Prepare for the Next Attack

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
81

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
Seems to me that all you have managed to post are gross overgeneralizations.
[/quote]

Did you already forget that you were making gross generalizations about Muslims? Remember, they all hate the West and want to go on Jihad?

You know just as well as I do what Christians have done in the name of their god over the centuries. You have bragged several times over your supposed grasp of history so you should be familiar with all this.

You have shown yourself to be quite hypocritical in this thread, bashing all things Muslim, yet ignoring the violence of Europeans/Christians over the centuries. You seemingly justify it because Christians were doing the killing.

Quit the childish games. I have made it pretty clear what my disagreements have been.

Well, reality tells me your full of hot air when you make sweeping generalizations about Muslims.

82

[quote]Dustin wrote:

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:

I know enough about it to ask you what you think about your noble Christian brethren killing everything in their path during the Crusades? Blatant atrocities were committed against civilians.
[/quote]

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Atrocities+Committed+during+the+crusades

For being an expert on this topic, I figured you would have known this.[/quote]

wow - that explains a lot about your information.

And yet, they did not “kill everything in their path” - were atrocities committed? Yes - I believe we have been over that before. But let’s put some context in here shall we?

634-644 The Caliphate of Umar ibn al-Khattab, who is regarded as particularly brutal.

635 Muslim Crusaders besiege and conquer of Damascus.

636 Muslim Crusaders defeat Byzantines decisively at Battle of Yarmuk.

637 Muslim Crusaders conquer Iraq at the Battle of al-Qadisiyyah (some date it in 635 or 636).

638 Muslim Crusaders conquer and annex Jerusalem, taking it from the Byzantines.

638-650 Muslim Crusaders conquer Iran, except along Caspian Sea.

639-642 Muslim Crusaders conquer Egypt.

641 Muslim Crusaders control Syria and Palestine.

643-707 Muslim Crusaders conquer North Africa.

644 Caliph Umar is assassinated by a Persian prisoner of war; Uthman ibn Affan is elected third Caliph, who is regarded by many Muslims as gentler than Umar.

644-650 Muslim Crusaders conquer Cyprus, Tripoli in North Africa, and establish Islamic rule in Iran, Afghanistan, and Sind.

656 Caliph Uthman is assassinated by disgruntled Muslim soldiers; Ali ibn Abi Talib, son-in-law and cousin to Muhammad, who married the prophetâ??s daughter Fatima through his first wife Khadija, is set up as Caliph.

656 Battle of the Camel, in which Aisha, Muhammadâ??s wife, leads a rebellion against Ali for not avenging Uthmanâ??s assassination. Aliâ??s partisans win.

657 Battle of Siffin between Ali and Muslim governor of Jerusalem, arbitration goes against Ali

661 Murder of Ali by an extremist; Aliâ??s supporters acclaim his son Hasan as next Caliph, but he comes to an agreement with Muawiyyah I and retires to Medina.

661-680 the Caliphate of Muawiyyah I. He founds Umayyid dynasty and moves capital from Medina to Damascus

673-678 Arabs besiege Constantinople, capital of Byzantine Empire

680 Massacre of Hussein (Muhammadâ??s grandson), his family, and his supporters in Karbala, Iraq.

691 Dome of the Rock is completed in Jerusalem, only six decades after Muhammadâ??s death.

705 Abd al-Malik restores Umayyad rule.

710-713 Muslim Crusaders conquer the lower Indus Valley.

711-713 Muslim Crusaders conquer Spain and impose the kingdom of Andalus. This article recounts how Muslims today still grieve over their expulsion 700 years later. They seem to believe that the land belonged to them in the first place.

719 Cordova, Spain, becomes seat of Arab governorship.

732 The Muslim Crusaders are stopped at the Battle of Poitiers; that is, Franks (France) halt Arab advance.

749 The Abbasids conquer Kufah and overthrow Umayyids.

756 Foundation of Umayyid emirate in Cordova, Spain, setting up an independent kingdom from Abbasids.

762 Foundation of Baghdad

785 Foundation of the Great Mosque of Cordova

789 Rise of Idrisid emirs (Muslim Crusaders) in Morocco; foundation of Fez; Christoforos, a Muslim who converted to Christianity, is executed.

800 Autonomous Aghlabid dynasty (Muslim Crusaders) in Tunisia.

807 Caliph Harun al-Rashid orders the destruction of non-Muslim prayer houses and of the Church of Mary Magdalene in Jerusalem.

809 Aghlabids (Muslim Crusaders) conquer Sardinia, Italy.

813 Christians in Palestine are attacked; many flee the country.

831 Muslim Crusaders capture of Palermo, Italy; raids in Southern Italy.

850 Caliph al-Matawakkil orders the destruction of non-Muslim houses of prayer.

855 Revolt of the Christians of Hims (Syria)

837-901 Aghlabids (Muslim Crusaders) conquer Sicily, raid Corsica, Italy, France.

869-883 Revolt of black slaves in Iraq

909 Rise of the Fatimid Caliphate in Tunisia; these Muslim Crusaders occupy Sicily, Sardinia.

928-969 Byzantine military revival, they retake old territories, such as Cyprus (964) and Tarsus (969).

937 The Ikhshid, a particularly harsh Muslim ruler, writes to Emperor Romanus, boasting of his control over the holy places.

937 The Church of the Resurrection (known as Church of Holy Sepulcher in Latin West) is burned down by Muslims; more churches in Jerusalem are attacked .

960 Conversion of Qarakhanid Turks to Islam

966 Anti-Christian riots in Jerusalem

969 Fatimids (Muslim Crusaders) conquer Egypt and found Cairo.

c. 970 Seljuks enter conquered Islamic territories from the East.

973 Israel and southern Syria are again conquered by the Fatimids.

1003 First persecutions by al-Hakim; the Church of St. Mark in Fustat, Egypt, is destroyed.

1009 Destruction of the Church of the Resurrection by al-Hakim (see 937)

1012 Beginning of al-Hakimâ??s oppressive decrees against Jews and Christians

1015 Earthquake in Palestine; the dome of the Dome of the Rock collapses.

1031 Collapse of Umayyid Caliphate and establishment of 15 minor independent dynasties throughout Muslim Andalus

1048 Reconstruction of the Church of the Resurrection completed

1050 Creation of Almoravid (Muslim Crusaders) movement in Mauretania; Almoravids (also known as Murabitun) are coalition of western Saharan Berbers; followers of Islam, focusing on the Quran, the hadith, and Maliki law.

1055 Seljuk Prince Tughrul enters Baghdad, consolidation of the Seljuk Sultanate.

1055 Confiscation of property of Church of the Resurrection

1071 Battle of Manzikert, Seljuk Turks (Muslim Crusaders) defeat Byzantines and occupy much of Anatolia.

1071 Turks (Muslim Crusaders) invade Palestine.

1073 Conquest of Jerusalem by Turks (Muslim Crusaders)

1075 Seljuks (Muslim Crusaders) capture Nicea (Iznik) and make it their capital in Anatolia.

1076 Almoravids (Muslim Crusaders) (see 1050) conquer western Ghana.

1085 Toledo is taken back by Christian armies.

1086 Almoravids (Muslim Crusaders) (see 1050) send help to Andalus, Battle of Zallaca.

1090-1091 Almoravids (Muslim Crusaders) occupy all of Andalus except Saragossa and Balearic Islands.

1094 Byzantine Emperor Alexius Comnenus I asks western Christendom for help against Seljuk invasions of his territory; Seljuks are Muslim Turkish family of eastern origins; see 970.

1095 Pope Urban II preaches first Crusade; they capture Jerusalem in 1099

Now, I am the first to admit that two wrongs do not make a right and I make no apology for the atrocities committed by the Crusaders, but you need to understand that any atrocities committed in the 11th century by Christians does not negate the hundreds of years of atrocities committed by the Muslims.

In addition, while it might make you feel justified in your ignorance to know that Christians can be cruel, it does not change the nature of Islam as a religion predicated upon submission or death.

83

[quote]Dustin wrote:

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
Seems to me that all you have managed to post are gross overgeneralizations.
[/quote]

Did you already forget that you were making gross generalizations about Muslims? Remember, they all hate the West and want to go on Jihad?

You know just as well as I do what Christians have done in the name of their god over the centuries. You have bragged several times over your supposed grasp of history so you should be familiar with all this.

You have shown yourself to be quite hypocritical in this thread, bashing all things Muslim, yet ignoring the violence of Europeans/Christians over the centuries. You seemingly justify it because Christians were doing the killing.

Quit the childish games. I have made it pretty clear what my disagreements have been.

Well, reality tells me your full of hot air when you make sweeping generalizations about Muslims.
[/quote]

guess that was a “No”

as stated above - any trangressions committed by Christians does not alter the nature of Islam. You can holler all you want about that, but it does not pertain to our discussion because our discussion has been about the character and foundation of the islamic faith - not about Christianity.

84

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
Dustin wrote:
IrishSteel wrote:

I know enough about it to ask you what you think about your noble Christian brethren killing everything in their path during the Crusades? Blatant atrocities were committed against civilians.
[/quote]

[quote]
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Atrocities+Committed+during+the+crusades

For being an expert on this topic, I figured you would have known this.[/quote]

All it shows is that you played dumb when I pointed out what Christians were doing in the name of their god, and whatever the church told them to do. You knew this, but wanted to argue semantics, “well, they didn’t kill everything in their path.” Poor phrasing on my part, but you knew what I was getting at.

You can ignore Christianity’s past of violence if it makes you feel better, but that doesn’t mean that it didn’t occur.

But it took you how many posts in this thread to admit this?

Is the Old Testament not full of examples where your god would smite those who didn’t follow his word? I know that you cannot be that ignorant of the violence in your own “good book”.

85

[quote]Dustin wrote:

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
Dustin wrote:
IrishSteel wrote:

I know enough about it to ask you what you think about your noble Christian brethren killing everything in their path during the Crusades? Blatant atrocities were committed against civilians.
[/quote]

[quote]
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Atrocities+Committed+during+the+crusades

For being an expert on this topic, I figured you would have known this.[/quote]

All it shows is that you played dumb when I pointed out what Christians were doing in the name of their god, and whatever the church told them to do. You knew this, but wanted to argue semantics, “well, they didn’t kill everything in their path.” Poor phrasing on my part, but you knew what I was getting at.

You can ignore Christianity’s past of violence if it makes you feel better, but that doesn’t mean that it didn’t occur.

But it took you how many posts in this thread to admit this?

Is the Old Testament not full of examples where your god would smite those who didn’t follow his word? I know that you cannot be that ignorant of the violence in your own “good book”.[/quote]

does not change the nature of Islam . . .ooommmm . . . . does not change the nature of Islame . . . .ooommmm . . . .does not change the nature of Islam . . .ooommmm . . . . does not change the nature of Islame . . . .ooommmm . . . .does not change the nature of Islam . . .ooommmm . . . . does not change the nature of Islame . . . .ooommmm . . . .does not change the nature of Islam . . .ooommmm . . . . does not change the nature of Islame . . . .ooommmm . . . .does not change the nature of Islam . . .ooommmm . . . . does not change the nature of Islame . . . .ooommmm . . . .

86

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:

[quote]Dustin wrote:

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
Dustin wrote:
IrishSteel wrote:

I know enough about it to ask you what you think about your noble Christian brethren killing everything in their path during the Crusades? Blatant atrocities were committed against civilians.
[/quote]

[quote]
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Atrocities+Committed+during+the+crusades

For being an expert on this topic, I figured you would have known this.[/quote]

All it shows is that you played dumb when I pointed out what Christians were doing in the name of their god, and whatever the church told them to do. You knew this, but wanted to argue semantics, “well, they didn’t kill everything in their path.” Poor phrasing on my part, but you knew what I was getting at.

You can ignore Christianity’s past of violence if it makes you feel better, but that doesn’t mean that it didn’t occur.

But it took you how many posts in this thread to admit this?

Is the Old Testament not full of examples where your god would smite those who didn’t follow his word? I know that you cannot be that ignorant of the violence in your own “good book”.[/quote]

does not change the nature of Islam . . .ooommmm . . . . does not change the nature of Islame . . . .ooommmm . . . .does not change the nature of Islam . . .ooommmm . . . . does not change the nature of Islame . . . .ooommmm . . . .does not change the nature of Islam . . .ooommmm . . . . does not change the nature of Islame . . . .ooommmm . . . .does not change the nature of Islam . . .ooommmm . . . . does not change the nature of Islame . . . .ooommmm . . . .does not change the nature of Islam . . .ooommmm . . . . does not change the nature of Islame . . . .ooommmm . . . .[/quote]

Full of hot air you are.

87

no, just staying on topic - the discussion was about the fact that since the very beginning of Islam, it’s contact with the West has been based in hate and war - as I have demonstrated with primary historical sources. Rather than having that discusion, though, you;ve wandered all over the reservation trying to bring up all sorts of unrelated, unnecessary discussions about anything but the actual facts I have laid out before you.

You have not countered a single factual statement about the nature of Islam. You have not provided any opposing proof that proves my basic premise is not accurate. You have not provided any rationale arguement which explains the centuries of bloodshed that the expansion of Islam is built upon can be considered “peaceful”.

This is not a discussion about Christianity - this is a discussion about the nature of Islam and its relationship to the West. period full stop

88

Sorry, Christianity and Islam can’t be compared. Human nature is rather brutal in the first place. So, atrocities will be a reoccuring theme throughout past and present regardless of the existence, or non-existence, of any religion. Men kill over being “disrespected,” for crying out loud. Now, if you’re looking at the fundamental instruction of Christ to his Apostles and audiences, instruction on how to spread the “good news,” and you contrast that with Muhammad…

Deal with it. The “Prophet” started a Military-Political-Theological force. Accept it and move on, folks. It’s foolish to not admit this. Is the scarlet “R” really this scary? Raaaaaaaaacist!

89

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
no, just staying on topic - the discussion was about the fact that since the very beginning of Islam, it’s contact with the West has been based in hate and war - as I have demonstrated with primary historical sources. Rather than having that discusion, though, you;ve wandered all over the reservation trying to bring up all sorts of unrelated, unnecessary discussions about anything but the actual facts I have laid out before you. [/quote]

You lose all credibility when you make retarded generalizations that all Muslims hate the west because their book says to. This ignores the reality that their are untold numbers of Muslims around the world who are peaceful and aren’t fundamentalists.

Your primary historical documents mean nothing when you ignore reality.

This is also a telling statement of you:

[quote]
Say what you will, in the end, either you will have to fight islam or submit to it [/quote]

You sound like a spokesman for the Bush Administration.

See above.

[quote]
This is not a discussion about Christianity - this is a discussion about the nature of Islam and its relationship to the West. period full stop[/quote]

I would claim this too if I were you, that way you don’t have to justify what your religion has done over its history.

90

Back for more already? seriously?

OK - let’s break down the last set of foolishness - “there are millions of peaceful muslims, blah blah blah” - wow - really? Never said there weren’t - doesn’t change the history of the religion, doesn’t change the nature, doesn’t change the facts . . .so you’re point was what exactly - that the actual historical record that islam is violent and hateful to the West is wrong because there are millions of muslims living peacefully today in lands that were conquered and taken by Muslims through violence and bloodshed? Where does that even begin to make sense?

OOOhhh - you equated me to Bush . . . oh boo hoo . . . what kind of arguement is that?

“see above” I looked and looked and nope - no a single factual counter to my evidence.

Justify what my religion has done? Looking for moral equivalency are ya?

hmmm, let’s test your theory here as well.

and for your convenience, let’s just use modern day examples (so you don’t have to go through all those stuffy historical thingy’s and we’ll call the muslim crusades and the christian crusades as equal for sake of brevity - though you’d lose that argument too) How many Christian Fundamentalist terorist groups are there in the world today? and How many Islam Fundamentalist terrorists groups are there in the world today?

Personally, can’t think of single Christian example - oh wait a tic - there was that group in the news talking about violence against the US government . . . and . . . well . . . yeah

and on the other side . . .

Abu Nidal Organization (ANO) (International, Palestinian)
Abu Sayyaf Group (ASG) (Philippines)
Al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigades|Al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigade (Palestinian)
Al-Shabaab (Somalia)
Ansar al-Islam (Iraqi Kurdistan)
Armed Islamic Group (GIA) (Algeria)
Asbat an-Ansar (Lebanon)
Gamaâ??a al-Islamiyya (Egypt)
HAMAS (Islamic Resistance Movement) (Palestinian)
Harakat ul-Jihad-i-Islami/Bangladesh (HUJI-B) (Bangladesh)
Harakat ul-Mujahidin (HUM) (Pakistan)
Hizballah (Party of God) (Lebanon)
Hizbul Islam (Somalia)
Islamic Jihad Group (Palestinian)
Islamic Movement of Uzbekistan (IMU) (Uzbekistan)
Jaish-e-Mohammed (Army of Mohammed) (JEM) (Pakistan)
Jemaah Islamiya organization (JI) (South East Asia)
al-Jihad (Egyptian Islamic Jihad) (Egyptian Islamic Jihad) (Egypt)
Kongra-Gel (formerly Kurdistan Workers’ Party) (KGK, formerly PKK, KADEK, Kongra-Gel) (Turkey, Iraq, Iran, Syria)
Lashkar-e Tayyiba (Army of the Righteous) (LT) (Muridke, Pakistan)
Lashkar i Jhangvi (Pakistan)
Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam (LTTE) (Sri Lanka)
Libyan Islamic Fighting Group (LIFG) (Libya)
Moroccan Islamic Combatant Group (GICM) (Morocco)
Mujahedin-e Khalq Organization (MEK) (Iran)
Palestine Liberation Front (PLF) (Palestinian)
Palestinian Islamic Jihad (PIJ) (Palestinian)
Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine (PFLP) (Palestinian)
PFLP-General Command (PFLP-GC) (Palestinian)
Tanzim Qa’idat al-Jihad fi Bilad al-Rafidayn (QJBR) (al-Qaida in Iraq) (formerly Jama’at al-Tawhid wa’al-Jihad, JTJ, al-Zarqawi Network) (Iraq)
al-Qaâ??ida (Global)
al-Qaâ??ida in the Islamic Maghreb (formerly GSPC) (The Maghreb)

just to name a few . . . see I can make unrelated arguements too

How about victims of christian terrorism in the last century . . . hmmm well, one abortion doctor . . .

How about victims of Islamic terrorism in the last century . . . don’t really have space for all of the names, do we?

See, isn;t this fun?

and at the end of it all - Islam is still predicated on a history of violence and hate towards the West (not just Christians)

91

Oh, and stop rewording my statements into things I didn’t say

Example: I said “since the very beginning of Islam, it’s contact with the West has been based in hate and war”

you restated “you make retarded generalizations that all Muslims hate the west because their book says to”

Not the same statement at all - mine is a statement of classification of the nature of religion itself based on historical fact, while yours is a statement twisting my histrical perspective into a statement professing to know the personal feelings of every muslim living today - - do you see what you did there?

Care to try again?

92

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:

OK - let’s break down the last set of foolishness - “there are millions of peaceful muslims, blah blah blah” - wow - really? Never said there weren’t - doesn’t change the history of the religion, doesn’t change the nature, doesn’t change the facts . . .so you’re point was what exactly - that the actual historical record that islam is violent and hateful to the West is wrong because there are millions of muslims living peacefully today in lands that were conquered and taken by Muslims through violence and bloodshed? Where does that even begin to make sense?
[/quote]

The problem is you don’t remember what you say from post to post.

It makes perfect sense because you make the general statement that all Muslims want to kill Americans (Westerners). You have implied this throughout this thread.

Remember your non-sensical George Bush type comment that I quoted?

You lie and make generalizations about Muslims that aren’t true. You don’t like Muslims, that much is obvious.

The argument is that the statement in question was not rooted in fact. It was sensationalized garbage. It’s the reason I have continued to respond to you. You make up lies and half truths about a certain group of individuals and expect no one to call you on it.

You ignore your own religion’s violent past?

No, it just that you are a typical American that fails on every occasion to look in the mirror and apply to yourself the same standards you apply to everyone else (non-Americans). If I have lost you, go back to the first couple of posts I made in response to you in this thread. Remember, the “bully” analogy I made?

Are you that dense? Do you realize why OBL has waged a holy war on the West (America)? He has stated it numerous times. I let you look into that.

Do you also realize what impact the BS “war on terror” has done for recruitment of fanatical Muslim groups. Do you not understand why Palestinians may not like the U.S? Can you get it through your skull that the anger felt in the Arab world is not born in a vacuum? Can you at least try to wrap your mind around that?

No, it isn’t. I’m getting bored continually pointing out that your opinions of Muslims and America’s role in ME are blatantly incorrect.

I don’t doubt the Muslim history that you have discussed, but don’t act like your religion is free of rank violence and slaughter. Kudos to Christianity though, for moving out of the stone age.

SRSLY, you have issues. I will stop short of calling you a bigot, but you do have some pent up anger towards Muslims. You might need to seek help.

Anyway, we’re done here. Have a nice day.

93

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
Oh, and stop rewording my statements into things I didn’t say

Example: I said “since the very beginning of Islam, it’s contact with the West has been based in hate and war”

you restated “you make retarded generalizations that all Muslims hate the west because their book says to”

Not the same statement at all - mine is a statement of classification of the nature of religion itself based on historical fact, while yours is a statement twisting my histrical perspective into a statement professing to know the personal feelings of every muslim living today - - do you see what you did there?

Care to try again?[/quote]

Nonsense, go back and read your own damn posts. You have implied from the start that all Muslims hate America because “they are told to.”

You don’t even recall what you posted.

Good day sir.

94

LMAO- you still can’t even quote me accurately. care to show me that post? you know,the one where I said Muslims hate America because they are told to? oh, right . . . not here is it?

The closest comment there would be when, in response to your post that if we follow your logic “the U.S would not be hated by Muslims, or the rest of the world, for that matter.”, I said - “And yes, the US would still be hated as the West has ALWAYS been hated by the muslim - are you even aware that muslims were already attacking Europe UNPROVOKED in the 8th century?”

I then went on to prove that the entire history of Islam’s interaction with the West has been predicated upon hatred and war . . . to which you still have not countered with a single shred of evidence or coherent argument.

Soooo . … here we are again - I have posited my statements and proof and you are still avoiding the discussion and still misquoting me . . . have another go

95

Oh and Dustin, I also said “5. Um, yes they did wake up hating the West, Because Islam says they must . . .” but this was an indictment against the view of western culture as viewed by islamic teaching - the Koran is adamant about it moral values and every Mosque in the world warns its members to despise the lack of morals of the West and to hate its decadent culture because its decadence is abhorrent to Allah - if you like I can post a bunch of sermons to that effect. Or - you can see how Western behaviors considered normal in any western nation are prohibited in the ME - can give you a bunch of examples here as well.

Now, what I did not say - I did not say that “all Muslims hate America because they are told to.” - you really need to take the time to actually read and understand what I write - or not. whatever . . .

96

[quote]Dustin wrote:

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:

OK - let’s break down the last set of foolishness - “there are millions of peaceful muslims, blah blah blah” - wow - really? Never said there weren’t - doesn’t change the history of the religion, doesn’t change the nature, doesn’t change the facts . . .so you’re point was what exactly - that the actual historical record that islam is violent and hateful to the West is wrong because there are millions of muslims living peacefully today in lands that were conquered and taken by Muslims through violence and bloodshed? Where does that even begin to make sense?
[/quote]

The problem is you don’t remember what you say from post to post.

It makes perfect sense because you make the general statement that all Muslims want to kill Americans (Westerners). You have implied this throughout this thread.

Remember your non-sensical George Bush type comment that I quoted?

You lie and make generalizations about Muslims that aren’t true. You don’t like Muslims, that much is obvious.

The argument is that the statement in question was not rooted in fact. It was sensationalized garbage. It’s the reason I have continued to respond to you. You make up lies and half truths about a certain group of individuals and expect no one to call you on it.

You ignore your own religion’s violent past?

No, it just that you are a typical American that fails on every occasion to look in the mirror and apply to yourself the same standards you apply to everyone else (non-Americans). If I have lost you, go back to the first couple of posts I made in response to you in this thread. Remember, the “bully” analogy I made?

Are you that dense? Do you realize why OBL has waged a holy war on the West (America)? He has stated it numerous times. I let you look into that.

Do you also realize what impact the BS “war on terror” has done for recruitment of fanatical Muslim groups. Do you not understand why Palestinians may not like the U.S? Can you get it through your skull that the anger felt in the Arab world is not born in a vacuum? Can you at least try to wrap your mind around that?

No, it isn’t. I’m getting bored continually pointing out that your opinions of Muslims and America’s role in ME are blatantly incorrect.

I don’t doubt the Muslim history that you have discussed, but don’t act like your religion is free of rank violence and slaughter. Kudos to Christianity though, for moving out of the stone age.

SRSLY, you have issues. I will stop short of calling you a bigot, but you do have some pent up anger towards Muslims. You might need to seek help.

Anyway, we’re done here. Have a nice day.[/quote]

Dustin FTW!

97

[quote]THE_CLAMP_DOWN wrote:

Dustin FTW![/quote]

Because he so thoroughly documented his views? ooh ooh wait - it was all of those historical sources he used . . .or maybe not . . .

Like it or not - Islam chose to go to war with the west at its very foundation without provocation and with the purpose of gaining power and control over the globe in the name of Allah - I gave the facts and challenge anyone to prove otherwise.

The truth is there - all you have to do is read the history.

98

instead of discussing who went FTW;
here’s a profile on the perp - //www.nytimes.com/2010/05/05/nyregion/05profile.html

99

[quote]Dustin wrote:
I don’t doubt the Muslim history that you have discussed, but don’t act like your religion is free of rank violence and slaughter. Kudos to Christianity though, for moving out of the stone age.
[/quote]

where have we denied our religion is free of violence and slaughter and what does it matter? We are talking about the history of violent Muslims.

case in point:

All you history buffs ever hear of a guy named Caliph Hakim, who before the Crusades, presecuted and tried to exterminate the Christians in Syria?

He was a Fatimid ruler and if you know anything about history, one group the Crusaders were fighting were the Fatimids.

The Muslims attacked Christian lands first. The Byzantine lands were systematically being over run by Muslims. And after 4 centuries of this, the Europeans got involved to stop the Muslim advances and doing so, attacked in force.

So it seems like a double standard is being applied. When Muslims attack Europe, Africa, The Christian lands in the Middle East, Persia, India, Central Asia and the outskirts of China it’s ok…maybe the “religion of peace” they talk about, you know the guys sitting around drinking tea and doing algebra… those guys.

But when the Crusaders attempt to take back lost land and stop muslim military advances, suddenly we talk about atrocities and blood thirsty barbarians and what not.

Funny, i seem to recall a guy named Hakim, or maybe a group called the Khwarazians who attacked Crusader-held-Jerusalem and killed every living person. . . . .

Those are parts of the Crusades which get glossed over somehow…

100

[quote]Sloth wrote:
Sorry, Christianity and Islam can’t be compared. Human nature is rather brutal in the first place. So, atrocities will be a reoccuring theme throughout past and present regardless of the existence, or non-existence, of any religion. Men kill over being “disrespected,” for crying out loud. Now, if you’re looking at the fundamental instruction of Christ to his Apostles and audiences, instruction on how to spread the “good news,” and you contrast that with Muhammad…

Deal with it. The “Prophet” started a Military-Political-Theological force. Accept it and move on, folks. It’s foolish to not admit this. Is the scarlet “R” really this scary? Raaaaaaaaacist![/quote]

But he also started a religion that did not discriminate because of race or membership to a tribe, treated other religions and women very well and that was able to prevent internal conflict to a large degree.

That is also the nature of Islam and you chose to ignore that.