However, by good plan I mean in the appropriate context: where the above is the desired volume.
If only doing one exercise for the bodypart and especially if doing it with not all that great a frequency, the volume might be low. If 5 reps were used throughout, that would be an improvement (assuming that this is the situation.)
Five reps throughout should not be too fatiguing if sufficient rest is allowed.
Bill,
Thanks for the feed back. I’ll definitely play around with the rest period to find out what is good for me.
My training background has been predominately total body and upper/lower. I have decided to give split training a try. I would probably do 2-3 exercises per muscle group so I might do Bench, Incline Dumbbell Press, and some kind of fly movement.
I will however try out the 5 reps throughout and simply rest for longer and see if that doesn’t help.
I would ask CT directly but it seems he has many other questions piling on him. That and being this question is pretty general, I would like to ask you. I know the acceleration sets are done to activate the nervous system, but do they directly contribute to muscle growth? CT uses the F=massxacc. Does more force equate to more muscle growth?
Thanks,
MM
Absolutely the sets on the way up contribute as well.
I wouldn’t say that force itself equates to more muscle growth. If that were the case, then just doing isometrics could be excellent for hypertrophy, but it’s not.
But putting the force to work in reps certainly is.
I just follow the ramping method C_C taught me and prefer it. However…
I would like to do one set of high reps, low weight to lubricate my joints and get blood flowing, then try some explosive sets.
Myself, the high reps with low weight is usually at 15% 1RM, or 1/7th (which is about the same).
CT has written his recommendation as being a weight that could be done for 50 reps, but I don’t care to try going for that and have no idea what that would be. 
But as guesswork, I suppose I could do that for 50.
[quote]Mr.Martian wrote:
Bill,
Thanks for the detailed response!
Right now I’m basically trying to get down the general ramp CT explains in the interview. This means being explosive every set and working my way up to my top set.
I understand the concept of playing with the jumps throughout the sets. For example, you could do more sets with small jumps in the lower end of the spectrum to focus on explosiveness or vice versa for the limit strength zone.
So for me, I would just do a couple of feel sets till about the 70% mark. Like CT, from there I would increase by about 5% each set so it would go like: 70,75,80 and so on.
Obviously if you make big jumps, you may not have activated the CNS efficiently to go. But on the other hand, if you do too many small jumps, you will ultimately fatigue yourself before you even get to top set. Here where I thought it might be ok to ramp with 3 reps, being explosive with every set until you reach your top set. Then one would do 5 reps.
So my problem is either, my ramps are just not smart, or 5 reps is causing me too much fatigue.
Going back to my 225 bench:
Bar for whatever
However many feels sets before 70% I feel is necessary
135x3
155x3
175x3
195x5
Thanks,
MM
[/quote]
You could, alternatively, to get your volume in but not negatively affect your top set, give this a try-
Sub 70% feeler sets
135 x 5
145 x 5 to add volume/up your total weight lifted, to make up for below…
155 x 5
175 x 1
195 x max reps
This works best for me, as it allows you to still acclimate to the weight before the top set with the single in there, but takes out the most fatiguing set before your max attempt.
Hope this helps…
Kubo
[quote]MikeKubo wrote:
…
[/quote]
Man, Mike! I was beginning to think they’d sent you to another galaxy or something… How’s it going?
[quote]MikeKubo wrote:
You could, alternatively, to get your volume in but not negatively affect your top set, give this a try-
Sub 70% feeler sets
135 x 5
145 x 5 to add volume/up your total weight lifted, to make up for below…
155 x 5
175 x 1
195 x max reps
This works best for me, as it allows you to still acclimate to the weight before the top set with the single in there, but takes out the most fatiguing set before your max attempt.
Hope this helps…
Kubo[/quote]
Agreed in the general concept.
While not mentioned previously, in some cases – where the move to the top weight I know from experience will be disproportionately hard, a greater increase in difficulty than would be expected simply from the amount of change in weight – I will do a “split the difference” single between the last ramping-up weight and the top work weight.
Call it another feel set, if you like. (Albeit a set of one.)
It can definitely help being prepared for the top work weight.
Although I do it in a narrower situation than the above and generally when reps are lower than that. In other words, if for example the 195 were going to be a triple, rather than going directly from a triple at 175 to the 195, I might do a single at 185. I haven’t tried it the above way (and personally think I’d be losing something by not doing the 175 triple.)
So I have no basis to say on the above example, not having done it like that, except that it certainly sounds reasonable.
I was actually thinking that too, Bill, or maybe doing a single at 175 and 185, then the 5 rep at 195, mainly for this reason- I read last year, and found it to be true while experimenting, that you should never make weight jumps in a larger increment when you’re close to your rep max than the increments you used in earlier sets. So jumping say, 135, 165, 185, 195, 200 would be fine, but going 135, 140, 150, 170, 200 is not, because it will neurologically cause 200 to ‘feel’ much heavier, and making jumps larger than your last few is the reason for a lot of missed lifts when people are working up.
'I don’t remember who wrote that, but it was on here, someone who knew their shit, and it definitely holds true for me. Obviously, when dealing with submaximal weights its really not an issue, but towards the max I wouldn’t risk it, so prolly a single at 175 and 185 would be what I’d do. If worried about missing out on the triple, maybe do the theoretical 195, or whatever top weight is, for 5 or however many, then go down to 175 and add the triple in afterwards so it doesnt affect the top set.
Kubo
Kubo
Hmmmm, mustve signed my name twice for both personalities.
Whats up, C_C?! I haven’t been on here in awhile because it was too damn depressing for me to be. I’ve had a real shit year luck wise (Well, past couple years actually, but all the other shit was conquered, done and over with.
About 4 or so months ago I caught a TERRIBLE case of viral pneumonia. Like, really bad. I had it for a few months before I went in to the doctor, and he wanted me, once he saw me, to go immediately check into the hospital. I have no insurance, so that didn’t happen. We didnt know it was viral, so he gave me 3 different antibiotics, which I took, and seemed to help some at first. Maybe getting rid of the original infection. I had worn myself fucking ragged working at a bar 8 hours a day, working at the gym 3rd shift 9 hours a night, then wrestling on the weekends. Bar was split shifts and I had a stretch where I was up, no bullshit, for NINE days atraight. I had a bunch of other shit going on that contributed to that also that had to be done during off hours when I needed to have been sleeping, etc. In those 9 days I got an hour and 15 minutes of sleep, and that was standing up, at the gym counter. It was fucking wretched. I finally had to quit doing the gym stuff.
So anyway, this pneumonia, which is gone now, has fucking ruined me. He told me I’d feel bad for a long time afterwards, recovery is real slow, etc, as this literally almost killed me. So I wasnt supposed to workout for quite a long time, nor could I have. IO havent wrestled once since I got it. I was off of work for 6 weeks, etc. And I have an EXTREMELY fast metabolism, but am prone to fat gain also. SKINNY FAT.
I was a lean 190 or so at 5’6" when it happened. I’m a chubby 160 right now. It eats a fucking dick. I wound up having this past week off of work, unplanned, and that has actually helped some with the recovery and I believe I’m getting back in the gym and eating well this coming week. Gunna have to do a body recomp phase while I gain my weight back due to muscle memory.
As I said, been a shit year for me on the luck end. Lemme know how you’re doing, and sorry to hijack your shit OP. Hope theres no hard feelings!
Kubo
[quote]horsepuss wrote:
Here is what i do, I warm up with things like face pulls and flyes just to get the blood moving.
Then its 135 2x10, 155 1x6, 185 1x4, 205 1x2, 215 1x1, then on to 225 for work weight.
get the blood where you need it then get a feel for the weights as you move up into your work weight.[/quote]
This is what I do too but I just called it all warm up until the working sets.
[quote]MikeKubo wrote:
Hmmmm, mustve signed my name twice for both personalities.
Whats up, C_C?! I haven’t been on here in awhile because it was too damn depressing for me to be. I’ve had a real shit year luck wise (Well, past couple years actually, but all the other shit was conquered, done and over with.
About 4 or so months ago I caught a TERRIBLE case of viral pneumonia. Like, really bad. I had it for a few months before I went in to the doctor, and he wanted me, once he saw me, to go immediately check into the hospital. I have no insurance, so that didn’t happen. We didnt know it was viral, so he gave me 3 different antibiotics, which I took, and seemed to help some at first. Maybe getting rid of the original infection. I had worn myself fucking ragged working at a bar 8 hours a day, working at the gym 3rd shift 9 hours a night, then wrestling on the weekends. Bar was split shifts and I had a stretch where I was up, no bullshit, for NINE days atraight. I had a bunch of other shit going on that contributed to that also that had to be done during off hours when I needed to have been sleeping, etc. In those 9 days I got an hour and 15 minutes of sleep, and that was standing up, at the gym counter. It was fucking wretched. I finally had to quit doing the gym stuff.
So anyway, this pneumonia, which is gone now, has fucking ruined me. He told me I’d feel bad for a long time afterwards, recovery is real slow, etc, as this literally almost killed me. So I wasnt supposed to workout for quite a long time, nor could I have. IO havent wrestled once since I got it. I was off of work for 6 weeks, etc. And I have an EXTREMELY fast metabolism, but am prone to fat gain also. SKINNY FAT.
I was a lean 190 or so at 5’6" when it happened. I’m a chubby 160 right now. It eats a fucking dick. I wound up having this past week off of work, unplanned, and that has actually helped some with the recovery and I believe I’m getting back in the gym and eating well this coming week. Gunna have to do a body recomp phase while I gain my weight back due to muscle memory.
As I said, been a shit year for me on the luck end. Lemme know how you’re doing, and sorry to hijack your shit OP. Hope theres no hard feelings!
Kubo
[/quote]
Whoa… You’ll get back up to where you were man, and then some!
Hey, if you have a few spare minutes, head over to my “how do you train?”-thread… We can discuss things there.
[quote]MikeKubo wrote:
Mr.Martian wrote:
Bill,
Thanks for the detailed response!
Right now I’m basically trying to get down the general ramp CT explains in the interview. This means being explosive every set and working my way up to my top set.
I understand the concept of playing with the jumps throughout the sets. For example, you could do more sets with small jumps in the lower end of the spectrum to focus on explosiveness or vice versa for the limit strength zone.
So for me, I would just do a couple of feel sets till about the 70% mark. Like CT, from there I would increase by about 5% each set so it would go like: 70,75,80 and so on.
Obviously if you make big jumps, you may not have activated the CNS efficiently to go. But on the other hand, if you do too many small jumps, you will ultimately fatigue yourself before you even get to top set. Here where I thought it might be ok to ramp with 3 reps, being explosive with every set until you reach your top set. Then one would do 5 reps.
So my problem is either, my ramps are just not smart, or 5 reps is causing me too much fatigue.
Going back to my 225 bench:
Bar for whatever
However many feels sets before 70% I feel is necessary
135x3
155x3
175x3
195x5
Thanks,
MM
You could, alternatively, to get your volume in but not negatively affect your top set, give this a try-
Sub 70% feeler sets
135 x 5
145 x 5 to add volume/up your total weight lifted, to make up for below…
155 x 5
175 x 1
195 x max reps
This works best for me, as it allows you to still acclimate to the weight before the top set with the single in there, but takes out the most fatiguing set before your max attempt.
Hope this helps…
Kubo[/quote]
Yo Kubo,
I was actually thinking about that as well. Get progressively acclimated to heavy weights via lower reps in order to avoid accumulating fatigue. I was thinking though of doing more singles in between. Personally I find that I need more “feel” sets to get myself ready. I’m not sure if this is a psychological thing or a physiological thing though
Thanks,
MM
Ok…I’m sold
I tried ramping last night based on the protocols provided by Bill Roberts and others and I have to say I was very happy with the results for a few reasons.
I pulled 40lbs over what I was doing for 5x5 for a final set of 5 and 20lbs over my 5x5 max on military press. My volume seemed plenty high enough with the amount of reps I did closer to the max effort set.
Also, I really think recovery will be so much better over 5x5 which is not something to overlook. I actually think i was overtrained constantly doing 5x5 max effort sets for everything. I’m currently doing only the big lifts with BB curls being the only iso movement and it was really taking its toll.
The only downside was the time it took but I think I can afford to do less ramping levels and less rest at the lower end of the spectrum.