Open Carry Law

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
142

[quote]zecarlo wrote:
Yeah, right. Then the saying, guns don’t kill people, people kill people, would be false. If guns don’t matter when it comes to killing then how would they matter when it comes to not killing? If someone really wants you dead your gun won’t save you.

And as far as open carry goes: it’s a mistake for almost everyone. Unless you have some training and then the ability to put it into practice when it comes to weapons retention you should not advertize being armed. It is only a deterrent to those who were not much of a threat in the first place. Everyone should know about the 21 foot rule. Well, if someone who can beat you with his bare hands and they are close enough to close the gap before you can draw and fire then you are going to be beaten up at best and killed with your own gun at worst. Most people do not have weapons retention training and most couldn’t get through it anyway. There is video evidence of inmates training disarm techniques in prison. Police officers who have training get disarmed.

I’ve seen those videos with people openly carrying in order to provoke the cops into violating their rights. They can do that because of where they are. If it were legal to open carry in Newark, where I once lived, and one of those jokers walked around with an AR-15 slung over his shoulder he would only have it taken from him, not by force, but by fear of having his ass kicked. If some ex-con built like a linebacker said, “hand it over,” they surely would. I worked out with guys like that and most people, including most who post here, would not want to have to deal with them in a confrontation if possible. Why show your hand and lose any tactical advantage? I read somewhere how a guy who was carrying noticed how nice people were with him. That’s just someone fantasizing. If I believe I can kick your ass then carrying a gun won’t make me fear you any more than not carrying would. And since most people can’t fight for shit (Zimmerman anyone?) why walk around worrying about, “what if someone takes my gun away from me?”…and if you aren’t worried about that then you shouldn’t be openly carrying.

I’m not anti-gun mind you, I’m just saying all the would be Wyatt Earps need a reality check. I’ve seen that reality check when training cops in weapons retention. When someone smaller then they are is able to disarm them they realize just how vulnerable they are.
[/quote]

Are you also advocating disarming the military and police?

People only have to state, “I’m not anti-gun,” when they’re arguing against guns.

A gun is a deterrent to just about everybody. Criminals are predators-they are going to take the path of least resistance. School shooters kill themselves when the guys with guns show up.

Why do you believe carrying a firearm is about the carrier wanting others to fear him or her?

145

[quote]pushharder wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]pushharder wrote:
Starbucks Support

I’m headed to Starbucks now. With my SD 40 VE on my hip.[/quote]
And what if the bad guy is standing behind you in line? [/quote]

We can play the “what if” game all day and all night long. Wanna?[/quote]

What if he is standing behind the bad guy? Or WHAT IF the bad guy is standing behind push and another armed carrier is standing behind the bad guy?

147

[quote]Aragorn wrote:

[quote]pushharder wrote:
Starbucks Support

I’m headed to Starbucks now. With my SD 40 VE on my hip.[/quote]

nevrr liked Starbucks coffee, and in fact dislike them because they have been putting out local coffeehouses which I am a huge fan of. but I will make damned sure I go buy a drink from them today. and since I dont currently own a firearm I will.make sure to tell them why I am supporting them.[/quote]

I dunno man, good things happen to me at Starbucks. The last time i was there in my muckboots and a kimber on my hip the chick in front of me paid for my coffee. The next time after that the baristas gave me a coupon for free coffee.

148

[quote]theBeth wrote:

[quote]Aragorn wrote:

[quote]pushharder wrote:
Starbucks Support

I’m headed to Starbucks now. With my SD 40 VE on my hip.[/quote]

nevrr liked Starbucks coffee, and in fact dislike them because they have been putting out local coffeehouses which I am a huge fan of. but I will make damned sure I go buy a drink from them today. and since I dont currently own a firearm I will.make sure to tell them why I am supporting them.[/quote]

I dunno man, good things happen to me at Starbucks. The last time i was there in my muckboots and a kimber on my hip the chick in front of me paid for my coffee. The next time after that the baristas gave me a coupon for free coffee. [/quote]

Haha! You get sexier every time you post.

149

[quote]NickViar wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:
Yeah, right. Then the saying, guns don’t kill people, people kill people, would be false. If guns don’t matter when it comes to killing then how would they matter when it comes to not killing? If someone really wants you dead your gun won’t save you.

And as far as open carry goes: it’s a mistake for almost everyone. Unless you have some training and then the ability to put it into practice when it comes to weapons retention you should not advertize being armed. It is only a deterrent to those who were not much of a threat in the first place. Everyone should know about the 21 foot rule. Well, if someone who can beat you with his bare hands and they are close enough to close the gap before you can draw and fire then you are going to be beaten up at best and killed with your own gun at worst. Most people do not have weapons retention training and most couldn’t get through it anyway. There is video evidence of inmates training disarm techniques in prison. Police officers who have training get disarmed.

I’ve seen those videos with people openly carrying in order to provoke the cops into violating their rights. They can do that because of where they are. If it were legal to open carry in Newark, where I once lived, and one of those jokers walked around with an AR-15 slung over his shoulder he would only have it taken from him, not by force, but by fear of having his ass kicked. If some ex-con built like a linebacker said, “hand it over,” they surely would. I worked out with guys like that and most people, including most who post here, would not want to have to deal with them in a confrontation if possible. Why show your hand and lose any tactical advantage? I read somewhere how a guy who was carrying noticed how nice people were with him. That’s just someone fantasizing. If I believe I can kick your ass then carrying a gun won’t make me fear you any more than not carrying would. And since most people can’t fight for shit (Zimmerman anyone?) why walk around worrying about, “what if someone takes my gun away from me?”…and if you aren’t worried about that then you shouldn’t be openly carrying.

I’m not anti-gun mind you, I’m just saying all the would be Wyatt Earps need a reality check. I’ve seen that reality check when training cops in weapons retention. When someone smaller then they are is able to disarm them they realize just how vulnerable they are.
[/quote]

Are you also advocating disarming the military and police?

People only have to state, “I’m not anti-gun,” when they’re arguing against guns.

A gun is a deterrent to just about everybody. Criminals are predators-they are going to take the path of least resistance. School shooters kill themselves when the guys with guns show up.

Why do you believe carrying a firearm is about the carrier wanting others to fear him or her?[/quote]
What I’m saying is that people carry guns in order to address potential situations in which a gun can help them but they should put as much consideration, maybe more, in addressing situations in which carrying a gun won’t make a difference. As far as your question: I never said that but when people quote from a sci-fi story (the whole polite society thing) they are implying that. The idea that someone will be polite because of fear of getting shot only works if the person believes the person with the gun will be willing to shoot someone for being impolite.

I’m not anti-gun but I am anti people who are unable to protect their guns from being taken away openly carrying. You may think it’s a deterrent but it isn’t to everyone. BTW, there was an armed sheriff at Columbine and he wasn’t much of a deterrent, obviously.

150

[quote]zecarlo wrote:
What I’m saying is that people carry guns in order to address potential situations in which a gun can help them but they should put as much consideration, maybe more, in addressing situations in which carrying a gun won’t make a difference. As far as your question: I never said that but when people quote from a sci-fi story (the whole polite society thing) they are implying that. The idea that someone will be polite because of fear of getting shot only works if the person believes the person with the gun will be willing to shoot someone for being impolite.

I’m not anti-gun but I am anti people who are unable to protect their guns from being taken away openly carrying. You may think it’s a deterrent but it isn’t to everyone. BTW, there was an armed sheriff at Columbine and he wasn’t much of a deterrent, obviously. [/quote]

People eat food in order to fuel their bodies and survive, but they should also consider whether or not their eating habits are healthy. I am anti-stupidity, but there is no way to prevent it without trampling basic rights.

151

[quote]pushharder wrote:
Starbucks Support

I’m headed to Starbucks now. With my SD 40 VE on my hip.[/quote]

Nice piece…

152

[quote]jbpick86 wrote:
I think that this open carry and even some of the relaxed concealed carry stuff has the potential to set back gun rights. The first time you get someone go all John Wayne trying to stop a shoplifter and people get caught in the crossfire things are going to crash hard.[/quote]

I have to disagree with this. If anything open carry will improve gun rights, most people i have met who fear guns are motivated more out of ignorance anything. One of the major issues facing gun rights is the Media created dichotomy that if you carry a gun you must either be a cop or a criminal. If people start seeing average people such as their kids teacher, mailman, pastor, the cashier at the grocery store etc… carrying a gun it may very will help to eliminate the idea that individuals can exercise their rights lawfully without incident or being an agent of the state.

As far as the people going John Wayne, if it would happen with an open carrier it would happen with someone carrying concealed under the old law.

153

[quote]Hell-Billy wrote:

[quote]jbpick86 wrote:
I think that this open carry and even some of the relaxed concealed carry stuff has the potential to set back gun rights. The first time you get someone go all John Wayne trying to stop a shoplifter and people get caught in the crossfire things are going to crash hard.[/quote]

I have to disagree with this. If anything open carry will improve gun rights, most people i have met who fear guns are motivated more out of ignorance anything. One of the major issues facing gun rights is the Media created dichotomy that if you carry a gun you must either be a cop or a criminal. If people start seeing average people such as their kids teacher, mailman, pastor, the cashier at the grocery store etc… carrying a gun it may very will help to eliminate the idea that individuals can exercise their rights lawfully without incident or being an agent of the state.

As far as the people going John Wayne, if it would happen with an open carrier it would happen with someone carrying concealed under the old law. [/quote]

Correct.
And the other thing is that the last thing we ever want to do is have use the gun. We’re not unaware of what power we carry. The last thing we want to do is engage an altercation unless life is in danger. Gun carriers are less likely to escalate situations because they carry deadly force. The last thing we want to do is escalate a situation to the point of needing it.
I personally am more likely to walk away from a situation because I have a gun than I am without a gun. I know if need be, I can use it, but I don’t want to, ever.

154

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]Hell-Billy wrote:

[quote]jbpick86 wrote:
I think that this open carry and even some of the relaxed concealed carry stuff has the potential to set back gun rights. The first time you get someone go all John Wayne trying to stop a shoplifter and people get caught in the crossfire things are going to crash hard.[/quote]

I have to disagree with this. If anything open carry will improve gun rights, most people i have met who fear guns are motivated more out of ignorance anything. One of the major issues facing gun rights is the Media created dichotomy that if you carry a gun you must either be a cop or a criminal. If people start seeing average people such as their kids teacher, mailman, pastor, the cashier at the grocery store etc… carrying a gun it may very will help to eliminate the idea that individuals can exercise their rights lawfully without incident or being an agent of the state.

As far as the people going John Wayne, if it would happen with an open carrier it would happen with someone carrying concealed under the old law. [/quote]

Correct.
And the other thing is that the last thing we ever want to do is have use the gun. We’re not unaware of what power we carry. The last thing we want to do is engage an altercation unless life is in danger. Gun carriers are less likely to escalate situations because they carry deadly force. The last thing we want to do is escalate a situation to the point of needing it.
I personally am more likely to walk away from a situation because I have a gun than I am without a gun. I know if need be, I can use it, but I don’t want to, ever.[/quote]

I agree with everything you said Pat, I feel the same way myself. However, I have seen a lot of people start carrying with the new open carry law that are looking at that gun is more of a statement of machismo than anything else and those people are not doing gun rights any favors in the eyes of the non-gun loving public. As I said numerous times earlier, I know there is nothing that can be done about these people carrying without infringing upon all 2nd amend rights, but I don’t think saying that some of these people having constant access to a gun concerns me is unreasonable.

155

[quote]jbpick86 wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]Hell-Billy wrote:

[quote]jbpick86 wrote:
I think that this open carry and even some of the relaxed concealed carry stuff has the potential to set back gun rights. The first time you get someone go all John Wayne trying to stop a shoplifter and people get caught in the crossfire things are going to crash hard.[/quote]

I have to disagree with this. If anything open carry will improve gun rights, most people i have met who fear guns are motivated more out of ignorance anything. One of the major issues facing gun rights is the Media created dichotomy that if you carry a gun you must either be a cop or a criminal. If people start seeing average people such as their kids teacher, mailman, pastor, the cashier at the grocery store etc… carrying a gun it may very will help to eliminate the idea that individuals can exercise their rights lawfully without incident or being an agent of the state.

As far as the people going John Wayne, if it would happen with an open carrier it would happen with someone carrying concealed under the old law. [/quote]

Correct.
And the other thing is that the last thing we ever want to do is have use the gun. We’re not unaware of what power we carry. The last thing we want to do is engage an altercation unless life is in danger. Gun carriers are less likely to escalate situations because they carry deadly force. The last thing we want to do is escalate a situation to the point of needing it.
I personally am more likely to walk away from a situation because I have a gun than I am without a gun. I know if need be, I can use it, but I don’t want to, ever.[/quote]

I agree with everything you said Pat, I feel the same way myself. However, I have seen a lot of people start carrying with the new open carry law that are looking at that gun is more of a statement of machismo than anything else and those people are not doing gun rights any favors in the eyes of the non-gun loving public. As I said numerous times earlier, I know there is nothing that can be done about these people carrying without infringing upon all 2nd amend rights, but I don’t think saying that some of these people having constant access to a gun concerns me is unreasonable.[/quote]

If they have access after the law was passed, they had access before.

156

This is also true. The media storm that blew up around it however caused an definite spike in open carry activity amongst known dumbasses. They will get tired of it eventually and quit as it is more a reason to buy a new toy and show it off. With most of them I don’t think carrying will become part of their everyday routine as they are choosing to open carry giant ass wheel guns that would annoy almost anyone.

158

I did. By saying that the event in which I described (shoplifter, john wayne, innocent person collateral damage) merely hasn’t happened yet. But based off of simple probability, the more people that carry guns, the more a few idiots will be among those carrying. As the number of idiots carrying guns increases so does the probability that idiot with gun misuses gun in wrong situation creating a media shit storm.

159

[quote]jbpick86 wrote:
This is also true. The media storm that blew up around it however caused an definite spike in open carry activity amongst known dumbasses. They will get tired of it eventually and quit as it is more a reason to buy a new toy and show it off. With most of them I don’t think carrying will become part of their everyday routine as they are choosing to open carry giant ass wheel guns that would annoy almost anyone. [/quote]

I can open carry, but I prefer concealed. I don’t want to be bothered and I am not trying to make a statement and I don’t want to give away the fact that I am armed. If need be, people will find out. :slight_smile:
GA has a lot of flaws, but Gun laws are not one of them. We get licenses, not permits and we can carry almost anywhere save for schools, gov’t, buildings, some state parks and nuclear power plants, otherwise as long as you have a license, you can carry open or concealed.

160

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]jbpick86 wrote:
This is also true. The media storm that blew up around it however caused an definite spike in open carry activity amongst known dumbasses. They will get tired of it eventually and quit as it is more a reason to buy a new toy and show it off. With most of them I don’t think carrying will become part of their everyday routine as they are choosing to open carry giant ass wheel guns that would annoy almost anyone. [/quote]

I can open carry, but I prefer concealed. I don’t want to be bothered and I am not trying to make a statement and I don’t want to give away the fact that I am armed. If need be, people will find out. :slight_smile:
GA has a lot of flaws, but Gun laws are not one of them. We get licenses, not permits and we can carry almost anywhere save for schools, gov’t, buildings, some state parks and nuclear power plants, otherwise as long as you have a license, you can carry open or concealed.[/quote]

I think there is a definite advantage to concealed carry (my personal choice) over open carry. I would rather have the element of surprise and have someone not know that I am armed.