And on the estrogen question, estrogen production from the ovaries is controlled in the same manner as is testosterone production from the testes in men, that is to say, via LH.
You have a way of saying in one line what takes me a page to convey! Thanks! 
[quote] Brook wrote:
Alpha F wrote:
Westclock wrote:
Im not even sure of the mechanism of action in the female body that regulates the androgen levels…
I have to think about this but I suspect it has more to do with the sudden drop in cardiac intensity and elevated blood pressure ( hence the water retention ) and the liver activity - a keto diet is important to ensure blood lipid count and insulin. I think the stress caused to the adrenal glans is what eventually deregulates the hormonal system. Also maybe because women are not used to experiencing such elevated levels of intensity and power, once off, estrogen is released in greater quantity as a soothing, downing an calming effect. But I could be completely wrong. It could also be both. This is why I think it is important to come out of your Anavar cycle at the start of the Luteal phase, when estrogen and progesterone are supposed to be naturally high.
This thread - or how it has turned has to be one of the more interesting ones i have read in a very long time.
Your input is invaluable AF, and i do hope you stick around.
I think what WC meant was this: In men, the mechanism of action that regulates androgen levels is the HPTA. The HPTA (Hypothalamus-Pituitary Testicular axis) is simply 2 areas of the brain and the balls, where chemicals are secreted to eventually signal secretion of Testosterone from cells on the Testes.
Estrogen in men is predominantly converted directly from Testosterone, through it’s attachment to the Aromatase Enzyme.
So this being the case for men, how do women produce Testosterone and Estrogen?
I am aware that Estrogen is produced in a number of tissues, including the ovaries, but which areas of the brain signal this? I would assume the same areas as men (Hypothalamus and Pituitary) have a role.[/quote]
Yes. 2 areas of the brain and the ‘net’ ( the womb - for the sperm coming from the balls that is a GOAL! : D )
But what about the adrenal glans? Doesn’t that play a roll in it?[quote]
Also, how is Testosterone produced in the female body? [/quote]
Ok, this is what I read:
There is a steroid called Pregnenolone. I even found a supplement by Charles Poliquin which was I think 25mg of sub lingual pregnenolone and wondered why Biotest didn’t have one.
Pregnenolone is called the grandmother of all hormones. It is made in the adrenal glans, brain, test and ovaries and it is bio synthesized directly from cholesterol. It is the ultimate precursor hormone. When is made in the sexual organs it is likely to convert into aldersterone, cortisol and DHEA. When produced in the adrenal glans it is more likely to convert into DHEA which in turn converts into testosterone in women and estrogen in men.
Pregnenolone can convert into DHEA, which in turn can convert into estrogen and testosterone.
Pregnenolone also converts into progesterone, cortisone, estrogen and testosterone.
I was about to buy this steroid from Poliquin but the tricky thing about pregnenolone is; it let’s the body decided how much of it is converted and as DHEA and used as such, how much it converts into estrogen or testosterone, or cortisol or progesterone, or DHEA which then converts either into test or estrogen.
Under stress when we produce more cortisol then the usual, taking pregnenolone causes cortisol to come down to normal levels.
So yes, estrogen is converted from DHEA but also from pregnenolone. If pregnenolone is produced in the adrenal glans, converted DHEA it is said to convert into testosterone in women.
And the signal from the pituitary to the ovaries to produce LH which triggers the release of estrogen, and that is why I recommended a female timing and ending her anabolic cycle at the start of the luteal phase which is exactly when the LH hormone peaks and triggers the estrogen level to rise along with progesterone causing them to be naturally high. When a woman’s progesterone levels are lower compared to estrogen during that phase which is day 14 of your cycle ( usually 2 weeks pre period ) a woman is likely to suffer from PMS symptoms - so if your lady suddenly ‘changes’ for the worse during that phase that is likely she is entering the luteal phase with a progesterone deficiency. Progesterone being for us what testosterone is for you, think of women with PMS as guys having test shut down and estrogen rebound every 14th of the month. Sucks much, huh?..
That is also why I said if a female has “difficult” periods don’t play with Anavar because that MIGHT cause estrogen levels to be even higher when you come out and your lady will think it was the steroid that caused all her post cycle troubles when in fact she may have been low in progesterone all along and and more prone to experience estrogen related side effects.
Actually, I just thought; instead of using an anti-e as an AS recovery aid could women use progesterone injections?
In view of the above experience, anyone reading this feel free to share your insights. I am learning as I go.
I might try that when I do a proper cycle on Anavar.
Many women swear by steroid supplementation with pregnenolone and progesterone. Pregnenolone is usually used by teenagers to normal menses and progesterone usually used by peri and post menopausal women.
“Pregnenolone is the major steroid precursor in humans. It is also a “neurosteroid” and possesses intrinsic behavioral and brain effects in animals, affecting the GABA(A) and other receptors.”
Is Pregnenolone different that progesterone?
“Pregnenolone is converted in the body to progesterone and these two hormones have some overlapping similarities, but we still don’t know exactly how their effects overlap. Pregnenolone is also converted into DHEA, which, in turn may convert into ANDROSTENEDIONE, testosterone, and estrogens.”
Pregnenolone side effects and benefits by Ray Sahelian, M.D.
As you can see above the difference between pregnenolone and progesterone, look back to my post above with this quote:
“Prohormone supplementation may result in greater increases in testosterone (or nortestosterone) in women because their baseline level of androgens is much lower than that of malesâ?? and they exhibit preferential conversion of ANDROSTENEDIONE to testosterone”.
So, could supplementing with pregnenolone or DHEA facilitate the conversion of androstenediene to testosterone in females?
Do females, can females inject androstenediene?
Could pregnenolone be transformed into an anabolic steroid which is more female friendly?
Again, as with the progesterone, could pregnenolone supplementation be an effective PCT for female steroid use?
Disclaimer: I am not a doctor and have no qualification in this area. I am self-taught and I love a scientific approach to understand our bodies and improve the quality of our lives.
I am 39 years old, have made a mature and conscious decision not to have children and therefore give myself permission to self-experiment within limits. I do not encourage younger females or younger males to experiment with their girlfriends, wives, child bearing partners.
I decided to share my experience because during my endless research I found only 2 females who spoke about their experiences and gave very very limited and vague information.
I hope for more women to own their bodies and drop the taboo and the fear.
Men and women can contribute much to one another by sharing our experiences openly and respectfully.
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Taking pregnenolone does not increase testosterone levels.
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Any claim by anyone that their pregnenolone is special, if there is such a claim, is silly and untrue. If wanting to take it, for example for mood, any brand is the same as any other.
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Oral use of DHEA will somewhat increase testosterone levels.
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Androstenedione is a controlled substance and cannot now be obtained.
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It is not a feasible plan to create a new anabolic/androgenic steroid from pregnenolone.
[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
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Taking pregnenolone does not increase testosterone levels.
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Any claim by anyone that their pregnenolone is special, if there is such a claim, is silly and untrue. If wanting to take it, for example for mood, any brand is the same as any other.
-
Oral use of DHEA will somewhat increase testosterone levels.
-
Androstenedione is a controlled substance and cannot now be obtained.
-
It is not a feasible plan to create a new anabolic/androgenic steroid from pregnenolone.
[/quote]
I read up a bit on DHEA a while back before determining that a little post cycle couldent hurt, but it only seems to greatly assist men once their natural DHEA levels have fallen.
It did seem to have a decent anabolic effect in women through conversion to androstenediol, androstendione and testosterone. But it can just as easily convert to estrogen compounds as well.
Some women even reported masculinizing effects from higher doses.
But then again some women have taken the same dose and felt nothing.
I believe oral DHEA has poor bioavalibility, they do make injections and transdermals I believe.
[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
- Any claim by anyone that their pregnenolone is special, if there is such a claim, is silly and untrue. If wanting to take it, for example for mood, any brand is the same as any other.
[/quote]
Qualification: micronized is better absorbed than non-micronized. Even here, however, simply taking more non-micronized gives same result.
[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
- Oral use of DHEA will somewhat increase testosterone levels.[/quote]
What about injectable DHEA?
And injectable Ginkgo Biloba?
I don’t know of an available form of injected DHEA. It would be more efficient per milligram taken, but that is easily enough solved by taking more milligrams orally.
Never heard of injectable Ginkgo biloba. Generally speaking injecting an herbal extract is a bad idea, referring to extracts not purified down to being a single, highly pure compound.
[quote]Westclock wrote:
I read up a bit on DHEA a while back before determining that a little post cycle couldent hurt, but it only seems to greatly assist men once their natural DHEA levels have fallen.[/quote]
I heard the same. It is mostly advertised as an anti-aging and some male lifters on HRT reported some positive results.[quote]
It did seem to have a decent anabolic effect in women through conversion to androstenediol, androstendione and testosterone. But it can just as easily convert to estrogen compounds as well.
Some women even reported masculinizing effects from higher doses.
But then again some women have taken the same dose and felt nothing.[/quote]
Yes! I came across the same info and because it can go either way and the masculinization possibility I decided to not risk it and went for the progesterone instead. [quote]
I believe oral DHEA has poor bioavalibility, they do make injections and transdermals I believe.
[/quote]
I nearly bought the injectable DHEA but went against it for the very reasons you stated.
[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
I don’t know of an available form of injected DHEA. It would be more efficient per milligram taken, but that is easily enough solved by taking more milligrams orally.
Never heard of injectable Ginkgo biloba. Generally speaking injecting an herbal extract is a bad idea, referring to extracts not purified down to being a single, highly pure compound.[/quote]
Thanks.
The DHEA I was going to buy had a concentration of 50mg/ml but I gave up for the reasons above.
The Ginkgo was 3mg/ml. But I will be doing a lot more research into it if I decide to try.
Thumbs up for this thread.