Psychologists Repudiate Gay-to-Straight Therapy

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
61

[quote]forlife wrote:
orion wrote:
That is pretty much what tolerance is.

Not really. I don’t expect people to like me or to approve of my sexual orientation, as long as they are willing to live and let live. To me, basic tolerance means keeping your nose out of other people’s business.[/quote]

Way really!

Tolerare means to suffer someone or from something.

Meaning, those fuckers cab do what they want without me killing them.

Back in the Enlightenment days they thought that it would be a good idea to make sure that people would not bash each others brains in for the most stupid reasons. (Read: invisible friend in the sky and similar shenanigans.)

Not bashing other peoples brains in is an awesome concept and your wanting, nay, demanding approval from people who are not ready to give it voluntary will not change that.

62

[quote]anonym wrote:
MaximusB wrote:
I win, because I don’t care to argue for my way of life. I am too busy living it. I don’t answer to anyone, nor do I care about what others think. While in my house and while going about my business, it is my business, and am not in need of the acceptance of others.

Does your way of life involve things that lead people to openly discriminate/disparage/literally HATE you, despite the fact that it cannot be helped?

I’m just asking because it’s easy to not care what anyone thinks when you’re part of the accepted majority.[/quote]

Yes it does, nor would I apologize for my way of life, because why do I care about the opinions of people who mean nothing to me? Who are these people to me? What do you do for me and why should I care?

If you are not my doctor, pastor, accountant, employer, family member, etc why the FUCK would I care what you think?

You literally do not exist to me.

Something you should realize before you die, which will make your life much richer, is this. You are not going to make everyone happy in life, so you should make yourself, and those most important to you happy. When this is applied, it’s amazing how much better and simpler your life will be. Go ahead and kill yourself trying to make all the world happy, you will end up drained, frustrated, and empty.

63

[quote]orion wrote:
forlife wrote:
orion wrote:
That is pretty much what tolerance is.

Not really. I don’t expect people to like me or to approve of my sexual orientation, as long as they are willing to live and let live. To me, basic tolerance means keeping your nose out of other people’s business.

Way really!

Tolerare means to suffer someone or from something.

Meaning, those fuckers cab do what they want without me killing them.

Back in the Enlightenment days they thought that it would be a good idea to make sure that people would not bash each others brains in for the most stupid reasons. (Read: invisible friend in the sky and similar shenanigans.)

Not bashing other peoples brains in is an awesome concept and your wanting, nay, demanding approval from people who are not ready to give it voluntary will not change that.

[/quote]

LOL.

64

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
anonym wrote:
MaximusB wrote:
I win, because I don’t care to argue for my way of life. I am too busy living it. I don’t answer to anyone, nor do I care about what others think. While in my house and while going about my business, it is my business, and am not in need of the acceptance of others.

Does your way of life involve things that lead people to openly discriminate/disparage/literally HATE you, despite the fact that it cannot be helped?

I’m just asking because it’s easy to not care what anyone thinks when you’re part of the accepted majority.

Yes it does, nor would I apologize for my way of life, because why do I care about the opinions of people who mean nothing to me? Who are these people to me? What do you do for me and why should I care?

If you are not my doctor, pastor, accountant, employer, family member, etc why the FUCK would I care what you think?

You literally do not exist to me.

Something you should realize before you die, which will make your life much richer, is this. You are not going to make everyone happy in life, so you should make yourself, and those most important to you happy. When this is applied, it’s amazing how much better and simpler your life will be. Go ahead and kill yourself trying to make all the world happy, you will end up drained, frustrated, and empty.
[/quote]

But I don’t see forlife apologizing for his lifestyle, either, and I think he only cares about the opinions of others so much as they directly influence his life (for example, he can’t marry the person he wishes to because others do not accept him).

Making himself, and the people he loves, happy is, in at least some way, dependent upon how others think.

That being said, I agree. I don’t have quite the “I don’t give a fuck” outlook as you seem to, but I do let most things roll off my back.

65

[quote]anonym wrote:

Does your way of life involve things that lead people to openly discriminate/disparage/literally HATE you, despite the fact that it cannot be helped?[/quote]

Yes.

-I smoke routinely. Depending on where I do it, it’s against the law.

-I hunt and kill small animals; rabbits, squirrels, cats, stray dogs, the number of sparrows I’ve killed is innumerable. Most of the rabbits and some squirrel for sport, the rest I shot/shoot just to have it dead. I’ve wounded vermin and left them to die in agony in order to attract predators so that I could shoot them too.

-When lanes are merging, I neither speed up or slow down nor make room if none was there, it’s the commuter in the merging lane’s responsibility to find space. If I find myself in a merging lane, I pretty much only use the accelerator in order to find space. People hate that.

I pretty much piss off 1-2 people every day. 95+% of people piss me off, presumably, this makes me a ‘nice guy’. For the rest of your life, somebody, somewhere most likely many in many places will hate you without even knowing anything about you.

66

[quote]anonym wrote:
MaximusB wrote:
anonym wrote:
MaximusB wrote:
I win, because I don’t care to argue for my way of life. I am too busy living it. I don’t answer to anyone, nor do I care about what others think. While in my house and while going about my business, it is my business, and am not in need of the acceptance of others.

Does your way of life involve things that lead people to openly discriminate/disparage/literally HATE you, despite the fact that it cannot be helped?

I’m just asking because it’s easy to not care what anyone thinks when you’re part of the accepted majority.

Yes it does, nor would I apologize for my way of life, because why do I care about the opinions of people who mean nothing to me? Who are these people to me? What do you do for me and why should I care?

If you are not my doctor, pastor, accountant, employer, family member, etc why the FUCK would I care what you think?

You literally do not exist to me.

Something you should realize before you die, which will make your life much richer, is this. You are not going to make everyone happy in life, so you should make yourself, and those most important to you happy. When this is applied, it’s amazing how much better and simpler your life will be. Go ahead and kill yourself trying to make all the world happy, you will end up drained, frustrated, and empty.

But I don’t see forlife apologizing for his lifestyle, either, and I think he only cares about the opinions of others so much as they directly influence his life (for example, he can’t marry the person he wishes to because others do not accept him).

Making himself, and the people he loves, happy is, in at least some way, dependent upon how others think.

That being said, I agree. I don’t have quite the “I don’t give a fuck” outlook as you seem to, but I do let most things roll off my back.[/quote]

There are things that I could personally gripe about, but I choose not to. It’s just not worth it to me. Forlife feels this is worth it for him, so be it. I am not interested in changing the opinions of others, because I know better. This constant attempt of trying to prove his point, flies in the face the whole “live and let live” attitude he seeks. I have not been shown anything which would make me change my opinion about homosexuality, and that’s his gripe within some the responses I see.

67

[quote]forlife wrote:
I criticize anti-gay religions, and don’t mind if people in turn criticize me. But I would never support a law that discriminates against believers or treats them as second class citizens.[/quote]

Islam is number one. in sharia law , homosexuality carries the death penalty. Other religions my condemn it and be intolerant of it , but they don’t order your death. what gets me, is all these gay groups attack christianity, but the never ever mutter a word about how Islamic countries treat gays. Iran has executed a lot of gay people. look it up

68

[quote]kodiak82 wrote:
forlife wrote:
I criticize anti-gay religions, and don’t mind if people in turn criticize me. But I would never support a law that discriminates against believers or treats them as second class citizens.

Islam is number one. in sharia law , homosexuality carries the death penalty. Other religions my condemn it and be intolerant of it , but they don’t order your death. what gets me, is all these gay groups attack christianity, but the never ever mutter a word about how Islamic countries treat gays. Iran has executed a lot of gay people. look it up[/quote]

You brought up a big point. Compared to other countries, the US is pretty accepting of gay people. People don’t realize how soft the US on many issues compared to other countries.

69

[quote]forlife wrote:
tom63 wrote:
Who cares? I find gay stuff icky if you need to know. Don’t hate them, but won’t support almost any of the “gay” bills. I think the lifestyle is nasty and basically don’t care otherwise.

I find straight sex icky, but I don’t advocate discrimination against heteros.[/quote]

Not being able to be married is not discrimination, it’s a blessing, ask any married guy. Hell, I would support gay rights 100% if I saw any gay responsibility. Which I don’t. In 1991 at Boston’s gay pride parade, you had 20,000 complaining homos complaining about alack of AIDS funding, with no talk of AIDS responsibility.

It’s really easy to not get AIDS. I’ve avoided it as a heterosexual for 20+ years. Again, give me rights, but don’t require me to be responsible.

70

[quote]lucasa wrote:
anonym wrote:

Does your way of life involve things that lead people to openly discriminate/disparage/literally HATE you, despite the fact that it cannot be helped?

Yes.

-I smoke routinely. Depending on where I do it, it’s against the law.

-I hunt and kill small animals; rabbits, squirrels, cats, stray dogs, the number of sparrows I’ve killed is innumerable. Most of the rabbits and some squirrel for sport, the rest I shot/shoot just to have it dead. I’ve wounded vermin and left them to die in agony in order to attract predators so that I could shoot them too.

-When lanes are merging, I neither speed up or slow down nor make room if none was there, it’s the commuter in the merging lane’s responsibility to find space. If I find myself in a merging lane, I pretty much only use the accelerator in order to find space. People hate that.

I pretty much piss off 1-2 people every day. 95+% of people piss me off, presumably, this makes me a ‘nice guy’. For the rest of your life, somebody, somewhere most likely many in many places will hate you without even knowing anything about you.[/quote]

Yes, but those are all choices, not something that “cannot be helped”.

71

[quote]forlife wrote:
orion wrote:
That is pretty much what tolerance is.

Not really. I don’t expect people to like me or to approve of my sexual orientation, as long as they are willing to live and let live. To me, basic tolerance means keeping your nose out of other people’s business.[/quote]

Tolerance is when you don’t like something but you don’t go out of your way to bother the people who are what you don’t tolerate.

Also, if someone brings their business onto my nose and i retaliate, then that does not make me intolerant.
Which is why i think some people hate homosexuals because, for example, homosexuals want marriage and yet marriage is something that by definition is a union before God in a holy place between a man and a woman.
Those who are very religious feel as though the homosexuals are putting their nose into the religious people’s business.

72

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
kodiak82 wrote:
forlife wrote:
I criticize anti-gay religions, and don’t mind if people in turn criticize me. But I would never support a law that discriminates against believers or treats them as second class citizens.

Islam is number one. in sharia law , homosexuality carries the death penalty. Other religions my condemn it and be intolerant of it , but they don’t order your death. what gets me, is all these gay groups attack christianity, but the never ever mutter a word about how Islamic countries treat gays. Iran has executed a lot of gay people. look it up

You brought up a big point. Compared to other countries, the US is pretty accepting of gay people. People don’t realize how soft the US on many issues compared to other countries. [/quote]

LOL, yay we’re more progressive than Iran!! THAT’S something to brag about.

73

[quote]legendaryblaze wrote:
forlife wrote:
orion wrote:
That is pretty much what tolerance is.

Not really. I don’t expect people to like me or to approve of my sexual orientation, as long as they are willing to live and let live. To me, basic tolerance means keeping your nose out of other people’s business.

Tolerance is when you don’t like something but you don’t go out of your way to bother the people who are what you don’t tolerate.

Also, if someone brings their business onto my nose and i retaliate, then that does not make me intolerant.
Which is why i think some people hate homosexuals because, for example, homosexuals want marriage and yet marriage is something that by definition is a union before God in a holy place between a man and a woman.
Those who are very religious feel as though the homosexuals are putting their nose into the religious people’s business.[/quote]

Ok, so the Fundamentalist Christian church won’t be marrying any homosexuals anytime soon and that’s fine. But it shouldn’t be illegal. Someone’s religious beliefs should have NO bearing on the law… I thought we had separation of church and state in this country?

74

[quote]legendaryblaze wrote:

Which is why i think some people hate homosexuals because, for example, homosexuals want marriage and yet marriage is something that by definition is a union before God in a holy place between a man and a woman.
Those who are very religious feel as though the homosexuals are putting their nose into the religious people’s business.[/quote]

“by definition”? I can’t imagine this is your states definition. “in a holy place”? I can’t imagine you consider the courthouse a “holy place.” And what about those who are both “very religious” and gay?

75

[quote]PRCalDude wrote:
As I’ve said over and over again, people can’t change their sexual orientation, and attempting to do so can be harmful.

Well then, by all means - let them keeping spreading HIV, syphilis, and Hep C to one another! [/quote]

But of course you are against gay marriage and any other measures that would encourage monogamy in that community. And probably for abstinence-only education whose recipients overwhemlingly continue to have anal and oral sex, unprotected moreover, in greater numbers than kids who receive real, comprehensive sex ed. And often still have sex and get pregnant. Your positions make a lot of sense.

76

[quote]kodiak82 wrote:
forlife wrote:
I criticize anti-gay religions, and don’t mind if people in turn criticize me. But I would never support a law that discriminates against believers or treats them as second class citizens.

Islam is number one. in sharia law , homosexuality carries the death penalty. Other religions my condemn it and be intolerant of it , but they don’t order your death. what gets me, is all these gay groups attack christianity, but the never ever mutter a word about how Islamic countries treat gays. Iran has executed a lot of gay people. look it up[/quote]

So when the Muslims attack the US again you can blame the gays for bringing their wrath upon you. Awesome forethought there.

77

[quote]legendaryblaze wrote:
and yet marriage is something that by definition is a union before God in a holy place between a man and a woman.[/quote]

ahahahahaha

78

[quote]Makavali wrote:
kodiak82 wrote:
forlife wrote:
I criticize anti-gay religions, and don’t mind if people in turn criticize me. But I would never support a law that discriminates against believers or treats them as second class citizens.

Islam is number one. in sharia law , homosexuality carries the death penalty. Other religions my condemn it and be intolerant of it , but they don’t order your death. what gets me, is all these gay groups attack christianity, but the never ever mutter a word about how Islamic countries treat gays. Iran has executed a lot of gay people. look it up

So when the Muslims attack the US again you can blame the gays for bringing their wrath upon you. Awesome forethought there.[/quote]

no,you kiwi clown, it just shows the superiority of western systems, to these barbaric medieval cultures

79

[quote]jsbrook wrote:
PRCalDude wrote:
As I’ve said over and over again, people can’t change their sexual orientation, and attempting to do so can be harmful.

Well then, by all means - let them keeping spreading HIV, syphilis, and Hep C to one another!

But of course you are against gay marriage and any other measures that would encourage monogamy in that community. And probably for abstinence-only education whose recipients overwhemlingly continue to have anal and oral sex, unprotected moreover, in greater numbers than kids who receive real, comprehensive sex ed. And often still have sex and get pregnant. Your positions make a lot of sense.[/quote]

These aren’t my positions.

80

The Fact that OP needed to post this indicated he researches it. He researches it because he is conflicted about himself and seeks to understand himself better. Thats a good thing. Noone wants to be told they’re sick or abnormal. Noone. Gay people suffer with being gay and some would like to be shown how to not be gay. How to make good relationships with women. Some are just born that way.

Im sure the pendulum is NOT all the way in either direction. Some are born gay and function fine, others could not. Why deny even the possibility of help and discussion for SOME to be electivly treated or helped?