Obama is biracial. Or has this term somehow disappeared from the American landscape? What else could you use to describe someone who is composed of two different races?
The “one drop” rule was more about the concept of white racial purity than anything else. It can all be explained in terms of in-group/out group dynamics.
In fact the notion of “blood” at all in a neo-Darwinian scientific landscape is completely antiquated.
[quote]phil_leotardo wrote:
Obama is biracial. Or has this term somehow disappeared from the American landscape? What else could you use to describe someone who is composed of two different races?
The “one drop” rule was more about the concept of white racial purity than anything else. It can all be explained in terms of in-group/out group dynamics.
In fact the notion of “blood” at all in a neo-Darwinian scientific landscape is completely antiquated.[/quote]
It may be “antiquated” but things like this set the stage for the treatment of blacks in this country, how they are classified, and lastly affected the consciousness of an entire race of people. That stays in families for generations and doesn’t end just because someone claims it is “antiquated”.
[quote]Sloth wrote:
I’ve been on the wrong end of black pride. Honest to goodness pumpa fist into the air black pride. Nothing like being on the ground in the middle of kicking, spitting, “black power” and “cracker” chanting crowd. I’m just as suspicious of “black pride,” as I am of “white pride.” [/quote]
Same here. I can’t count how many times as I as a white man living in a city had racial epithets directed at me by blacks and to a lesser extent Hispanics.
I have also been physically attacked and verbally attacked/harassed/intimidated because of my skin color. The hatred that some blacks have for whites in this country can border on the psychopathic.
The numbers of whites in America who live in cities is much smaller than ones who don’t, but it doesn’t make it less of a reality for the ones who are stuck there, or who chose to deal with it because they like living in a city.
Why don’t black people own the convenience stores, instead of Koreans?
[quote]phil_leotardo wrote:
Obama is biracial. Or has this term somehow disappeared from the American landscape? What else could you use to describe someone who is composed of two different races?
The “one drop” rule was more about the concept of white racial purity than anything else. It can all be explained in terms of in-group/out group dynamics. [/quote]
I think bi-racial suggests equal amount of black and something else. Historically, 1/16th black is hexadecaroon.
You are right though, the classification scheme has to do with in/out dynamics. Which explains why Native Americans are looking to limit entitlement to tribal identity and their rules are designed to exclude, not include.
[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:
The rest of us acknowledge his race only long enough to remark how far we have come on matters of race, then ignore it and measure the man on his merits - “content of his character”, rather than color of his skin.[/quote]
This is what I fail to understand. How is it that so many others cannot grasp this measuring up system. Every individual should be graded on their merit. That is the only way to truly know an individual.
I can only come to the conclusion that weak people are unable to grasp this simple concept. Their inability to rise about their total selfcentredness is their down fall. Unfortunatly they try to drag the rest of us with them. This however only makes us stronger and them weaker.
You breath, bleed and you struggle. You must eat and drink to survive. This alone makes us related (six degrees of seperation).
[quote]Loose Tool wrote:
I think bi-racial suggests equal amount of black and something else. Historically, 1/16th black is hexadecaroon.
You are right though, the classification scheme has to do with in/out dynamics. Which explains why Native Americans are looking to limit entitlement to tribal identity and their rules are designed to exclude, not include.
[/quote]
Arabs in themselves are hard to classify from a racial standpoint. They were very fond of practicing black slavery and as like, many mixed with sub-Saharan Nubian slaves. Judging by his morphology, his father probably carried quite a bit of sub-Saharan DNA, either that or he managed to get some dominant alleles from him, which again would suggest dominant sub-Saharan DNA.
[quote]jp_dubya wrote:
Big_Boss wrote:
RyanBrown0311 wrote:
I don’t wear Irish pride shirts come St.Patrick’s Day…nor do I celebrate Kwanza…nor do I try to gain acknowledgment by Alabama-Coushatta Tribe.
and why not? I’d pay a little bit to get a picture of you on St. Pattie’s day with a “Kiss me, brother, I’m Irish” T-shirt
FUBU brand only of course.
[/quote]
This would be the back of it
[quote]phil_leotardo wrote:
I have also been physically attacked and verbally attacked/harassed/intimidated because of my skin color. The hatred that some blacks have for whites in this country can border on the psychopathic.
[/quote]
And…? The hatred that some have for in this country can border on the psychopathic. The hatred can go in any direction.
Many people have been attacked by members of other racial and ethnic groups. I got my ass kicked during the Rodney King trials. So what? That’s life. If I had let that, or a few other incidences, shape my perception and opinion of blacks, my life would have been very different.
I understand some blacks out there will hate me for my skin color. I’m ok with that. Blacks should understand that there are going to be some whites that hate them solely for their skin color. They should accept that, too, as long as there is still equal opportunity.
I think part of the problem with a discussion like this is that “pride” isn’t quite the right word. To me pride denotes almost a boastfulness. I don’t think that’s quite what identity pride is about.
For a long time many blacks lived with shame of their skin color and envy of whites. With changing times, attitudes shifted from shame to, well, something opposite of shame and envy. Racial pride is more about accepting identity regardless of outside opinions of that race. It’s not supposed to be about “in-your-face, better-than-you” boasting.
[quote]streamline wrote:
thunderbolt23 wrote:
The rest of us acknowledge his race only long enough to remark how far we have come on matters of race, then ignore it and measure the man on his merits - “content of his character”, rather than color of his skin.
This is what I fail to understand. How is it that so many others cannot grasp this measuring up system. Every individual should be graded on their merit. That is the only way to truly know an individual.
I can only come to the conclusion that weak people are unable to grasp this simple concept. Their inability to rise about their total selfcentredness is their down fall. Unfortunatly they try to drag the rest of us with them. This however only makes us stronger and them weaker.
You breath, bleed and you struggle. You must eat and drink to survive. This alone makes us related (six degrees of seperation). [/quote]
What I fail to understand is why whenever somebody does precisely what you say here and the person is black they are labeled as racists even when they proclaim in unmistakable terms that race plays no part whatever in what they’re saying.
[quote]malonetd wrote:
phil_leotardo wrote:
I have also been physically attacked and verbally attacked/harassed/intimidated because of my skin color. The hatred that some blacks have for whites in this country can border on the psychopathic.
And…? The hatred that some have for in this country can border on the psychopathic. The hatred can go in any direction.
Many people have been attacked by members of other racial and ethnic groups. I got my ass kicked during the Rodney King trials. So what? That’s life. If I had let that, or a few other incidences, shape my perception and opinion of blacks, I wouldn’t have had any friends or family growing up.
I understand some blacks out there will hate me for my skin color. I’m ok with that. Blacks should understand that there are going to be some whites that hate them solely for their skin color. They should accept that, too, as long as there is still equal opportunity.
I think part of the problem with a discussion like this is that “pride” isn’t quite the right word. To me pride denotes almost a boastfulness. I don’t think that’s quite what identity pride is about.
For a long time many blacks lived with shame of their skin color and envy of whites. With changing times, attitudes shifted from shame to, well, something opposite of shame and envy. Racial pride is more about accepting identity regardless of outside opinions of that race. It’s not supposed to be about “in-your-face, better-than-you” boasting.
[/quote]
You shouldn’t have to explain that. When James Brown came out with “I’m Black and I’m Proud”, my mom told me it became an anthem for blacks in this country. Up until that time they had been socially degraded yet here was this guy on the radio that was getting air play on all stations suddenly making it ok to be proud of who you were.
Whites in general have never faced any of this. To act as if “black pride” is the same as some boasting “white pride” only shows how ignorant some people are of history.
That study done in the early 80’s where they asked children of both races which doll was “bad” (while showing them a black and white doll) comes to mind. The fact that you would hopefully get a completely different response today shows the need for “black pride” in this country.
This should be common knowledge, however. You would have to have been raised like a mushroom to not be aware of this in this country.
There’s a huge difference in being “proud” of your cultural heritage and feeling a racial superiority.
“White Pride” as a phrase has almost exclusively been used as an expression of the latter. I don’t think anyone is bent out of shape over “Irish Pride” or St. Patrick Day parades.
However with American blacks it’s not that simple because of the historical nature. Much of that cultural history is lost. It’s hard to know who came from where. So “Black Pride” can be used in a number of ways, pride in the American experience of being black, pride in the cultural African heritage, or a feeling of racial superiority.
It’s really context specific as to whether it’s true pride or racism. Which there were different phrases like in the “white” case but unfortunately there aren’t.
This thread can now be closed. This is really a semantic issue.
The more I have read of this thread,it really highlights something that is not being taking into account.
Ok,you have Obama,whom people claim is “not really” the first black president. This is taking further in saying he’s not even black or African-American to begin with.
Well,if you really want to get all technical and shit,he’s actually more “black” than say me or Prof X. We’re descendants of descendants from Africa…yet Obama’s father is straight from Africa…whether he is “Arab” or whatever…he is in fact African.
What are the possibilities that a percentage of slaves brought to North America could in fact be ethnically “broken down” into the same or similar category as Obama’s father…and be claimed as “not black?”
So,who is “black?” Refer back to the numerous threads discussing “what is race?”
Why do “black” people that obviously have a great percentage of other races refer to themselves as being “black?” Is it just because we are descendants of “black” Africans…OR is it something else…that we have in common?
I know the majority of those(who are not “black” themselves) that make this argument of who is or is not black know the answers…YET they somehow disregard them in this discussion.
If Obama does in fact say he is black…is he wrong? If Tyson Beckford says he’s black…is he right? If my half Japanese wife says she is black…who has the authority to say she is wrong? And what makes her wrong??
And finally…who gives a fuck if someone is “black” or not?..They are American. When that becomes a standard response from BOTH sides(or all nationalities in general)…we will have finally accomplished something.
[quote]Moriarty wrote:
There’s a huge difference in being “proud” of your cultural heritage and feeling a racial superiority.
“White Pride” as a phrase has almost exclusively been used as an expression of the latter. I don’t think anyone is bent out of shape over “Irish Pride” or St. Patrick Day parades.
However with American blacks it’s not that simple because of the historical nature. Much of that cultural history is lost. It’s hard to know who came from where.
So “Black Pride” can be used in a number of ways, pride in the American experience of being black, pride in the cultural African heritage, or a feeling of racial superiority. It’s really context specific as to whether it’s true pride or racism. Which there were different phrases like in the “white” case but unfortunately there aren’t.
This thread can now be closed. This is really a semantic issue.[/quote]
Nice…that ties into what I said about “black” being a subjective term.
[quote]Big_Boss wrote:
If Obama does in fact say he is black…is he wrong? If Tyson Beckford says he’s black…is he right? If my half Japanese wife says she is black…who has the authority to say she is wrong? And what makes her wrong??[/quote]
Apparently some people in this thread want the authority to decide if a person is black enough to be called black.
Black = Dark skin tone.
Black =/= African.
How fucking hard is that people? Seriously.
[quote]Beowolf wrote:
Black = Dark skin tone.
Black =/= African.
How fucking hard is that people? Seriously.[/quote]
1/16 hard.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
It may be “antiquated” but things like this set the stage for the treatment of blacks in this country, how they are classified, and lastly affected the consciousness of an entire race of people. That stays in families for generations and doesn’t end just because someone claims it is “antiquated”. [/quote]
The notion of a “drop” of blood in someone’s body being from a different race is silly and completely unscientific. People of differing races who have the same blood type can exchange blood freely and it wouldn’t change their race.
People who are half black and half white are biracial. How could it be otherwise?
[quote]Christine wrote:
Beowolf wrote:
Black = Dark skin tone.
Black =/= African.
How fucking hard is that people? Seriously.
1/16 hard.[/quote]
They have pills to make it harder.
[quote]malonetd wrote:
And…? The hatred that some have for in this country can border on the psychopathic. The hatred can go in any direction.[/quote]
I never said that only black people can be racist. Hate crimes committed by whites against non-whites are usually highly publicized. Usually the reverse does not get as much media attention. Most whites are oblivious to black racism because the majority of whites do not live in cities anymore.
[quote]malonetd wrote:
Many people have been attacked by members of other racial and ethnic groups. I got my ass kicked during the Rodney King trials. So what? That’s life. If I had let that, or a few other incidences, shape my perception and opinion of blacks, my life would have been very different.[/quote]
I don’t hold their entire race responsible for the actions of the ones whom I have had bad experiences with. However, if you live in a city, and you are white, you do have to deal with racist black people.
[quote]malonetd wrote:
I understand some blacks out there will hate me for my skin color. I’m ok with that. Blacks should understand that there are going to be some whites that hate them solely for their skin color. They should accept that, too, as long as there is still equal opportunity.
I think part of the problem with a discussion like this is that “pride” isn’t quite the right word. To me pride denotes almost a boastfulness. I don’t think that’s quite what identity pride is about.
For a long time many blacks lived with shame of their skin color and envy of whites. With changing times, attitudes shifted from shame to, well, something opposite of shame and envy. Racial pride is more about accepting identity regardless of outside opinions of that race. It’s not supposed to be about “in-your-face, better-than-you” boasting.[/quote]
For a long time, whites had a group identity, and now, en masse, their group identity as a group has been replaced with individual identity. When do you hear talk of a “white community” for example that isn’t from some group that is very far outside of the mainstream?