You’re defending him and his business background - you mean you don’t actually know? Trump University? His massive Chapter 11 reorganizations?
Wouldn’t it make more sense to learn about these things before touting his business acumen?
I forgot to add one of his sleazy tactics - frivolous lawsuits. Good with that one, too?
Have you still not read up on the strategies of the largest businesses in the world?
…and you’re telling me to read up…
Uh, what? Not sure what your point is here.
No I know exactly why, I am asking why YOU think that.
The institute had a 98% approval rating. Look at the surveys from the guys featured in the attack ad by Rubio centring around Trump University:
Gee, they’re unsatisfied now that he’s running for office and there’s money to be made?
Also the Better Business Bureau gave it an A rating
Ultimately the case is still in court but I have to ask: What do you think will happen when they put the students on the stand and they show them the survey they filled out with a glowing review?
[quote=“thunderbolt23, post:724, topic:215570, full:true”]
His massive Chapter 11 reorganizations?[/quote]
So of the hundreds of deals he’s made he’s filed for bankruptcy four times. I’m no expert in bankruptcy but here’s what a law professor said:
I never thought I’d write this, but Donald Trump speaks the truth, at least as far as bankruptcy is concerned.
There’s plenty to criticize regarding Donald Trump, but I really wish the media would back off the bankruptcy angle of his career, or at least be smarter about it.
Let’s start with the facts. Donald Trump has never filed for personal bankruptcy. But companies that he owns have filed for Chapter 11 four times. The mere fact of these filings is somehow imputed to be a personal failing of Donald Trump. I have never heard anyone suggest that the filings were because of Trump’s bad management. Perhaps they were, but a bankruptcy filing is not in-and-of-itself a sign of any sort of moral failing, lack of business acumen, etc. Sometimes businesses go bankrupt because they’re poorly run, and sometimes because of factors beyond their control. The Donald wasn’t filing for bankruptcy like 50 Cent to attempt to avoid paying an intentional tort judgment. And indeed, how, much, if at all, was Trump involved in the management of the companies? I wouldn’t be shocked if he was basically licensing his name.
You know what? He’s right. Bankruptcy is a background term to every contract. It’s an embedded option. Lenders price for it. This is old news to bankruptcy scholars, even if it still shocks some people. (Sanctity of contract, they wail, forgetting that contracts are written against the backdrop of bankruptcy!) Trump had every right to file his companies for bankruptcy, and no one should weep for his lenders having lost money. They were sophisticated parties (“sharks” he called them, but that’s a bit harsh, I’d just say “consenting adults”), who presumably priced for Trump’s bankruptcy risk and had diversified portfolios. Frankly, Trump would be a fool if he hadn’t filed for bankruptcy.
Oh and another fun fact: One of the financiers in one of Trump’s biggest bankruptcies was Carl Ikhan, a guy who endorses Trump.
“1. Trump Taj Mahal, 1991
Trump’s first bankruptcy filing was probably the most personally painful for him. To come up with the funds he needed, he sold a 282-foot yacht, as well as the Trump Shuttle, the airline he operated at the time that flew between Washington, D.C., New York and Boston, according to media reports at the time. He had to give up half of his ownership stake in the Trump Taj Mahal, but he did retain control of the property. His largest creditor was financier Carl Icahn, who held $400 million in bonds. Now Icahn is Trump’s pick for Treasury secretary should he be elected.”
As for the frivolous lawsuits, it seems as though he has made a lot of frivolous lawsuits. But people who are rich are constantly sued and suing others. Could just be the nature of the game to a large degree (just my guess).
Your whole premise is that he is an unqualified, overblown snake oil salesman, and that his business acumen is therefore null.
I’m saying that you are wrong, because what he has done is not only not unusual, but part of the strategy playbook of the largest businesses in the world.
That is what I’m getting at.
That Trump U thing is kinda funny. I did a thing a while back for stock trading and investing. I just did the first level stuff- how to read a chart, basic stuff, for 750 bucks. It worked. I got charged up, bought some shares of a few companies, put away a nice little nest egg and had a good time doing it. Fair play in my book.
Now other people went further, spent more and never did anything with it. They feel ripped off and sued. All the same claims about Trump U. But they are the ones that didn’t apply it.
Is that legit? Do they really have a fair gripe?
This is hilarious. Are you even reading the articles you post?
Trump is unlike any other entrepreneur in this area in his need to rely on Chapter 11 protection, Compared to his peers on that metric, he’s clearly underperformed.
And you, knowing little about the business acumen of the man you defend, cute articles that actually support criticism of Trump’s acumen.
Clown show.
You just ignored the meat of my post
Unfortunately we won’t really know until it’s gone through the court system.
What I’m saying with respect to Trump University is there are suspicious elements to the claims made against it, and it’s hard to use that as a knock against his business acumen
No, I didn’t - you didn’t even read and understand the article you cited. Fact is, you have no idea what Trump’s four Chapter 11 bankruptcies means with respect to an evaluation of his business acumen. You love Trump, but are generally uninformed.
Trump had every right to declare bankruptcy, it is a right - but the fact that he did so many times over cuts against this notion that Trump is this super-duper business genius that will bring them smarts to the presidency. Far from it, he didn’t succeed and needed government intervention to save him from creditors on multiple occasions.
But what he has done is, by definition, not unusual in the good sense, because his rate of return over a period of time doesn’t beat the average rate of return in the market.
If you have given a money manager your money and he underperformed the average market rate over the same period of time, would you be falling over yourself complimenting this person as a business genius?
Of course not.
This is a claim made by people who just found out that little tidbit by way of the numerous articles that have exposed the fact. Not the people who have made it a reality.
It’s like an article goes around the web and suddenly everybody is Warren Buffet. I’m officially raising the brown flag of bullshit on the use of that fact unless it comes with a personal portfolio that also beats the street.
This is nothing short of an evasion of the issues. What if Hillary constantly filed frivolous lawsuits to intimidate her critics? There wouldn’t be this milktoast “well, I guess rich people just so this stuff, whatever” responses.
Far from it, there’d be post after post about how evil she was to use this tactic against enemies. (Mindless cheerleader Zeb would be leading the way, citing Judge Jeanine all the way.)
Trump should be cited as an example of how rich people abuse the system to protect themselves, but instead we get full-throated defenses of him and constant apologies.
You all have been fleeced, and hard. Tell me, how does it feel to wake up every day and stare into the mirror and see a sucker?
My point is you cannot use that as a strike against his business acumen when we don’t know how much of it his fault very similar to Trump University.
Here’s my guess on why a lot of people dislike Trump and doubt his business acumen:
They don’t like the way he presents himself, his vulgarity, the divisiveness he’s created within the GOPe and his endless philandering. So because of these personal flaws the well is I guess poisoned and therefore he’s probably also a scummy business man by extension.
As for abusing the system with frivolous lawsuits I honestly don’t know I’ll have to look into that.
[quote=“thunderbolt23, post:739, topic:215570, full:true”]
Trump should be cited as an example of how rich people abuse the system to protect themselves, but instead we get full-throated defenses of him and constant apologies.[/quote]
I would expect Trump or any CEO for that matter to act 100% in their company’s interests while staying within the framework in the law. That’s exactly how a CEO should act. Look at Bernie Sanders tax return he used tax credits himself. Why should be that be looked down upon no one wants to pay taxes.
Of course you can, that’s idiotic. I’m in the business world. If someone interviewed for an executive position and they said that on their watch, they had to file four Chapter 11s, we wouldn’t hire them.
On that note, name a company that would hire Trump as CEO that Trump didn’t himself own.
Yep, it’s a guess, and yep, it’s wrong.
TB,
Someone like Trump would not have been lasted as long as he has in the real estate game if his temperament, character, and shallowness were an issue. Has he failed at times ? Yes. Now go find me an entrepreneur who has never failed, and I will show a raging case of denial. Denial, it’s not just a river.
I would not suggest attacking Trump on his inexperience, I can name you 16 candidates who tried that and it failed 16 times.