[quote]lixy wrote:
Nowadays, there are so many ways to do it that the guy shooting “liberals” in church just doesn’t cut it as a piece of news.
[/quote]
Front page on AOL today.
[quote]
Europeans don’t get their panties in a bunch because some whackjob has blown up a train. They’ve seen worse. In general, there is a sentiment of tranquility around here. The police does its work and everybody’s happy. [/quote]
You guys are messed up.
[quote]NateOrade wrote:
lixy wrote:
Nowadays, there are so many ways to do it that the guy shooting “liberals” in church just doesn’t cut it as a piece of news.
Front page on AOL today.
Europeans don’t get their panties in a bunch because some whackjob has blown up a train. They’ve seen worse. In general, there is a sentiment of tranquility around here. The police does its work and everybody’s happy.
You guys are messed up.[/quote]
Messed up? Did anything DysLixy “wrote” make any sense whatsoever? Was there one feeble utterance which wasn’t self-contradictory?
What a maroon!
Oh, well. DysLixy: When bigotry dictates opinion, I suppose this is the crap that issues.
[quote]DrSkeptix wrote:
NateOrade wrote:
lixy wrote:
Nowadays, there are so many ways to do it that the guy shooting “liberals” in church just doesn’t cut it as a piece of news.
Front page on AOL today.
Europeans don’t get their panties in a bunch because some whackjob has blown up a train. They’ve seen worse. In general, there is a sentiment of tranquility around here. The police does its work and everybody’s happy.
You guys are messed up.
Messed up? Did anything DysLixy “wrote” make any sense whatsoever? Was there one feeble utterance which wasn’t self-contradictory?
Contradictory…an Arab, in Sweden, cannot find even one Arab country that might be acceptable to his sorry butt. What a maroon!
Oh, well. DysLixy: When bigotry dictates opinion, I suppose this is the crap that issues.[/quote]
Maroon? Eh, what’s up, doc?
And personal attacks? You must be really desperate.
Explain how my current place of residency is in any way relevant. Also, what’s “Arab” have to do with anything here?
What a huge pile of horse dropping.
Ironically those people in europe who deserve to be called unfairly anti-american show an ignorance and stupidity that is pretty similar to the average flag waving, Bush voting idiots in america, like Zap and others here.
[quote]Ken Kaniff wrote:
Something else that needs to be considered in the present European anti-Americanism is fear. They have a large Muslim immigrant population over there and people are afraid of dying in the next terrorist attack.
They think that if they display a deep anti-Americanism that the terrorists will give them a pass and go after Americans instead. The reality is this anti-Americanism over strategy in the war on terror makes them a target.
What a huge pile of horse dropping.
Ironically those people in europe who deserve to be called unfairly anti-american show an ignorance and stupidity that is pretty similar to the average flag waving, Bush voting idiots in america, like Zap and others here.
[/quote]
All the big attacks and a lot of thwarted atacks in the west since 9/11 have been in Europe. The perpetrators blame US policy and there are Europeans who go along with it instead of blaming the perpetrators. This division between the Europeans and America is an invitation to exploit it by making attacks on the Europeans.
[quote]Ken Kaniff wrote:
a huge pile of horse dropping
[/quote]
[quote]Sifu wrote:
Something else that needs to be considered in the present European anti-Americanism is fear. They have a large Muslim immigrant population over there and people are afraid of dying in the next terrorist attack.
They think that if they display a deep anti-Americanism that the terrorists will give them a pass and go after Americans instead. The reality is this anti-Americanism over strategy in the war on terror makes them a target.
Because it encourages the terrorists to drive a wedge between the US and it’s allies by attacking them instead. This is why after 9/11 so many attacks have happened outside of the US.
[/quote]
You’re entitled to you opinion,but that is just so off base as to be laughable.Your statement is possibly more indicative of the level of fear and paranoia inside the U.S. than it is about feelings in Europe.
[quote]Neuromancer wrote:
Sifu wrote:
Something else that needs to be considered in the present European anti-Americanism is fear. They have a large Muslim immigrant population over there and people are afraid of dying in the next terrorist attack.
They think that if they display a deep anti-Americanism that the terrorists will give them a pass and go after Americans instead. The reality is this anti-Americanism over strategy in the war on terror makes them a target.
Because it encourages the terrorists to drive a wedge between the US and it’s allies by attacking them instead. This is why after 9/11 so many attacks have happened outside of the US.
You’re entitled to you opinion,but that is just so off base as to be laughable.Your statement is possibly more indicative of the level of fear and paranoia inside the U.S. than it is about feelings in Europe.
[/quote]
How many attacks in the US have there been since 9/11?
Now how many have there been in Europe?
My favorite response I’ve seen to the Obama speech: A quiz!
http://campaignspot.nationalreview.com/post/?q=NTExNDljMTgxYTQ3MTcxM2FkNTBhOTJmNWViZjE5YWY=
[i]There comes a time when we heed a certain call.’
There was not a ton to object to, and indeed a lot to like, in Obama’s speech in Berlin. Although I think I preferred it the first time I heard it, when it was sung by all those celebrities and rock stars back in the mid-80s.
Oh, wait, that was “We Are The World.”
UPDATE: Pop quiz, hot shot. Pick out the “We Are The World” lyrics vs. Obama speech lines.
A: “We can’t go on pretending day by day that someone, somewhere will soon make a change.”
B: “This is the moment we must help answer the call.”
C: “But if you just believe there’s no way we can fall.”
D. “The world will watch and remember what we do.”
E. “Let us realize that a change can only come when we stand together as one.”
F. “We cannot afford to be divided.”
G. “These now are the walls we must tear down.”
H. “This is the moment when we must come together.”
I. “They’ll know that someone cares, and their lives will be stronger and free.”
scroll down for answers
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We Are The World ( Michael Jackson - We Are The World lyrics | LyricsFreak ): A, C, E & I
Obama speech ( FOREIGN COMPANY BUYS U.S. ELECTION RESULTS REPORTING FIRM ) B, D, F, G & H. [/i]
[quote]Sifu wrote:
Neuromancer wrote:
Sifu wrote:
Something else that needs to be considered in the present European anti-Americanism is fear. They have a large Muslim immigrant population over there and people are afraid of dying in the next terrorist attack.
They think that if they display a deep anti-Americanism that the terrorists will give them a pass and go after Americans instead. The reality is this anti-Americanism over strategy in the war on terror makes them a target.
Because it encourages the terrorists to drive a wedge between the US and it’s allies by attacking them instead. This is why after 9/11 so many attacks have happened outside of the US.
You’re entitled to you opinion,but that is just so off base as to be laughable.Your statement is possibly more indicative of the level of fear and paranoia inside the U.S. than it is about feelings in Europe.
How many attacks in the US have there been since 9/11?
Now how many have there been in Europe?[/quote]
My point exactly.If Europe was on the same paranoia setting as the U.S,we would have seen a wholesale ramping up of the security and general inconvenience levels to travelers that are the norm in the U.S. But we haven’t.
Why do you think that is?
Because everyone is afraid to die in the next attack?
Uhmmm…no.
There is a realistic perspective on the situation in Europe.
[quote]Zap Branigan wrote:
orion wrote:
…
Interestingly enough they mostly attack infidels who have bases in their countries.
…
Like in Darfur or Turkey or India or Iraqi’s on their way to a funeral?
Why do you lie and deny so? Is your hatred for the US so deep? Did my uncle kill your grandpa?[/quote]
Very likely a Sowjet soldier or guerrilla killed my grandpa.
Dragged him out of his train and shot him.
[quote]Zap Branigan wrote:
orion wrote:
…
Interestingly enough they mostly attack infidels who have bases in their countries.
…
Like in Darfur or Turkey or India or Iraqi’s on their way to a funeral?
Why do you lie and deny so? Is your hatred for the US so deep? Did my uncle kill your grandpa?[/quote]
Did you really miss the entire second part of my post?
Darn, what a shame.
[quote]DrSkeptix wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:
orion wrote:
…
Interestingly enough they mostly attack infidels who have bases in their countries.
…
Like in Darfur or Turkey or India or Iraqi’s on their way to a funeral?
Why do you lie and deny so? Is your hatred for the US so deep? Did my uncle kill your grandpa?
No, Zap, your uncle did not kill Orion’s grandpa. He died in the Holocaust, too.
Fell out of a guard tower.[/quote]
Oberst and Hauptmann of the Wehrmacht. Both in Russia.
Where all the cool kids desperately wanted to be, because the Siberian winter is so much fun.
The entire spirit of this post has been lost. Instead of simply saying Bush sucks and circling back to Iraq, will anyone here refute my assertion that Obama is a full on Marxist? The impression I have gotten here thus far is that you Obama supporters ACCEPT that he’s a Marxist, and either don’t care or are Marxists yourselves.
mike
[quote]Mikeyali wrote:
The entire spirit of this post has been lost. Instead of simply saying Bush sucks and circling back to Iraq, will anyone here refute my assertion that Obama is a full on Marxist? The impression I have gotten here thus far is that you Obama supporters ACCEPT that he’s a Marxist, and either don’t care or are Marxists yourselves.
mike[/quote]
Agreed.
[quote]Mikeyali wrote:
The entire spirit of this post has been lost. Instead of simply saying Bush sucks and circling back to Iraq, will anyone here refute my assertion that Obama is a full on Marxist? The impression I have gotten here thus far is that you Obama supporters ACCEPT that he’s a Marxist, and either don’t care or are Marxists yourselves.
mike[/quote]
He is not a full blown Marxist because he does not want to socialize the American economy.
If you think that he will streamline the whole American economy to fight “global warming” he is actually more of a fascist. And the fascists only were half-assed Marxists.
This degree of fascism however is practically indistinguishable from the neocons and the IMC.
Even though strict regulations in yet another area might make you even less free, I don not think that he is more authoritarian or totalitarian than Bush. A tad more totalitarian and less authoritarian.
Of course we have never seen him do anything so that is pure speculation.
[quote]orion wrote:
He is not a full blown Marxist because he does not want to socialize the American economy.
[/quote]
Can I buy pot from you?
[quote]Mikeyali wrote:
The entire spirit of this post has been lost. Instead of simply saying Bush sucks and circling back to Iraq, will anyone here refute my assertion that Obama is a full on Marxist? The impression I have gotten here thus far is that you Obama supporters ACCEPT that he’s a Marxist, and either don’t care or are Marxists yourselves.
mike[/quote]
Marxist, no–that requires discipline–but are there other reasons why you might be concerned.
A comment on the Berlin speech, from Josef Joffee, and regarding Obama’s vacillation, and “right-wing” drift, and endorsement of US as universal policeman :
"This, of course, is Europe’s favorite dream: a post-Bush America cut down to size and chastened, a meeker and more modest America, a more “European” (that is, a more social-democratic) America, which at last casts off some of its nastier capitalist habits. An America that is a lot more like us Europeans who have forgone power politics and sovereignty in favor of communitarian politics and integration.
This is the canvas Europeans have been painting with wildly enthusiastic brush strokes. If Obama wins, the reality will be different. Sure, President Obama would speak more softly than did Mr. Bush in his first term, but he would still be carrying the biggest stick on earth. He will preside over an America that is still No. 1 and not part of a multipolar chorus populated by Russia, China, India, and the E.U.
Germans should have read the foreign-policy chapter in Obama’s The Audacity of Hope. There are passages in there which read like pure Bush–on unilateralist action, on the right of pre-emption, on playing the world’s “sheriff.” Obama’s upshot: “This will not change–nor should it.” This doesn’t mean more Bushism if Obama is elected. But it is a useful reminder that the U.S. plays in a league of its own–with global interest, with global military means, and with the willingness to use them.
In Berlin, hundreds of thousands will cheer a projection rather than a flesh-and-blood Obama on Thursday. After Inauguration Day, alas, Europe and the world will not face a Dreamworks president, but the leader of a superpower. Whether McCain or Obama, the 44th president will speak more nicely than did W. in his first term. He will also pay more attention to the “decent opinions of mankind.” But he will still preside over the world’s largest military, economic, and cultural power.
This vast power differential is what Germans and Europeans don’t quite fathom in their infatuation with Obama. Their problem was not Mr. Bush, but Mr. Big–America as Behemoth Among the Nations, unwilling to succumb to the dictates of goodness that animate post-heroic, post-imperial, and post-sovereign Europe."
(Josef Joffe is publisher-editor of the German weekly Die Zeit, as well as a fellow of the Institute for International Studies and the Hoover Institution, both at Stanford.)
http://www.tnr.com/politics/story.html?id=572973ad-b3aa-4c8c-9881-4d6640ea7eb4