory be to It)
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
[quote]pittbulll wrote:
[quote]Waittz wrote:
[quote]pittbulll wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]magick wrote:
About welfare- As I understand it, the biggest issue right now is that if there was any serious reform (which pretty much everyone will agree is needed, I think) will also result in millions having absolutely no source of money and left to starve and die in the streets.
While we may save money, the social and ethical cost of that is so incredibly tremendous that it’s probably unfeasible to expect people to accept it.
And that’s why the Democrats have no choice but to continue supporting stupid welfare ideas. Because the alternative leads to so many people dying that it’s unthinkable.[/quote]
Nonsense.
They would find a source of income asap.
And, if they would rather die than work, I fully respect their choices.
[/quote]
IMO the burden of proof is in your court Orion , There are clearly more people unemployed than there are jobs
11.3 million of people LOOKING FOR WORK
3.7 million jobs openings
that is quite a disparity
[/quote]
Why is there not 7.6 Million looking for work then? [/quote]
I would imagine there is a lapse of people moving in and out of jobs . There are probably some employers asking the impossible . There are probably many reasos [/quote]
What is impossible?
[/quote]
the best example I know is SWIFT trucking , I had a friend that went to their school to learn to drive a truck he incurred about $6000 debt to Swift . They started out paying him $.24 a mile and ran him slightly more than a 1000 miles a week . Every weekend he was stranded in some OVER PRICED truck stop . He had no wife no kids no car no home and could not live a good standard . The job that was promised him was 30 th 40 k for the first year .
He quit and Swift came after him with threats of wage garnishment .
Swift has had an add in PHX paper every day for jobs for the past 5 years that I know . Probably longer .
Swift sucks major COCK and is predating on the poor of our society and they know it
[quote]jbpick86 wrote:
You are aware that most people working minimum wage jobs are already in poverty by todays standards. Only its a false poverty because they are receiving assistance which census numbers did not account for so the poverty numbers are extremely inflated. [/quote]
totally , I think if you work for a living your standard of living should be above poverty , I advocate that any one that works for a living should have a better life than some one that is able and chooses not to
[quote]NickViar wrote:
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
So what do you think we should do then?
[/quote]
Lobotomize those who produce in order to replace their selfish desire for self-improvement with altruism.
I am aware that we probably don’t have that capability at this time, but I believe that if we give the Government more power, It will soon develop the capability. (Praise and glory be to It)[/quote]
I was thinking the same thing.
[quote]pittbulll wrote:
totally , I think if you work for a living your standard of living should be above poverty , I advocate that any one that works for a living should have a better life than some one that is able and chooses not to
[/quote]
GREAT POST! If one works, one should definitely make more money than one who does not. I didn’t know you were an advocate of eliminating welfare, but great argument!
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
[quote]NickViar wrote:
Lobotomize those who produce in order to replace their selfish desire for self-improvement with altruism.
I am aware that we probably don’t have that capability at this time, but I believe that if we give the Government more power, It will soon develop the capability. (Praise and glory be to It)[/quote]
I was thinking the same thing.
[/quote]
I figured as much. You seem relatively intelligent and that is the only sensible solution.
[quote]NickViar wrote:
[quote]pittbulll wrote:
totally , I think if you work for a living your standard of living should be above poverty , I advocate that any one that works for a living should have a better life than some one that is able and chooses not to
[/quote]
GREAT POST! If one works, one should definitely make more money than one who does not. I didn’t know you were an advocate of eliminating welfare, but great argument![/quote]
only you could jump to that conclusion 
[quote]pittbulll wrote:
only you could jump to that conclusion
[/quote]
That’s the exact argument you made: if one works, one should make more than one who does not.
[quote]NickViar wrote:
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
[quote]NickViar wrote:
Lobotomize those who produce in order to replace their selfish desire for self-improvement with altruism.
I am aware that we probably don’t have that capability at this time, but I believe that if we give the Government more power, It will soon develop the capability. (Praise and glory be to It)[/quote]
I was thinking the same thing.
[/quote]
I figured as much. You seem relatively intelligent and that is the only sensible solution.[/quote]
is your sarcasm detector not working, or is it mine?
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
is your sarcasm detector not working, or is it mine?
[/quote]
I believe it’s yours…unless you are, in fact, a supporter of lobotomies for all…
[quote]pittbulll wrote:
[quote]NickViar wrote:
[quote]pittbulll wrote:
totally , I think if you work for a living your standard of living should be above poverty , I advocate that any one that works for a living should have a better life than some one that is able and chooses not to
[/quote]
GREAT POST! If one works, one should definitely make more money than one who does not. I didn’t know you were an advocate of eliminating welfare, but great argument![/quote]
only you could jump to that conclusion
[/quote]
That’s the only sensible conclusion. Increasing minimum wage will either lead to unacceptable parity between the pay of those with valuable skills and those without, or will lead to across the board pay raises which would then increase the cost of production, further weakening the dollar and leaving those who make the raised minimum wage with less buying power than they had before. To advocate for raising minimum wage is to advocate for increased poverty.
[quote]NickViar wrote:
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
is your sarcasm detector not working, or is it mine?
[/quote]
I believe it’s yours…unless you are, in fact, a supporter of lobotomies for all…[/quote]
I guess it is yours, cuz I am not for that at all. Mine was sarcastic because I was thinking yours was sarcastic.
[quote]jbpick86 wrote:
valuable skills and those without.[/quote]
You’ll have to come up with a better argument, because neither of those exists in Pittbulll’s world.
[quote]NickViar wrote:
[quote]jbpick86 wrote:
valuable skills and those without.[/quote]
You’ll have to come up with a better argument, because neither of those exists in Pittbulll’s world.[/quote]
you are on a roll today.
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
I guess it is yours, cuz I am not for that at all. Mine was sarcastic because I was thinking yours was sarcastic.
[/quote]
I detected your sarcasm, hence it must be yours which is defective.
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
[quote]NickViar wrote:
[quote]jbpick86 wrote:
valuable skills and those without.[/quote]
You’ll have to come up with a better argument, because neither of those exists in Pittbulll’s world.[/quote]
you are on a roll today.[/quote]
I’m off and have nothing better to do until I go to the gym around 4:30.
[quote]Waittz wrote:
Why is there not 7.6 Million looking for work then? [/quote]
Numbers on national things don’t tell us where the jobs are at/what specific skill-sets are required and where the unemployed people are at.
[quote]magick wrote:
[quote]Waittz wrote:
Why is there not 7.6 Million looking for work then? [/quote]
Numbers on national things don’t tell us where the jobs are at/what specific skill-sets are required and where the unemployed people are at.[/quote]
The fact that jobs exist and people are out of work means there is a disconnect.
This is purely annecdotal but in 2010 I was part of a global expansion project at my company. I had to travel to, source and staff local employees in Germany, UK, Argentina, Brazil, India and Thailand. At the same time I had to hire a few stateside employees to manage them.
The entire project took about 8 months or so and countless interviews. In theory, with UK and Germany as an exception, I could hire 2-4 employees that had masters, spoke 2-4 languages and had 5+ years of experience for what I would have have to pay for one position here, positions that were considered “entry level” and were routinely turned down by recent college graduates I would offer to for the same position domestically despite how much more they would make than their international counterparts doing the same job just in a different region.
As for the supervisors, well this was 2010 and times were pretty rough. So I had this vast and huge talent pool of unemployed people with great qaulifications, tons of experience etc. I cant tell you how many of these people had been out of work for some time, months on end. I had made several offers to people who litterally turned it down because they made more at their last job. My answer was always the same, this is not your last job, you knew what my salary range was prior based on the job posting and right now have zero income so what is the issue?
Hubris and laziness have a lot to do with people not working. Some people would rather make zero and take assistence, than make less than what they did in the past or what they think they deserve temporarily. There is a problem with this country’s work force and logistics is not it.
If you think that the welfare state and taxation in the U.S.is out of control, you better be thanking God that you guys don’t live up here in the Great White North. You guys are the closest thing to a libertarian society that exists in the western world and, thus, are the last bastion of hope for common sense and good reason.
I do think that much of the problem is due to a disgusting society-wide sense of entitlement that has effectively sucked the drive out of the economy. My grandfather suffered through the Great Depression and then went to fight in World War II. He prided himself on never taking a hand-out no matter how bleak times were. He said everyone he knew was the same way. It would have been inconceivable for that generation to receive social assistance out of pride alone. Today, my area has an unemployment rate of 7.5% and a youth unemployment rate of 15% but every year the government subsidizes the local farmers to bring in tens of thousands of temporary workers from the Caribbean to work on the farms because no native born Canadians are willing to do the work. Wtf?!?! When you are out of work NO TYPE OF WORK IS BENEATH YOU!!! There is pride in all work no matter how disgusting or menial it may be. I would rather clean the floors of a strip club bathroom with a toothbrush than receive a welfare cheque.
The only thing that gives me hope is that I truly believe over the next 25 years we will see a world wide economic and societal correction as cities/states/provinces/ countries effectively go bankrupt and people learn that if you want to eat you have to work.
[quote]Waittz wrote:
Hubris and laziness have a lot to do with people not working. Some people would rather make zero and take assistence, than make less than what they did in the past or what they think they deserve temporarily. There is a problem with this country’s work force and logistics is not it. [/quote]
Don’t get me wrong. I understand that this is absolutely true. That’s why I posted the thing about the farmers. People have a very strong sense of who they are, and anything that forces them to do work that appears either socially or financially lower is apparently unacceptable to many.
Heck, I know this personally. That’s why I got a retail job at Old Navy instead of a job at a local McDonald after I graduated. Stupidly arrogant, I was, and still am.
But the fact remains that a lot of jobs aren’t filled simply because the work force isn’t in the right place.
I just think that people are oversimplifying the issue to fit whatever they feel is wrong with society, particularly on issues that are “sensitive” like this.