[quote]SteelyD wrote:
PX- I just went back and skimmed through the previous pages. You listed your basic bodypart splits, but I haven’t seen where you split triceps out.
Have you concentrated on them at all or just hit them as part of your various chest and shoulder days (ie just from pressing)?
How much direct work have you done (do)? How has that changed as you progressed.
Apologies if you did cover this, I just didn’t see it on review[/quote]
I usually train triceps with chest. On average, I do:
Triceps presses with the cable (always my first exercise as a warm up)
Dips (using the HS machine version)
and triceps extensions
I used to do kickbacks and may add them back in because I want to bring my triceps up. If it weren’t for the fact that they get hit indirectly several times a week from shoulders and chest training, I would train them more often individually.
X, I’m assuming you have pull downs as your primary lat movement due to your more substantial weight; would you suggest those of us that are still smaller do chins/pull ups until it gets to the point that bodyweight is becoming more of a maximal weight?
Also as far as chest development goes, as you built your upper chest did that help bring the middle portion of each pec together? My chest seems to be growing “out” at a good rate, but I can’t get the middle to close up. It could be just a general size issue and I need to keep at it, but if the upper chest development helps I will probably consider splitting it up like you did.
[quote]red04 wrote:
X, I’m assuming you have pull downs as your primary lat movement due to your more substantial weight; would you suggest those of us that are still smaller do chins/pull ups until it gets to the point that bodyweight is becoming more of a maximal weight? [/quote]
Do both. I only do lat pull downs along with several other lat movements (many on HS machines). That seems to be working just fine for me. In the beginning, however, we did pull ups (wide grip as well as regular). That helped build that initial mass. At one point, me and the guys I was training with did pull ups daily as the first thing we did when we got to the gym. It made my strength shoot up.
[quote]
Also as far as chest development goes, as you built your upper chest did that help bring the middle portion of each pec together? My chest seems to be growing “out” at a good rate, but I can’t get the middle to close up. It could be just a general size issue and I need to keep at it, but if the upper chest development helps I will probably consider splitting it up like you did.[/quote]
If you have a gap in the middle of your chest, while building more size will detract the look of it so it is less noticeable, you won’t be building muscle where there is none.
prof x, do you ever expirence shoudler pain when doing the hammer strengh flat press, ive done them the last couple weeks and as i get heavier my shoulders seem to be in a little discomfort and sometimes pain
[quote]Professor X wrote:
As far as me getting 50 reps with 2 plates a side, that has much to do with fiber distribution. I know I have a majority of fast twitch muscle fibers. I know this because I can generate a lot of power but I don’t have great endurance. I can push you car real great and look good…for about 40 feet. Then I look like I just ran a marathon. I don’t train for endurance at this point. My goal up to this point has been size and strength with a strong focus on fast twitch muscle fibers. I will eventually work on increasing endurance, but only after I feel I have maximized my growth potential.[/quote]
So in order to gain muscle endurance it would be smart to start with low reps and slowly increase at the same weight?
[quote]S.T.E.A.K. wrote:
Professor X wrote:
As far as me getting 50 reps with 2 plates a side, that has much to do with fiber distribution. I know I have a majority of fast twitch muscle fibers. I know this because I can generate a lot of power but I don’t have great endurance. I can push you car real great and look good…for about 40 feet. Then I look like I just ran a marathon. I don’t train for endurance at this point. My goal up to this point has been size and strength with a strong focus on fast twitch muscle fibers. I will eventually work on increasing endurance, but only after I feel I have maximized my growth potential.
So in order to gain muscle endurance it would be smart to start with low reps and slowly increase at the same weight?[/quote]
In order to gain muscle endurance, you need to first decide what your overall goal is. If “endurance” is all you are after, drop the weights and join a marathon.
If you are in a gym, why use the same weight for every set if it clearly isn’t challenging enough to promote any muscle growth?
[quote]MEYMZ wrote:
Hello X, some quick questions:
How much are you weighing right now?[/quote]
459 kotylais
[quote]
What set range has been the most beneficial on yourself for hypertrophy?
Thanks in advance.[/quote]
3-5 sets. This varies greatly depending on how I feel, how much I ate and several other factors. It is never less than three unless I am just warming up.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
MEYMZ wrote:
Hello X, some quick questions:
How much are you weighing right now?
459 kotylais
[/quote]
LOL! that’s almost 40,000 pounds.
[quote]What set range has been the most beneficial on yourself for hypertrophy?
Thanks in advance.
3-5 sets. This varies greatly depending on how I feel, how much I ate and several other factors. It is never less than three unless I am just warming up.
I assume you make 1 top set per exercise.
[/quote]
Yes. I also do a lot more sets than I used to. It takes me quite a few just to warm up for biceps movements because of a past minor injury. I have to fatigue my brachioradialis first in order to hit my biceps all out. It has taken me quite a while to finally figure out how to do that best but I think I have it now.
I generally go heaviest on my last set. I always pyramid up in weight outside of warm up sets.
For legs I do A LOT more sets than I used to…but again, much of this comes from trying to prevent injury and knowing what works for me.
Is there any reason not to continue to do Chin-ups and Pull-ups forever? I have never quite understood why many advanced lifters deviate away from these. I have been able to work up into some pretty impressive weights, (training 12 years now) and I enjoy them… Just curious whether there is added benefit to Pulldowns instead?
Also, I just found this thread, since it was bumped up… GREAT info! I just wasted 4 hours at work reading the whole thing. It’s amazing how I’ve tried all sorts of routines throughout my 12 years of training, and I’ve been back to 1 muscle group/day with 10-12 sets per muscle group, because I find it the most enjoyable and result producing.
And also, for anyone that doesn’t think you can get in and out quickly, I have a 1 hour lunch break. I am able to drive 10 min to the gym, lift 1 muscle group in a half hour, drive 10 min back to work, change clothes, and get back to my desk in under an hour. And when I leave the gym, the muscle worked that day is crushed.
that’s all - thanks for the thread guys. It’s been informative.
Yes. I also do a lot more sets than I used to. It takes me quite a few just to warm up for biceps movements because of a past minor injury. I have to fatigue my brachioradialis first in order to hit my biceps all out. It has taken me quite a while to finally figure out how to do that best but I think I have it now.
I generally go heaviest on my last set. I always pyramid up in weight outside of warm up sets.
For legs I do A LOT more sets than I used to…but again, much of this comes from trying to prevent injury and knowing what works for me.[/quote]
Thank you for your answers X. Knees must have had problems by what you say. Today my knees felt like shit and I had to go lighter on the legs.
Do you feel that any book learning is important to newbies? Any particular books you would recommend to someone that wants to get into bodybuilding? I’m thinking of both bodybuilding history and medical books. Do you feel you would have been as successful at bodybuilding without your medical knowledge?
[quote]BBoor82 wrote:
Is there any reason not to continue to do Chin-ups and Pull-ups forever? I have never quite understood why many advanced lifters deviate away from these. I have been able to work up into some pretty impressive weights, (training 12 years now) and I enjoy them… Just curious whether there is added benefit to Pulldowns instead? [/quote]
I see great development from pull downs and every other kind of high row I do so no, pull ups are not necessary and many pros don’t do them at their heaviest weights because doing pull ups at 280+lbs is way different than doing them when closer to contest shape around 250 or less.
Victor Martinez keeps doing them along with some others which makes it completely individual. If you feel they benefit you more, keep doing them. Just know that not everyone considers them the epitome of lat training.
I did pull ups in the past a lot and that helped me build a base of size but I was never one of those people who latched onto one specific movement and considered it something I MUST do to see progress. There are too many alternatives and the key is finding what works best for you, not someone else.
[quote]Mr.Purple wrote:
Do you feel that any book learning is important to newbies? Any particular books you would recommend to someone that wants to get into bodybuilding? I’m thinking of both bodybuilding history and medical books. Do you feel you would have been as successful at bodybuilding without your medical knowledge? [/quote]
Books:
College level
-Biology
-Anatomy and phys
-books on the history of bodybuilding (specifics don’t even matter…just learn what came before so you know what’s bs and what isn’t as far as what is released today)
-any of Arnold’s books or those of some other older pros from back then. Just realize that it is to gain perspective into how they think and NOT to simply follow what they did.
I used to spend my breaks in the library while studying for other exams as a chance to go through any books I could find on bodybuilding from several years back.
I don’t know these guy’s names because I was around back then. I wasn’t even a thought in the back of my dad’s mind in the 60’s. I know these guys because I researched them. I wanted to know why they thought the way they did and what they kept that worked.
-books on the history of bodybuilding (specifics don’t even matter…just learn what came before so you know what’s bs and what isn’t as far as what is released today)
-any of Arnold’s books or those of some other older pros from back then. Just realize that it is to gain perspective into how they think and NOT to simply follow what they did.
I used to spend my breaks in the library while studying for other exams as a chance to go through any books I could find on bodybuilding from several years back.
I don’t know these guy’s names because I was around back then. I wasn’t even a thought in the back of my dad’s mind in the 60’s. I know these guys because I researched them. I wanted to know why they thought the way they did and what they kept that worked.
[/quote]
That’s amusing. I finally decided to get a degree, and spend my breaks reading these forums. I’ll look around for books on the history of bodybuilding then.
The thought process is exactly what I am after, I realize that doing exactly what anyone else did will not be optimal for me.
How long were you training before you had a solid feel for what works for you? I mean, there seems to be so much to “try out”, that one could easily end up spinning ones wheels for a long time. I know I did. From your posts it seems you saw remarkable progress right out of the gate, and only made minor tweaks to your program as you went along. I got caught up in all these articles and was changing what I did every other week. Obviously I got nowhere. Now I stick to a very basic routine and try to progress every week.
Sorry if that has been answered. Been a while since I read through the entire thread.
Yeah I agree that chins/pull-ups are not necessarily the epitome of lat training. I know for me, I feel them much more in my lats than I ever do with any variation of pulldown. Rows crush my lats, too, but pulldowns don’t seem to do it for some reason. I guess it’s just what individually works for each person.
Being that I’ve never been above 205 pounds, can you explain how doing them is different at a higher bodyweight? I am able to strap on 100lbs for 6 reps, putting my total above the 280… and I don’t seem to feel a difference, aside from it being a lot tougher…
[quote]BBoor82 wrote:
Yeah I agree that chins/pull-ups are not necessarily the epitome of lat training. I know for me, I feel them much more in my lats than I ever do with any variation of pulldown. Rows crush my lats, too, but pulldowns don’t seem to do it for some reason. I guess it’s just what individually works for each person.
Being that I’ve never been above 205 pounds, can you explain how doing them is different at a higher bodyweight? I am able to strap on 100lbs for 6 reps, putting my total above the 280… and I don’t seem to feel a difference, aside from it being a lot tougher… [/quote]
The bigger you get past a certain point, the more you need to alter your posture and sometimes (especially in guys who build huge quads) your gait. The same applies to lifting weights. Some guy may feel it in his lats better when he is lighter but not as well when he is heavier.
Again this is highly individual. Doing pull ups when you weigh 280+lbs is way different than weighing 200lbs and then strapping on another 80.
How long were you training before you had a solid feel for what works for you? [/quote]
About three years…and then another three to realize that I didn’t really know as much as I thought I did in the first three…and then another three years to figure out that I just started figuring out how things work and the previous six were barely scratching the surface.
Yes, that is called information overload. You avoid that by not giving a shit about what every author writes this week or in their latest book. There is very little “new” info that actually needs to be applied in training. Those guys half a century ago figured out most of it.