HDL depression doesn’t usually exceed 20-25% from T alone. Stanozolol is arguably worse than oxandrolone. From what I’ve seen 10-20mg oxandrolone/day drops HDL 20-50% (not linearly, individualistic reactions differ) yet 6mg stanozolol/day is enough to do the same. To note, stanzozolol is a more potent drug
The drop in HDL is concomitantly associated with an uptick in LDL. The increase in LDL (from the literature I’ve seen) appears to be slightly greater with oxandrolone, though I’d bet they’re equitable to one another.
Would I ever try either of them? No… not unless they were literally OTC and procuring a weeks worth was convenient and worth my time. A handful of countries allow OTC purchase, but the Australia federal government will probs keep our borders closed until 2074
Very strange, right? My doc said sometimes younger guys in particular (I’m 29) notice weird effects when their T gets too high or is unstable, which mine probably was from the 50 mg anavar EOD.
Libido went down a bit on Var for me (at least I think Var was the cause). Libido going down is unlikely to be the only impact to my mental state, but was the only one I noticed.
I’m 29 as well, I don’t notice much negative from higher T, but definitely negatives from lower T. My libido went down and I had some brain fog on var as well. Really weird.
Oh for sure, definitely negatives from low T! We see that everywhere. This was the first time I noticed negatives (seemingly) from excessively high T, though. Very weird.
Wow, that is nuts! I wasn’t aware stanozolol had such negative cholesterol effects. I’ll probably avoid it Thanks for the education You’re a huge help!
I’m hopeful just finding the right T dose on its own will eventually be the solution.
Honestly i don’t believe Estrogen has nothing to do with it bro. Your doc has no clue and probably cannot backup his suggestion. I havent found or read any article or study over the years pertaining to this E and mental health issue.
Im at 65+, i know dozens of guys well above 50 as well. Never heard this or read any studies that said the aromatase from trt causes this.
Deleted my earlier message. Looks like your anavar and etc is the cause of your issues bro.
You might be right bro, I felt great at higher E. But from what he said, it’s not necessarily about the amount of E but rather its amount relative to SHBG. So you could have very high E and feel great as long as SHBG isn’t too far from that number. If the ratio gets skewed, guys sometimes feel screwed in the head. Does that make sense?
I’ve been coping with hip pain (going to PT, doing mobility, etc) since fall. Finally bit the bullet and got an MRI. Turns out I have a labral tear of my anterior labrum (basically a cartilage tear on the front of my hips).
Meeting with a sports med doc soon to evaluate my options. Anyone here had hip surgery before? How bad is it and recovery?
I’ve heard this from one doctor. My SHBG usually in the 20-30nmol range but my best e2 is round 45-50pg. I do ok at 60-70, but any higher and things start to suck.
Dude, yes. He said when E2 gets to 2X SHBG (or 0.5 SHBG), guys often start to have problems. It’s all about balancing the two and trying to keep them pretty close to in line. When I felt my best, E2 was 1.25X SHBG.
The more I think about it, I really think E was my issue (as a result of lowering SHBG due to the var). I’m not afraid of E at all (@enackers) but think – at least for me – it’s all about the ratio to SHBG.
I’ve had tons of body acne, which was never a problem before, and I understand this is tied to E. I’ve also been incredibly emotional, crying a ton during movies, which isn’t normal. I think my E just got very high with no SHBG binding it up.
Bro don’t mean to be rude, but that doesn’t make sense.
Its actually the worst thing a trt doctor could say.
SHBG binds to T. Zero other effects are occurring after the fact. It has nothing to do with your hormones after it converts to DHT/ESTROGEN .
Seriously bro this makes no sense at all. You need to stop taking suggestions from this doctor, keep it simple stupid (haha).
Right now you are either on or coming off other hormones. Let those clear your system and let the body recalibrate.
E has nothing to do with any of this. Its the other shit being taken. I bet you will feel much better once your body normalizes and gets used to just having T.
Also low shbg equates to high morbidity and other issues. I wouldn’t lower my SHBG anymore than you already have.
You are in a state of time where you felt great, and you look at a variable and came to a conclusion. I get it, but look at the science and keep it simple. You know what dose works, what levels work. Keep it there. If you have issues, look at all the other stuff you are taking. life style, diets and etc.
Probably right. Issues that happen after an addition are most likely due to the addition.
I am not sure about this one though. I can agree that low SHBG is correlated to high morbidity, but I think the cause of the low SHBG is a huge factor. I don’t think having low SHBG from TRT is the same as if it is from it’s more common causal factors like obesity, diabetes or insulin resistance.
There is such a thing as free E2, same as free T. That’s where I could see SHBG coming into play. SHBG impacts e2 vs. free e2 the same way it does with total T and free T.
I haven’t read a lot of this thread lately so I don’t know the details on what you’re taking right now, too many posts for me to keep up with, but I wanted to throw that out there. It is a thing. The problem is actually measuring free e2 is very difficult and expensive, so it’s not really something anyone talks about, but I did find some studies with calculators that will estimate free e2 based off of SHBG and e2. I don’t have much more info on it other than that unfortunately.
I’m sure the “keeping shbg and e2 about the same” thing is just a very general rule of thumb that doc is using to say people with higher SHBG generally do better with higher e2 and vice versa. Whether it’s a good rule of thumb or not? I have no idea, but I wanted to throw that out there since it’s being shot down as not a thing at all.
This is what I’m getting at @enackers. The Anavar definitely is the issue - but I think it’s the issue because it lowered SHBG so much that I ended up with excessive E making me a head case. I’ve always been in the “more E is better” camp, but this experience was super weird.
You’re a huge help!