Unfortunately, the source of most mood disorders is related to childhood issues. Whenever I meet someone who is on mood stabilizing drugs, I ask them how their home life was growing up. It’s always BAD. Other large traumas in someone’s life can also be responsible.
In my experience and from what I’ve read from countless people online, therapy just isn’t effective. I have a hypothesis that neurotransmitters - like hormones - can be depleted to the point of chronic exhaustion. At this point, the only way to feel normal again is to use pharmaceuticals. That is why therapy doesn’t work.
[quote]Thomas Gabriel wrote:
Unfortunately, the source of most mood disorders is related to childhood issues. Whenever I meet someone who is on mood stabilizing drugs, I ask them how their home life was growing up. It’s always BAD. Other large traumas in someone’s life can also be responsible.
In my experience and from what I’ve read from countless people online, therapy just isn’t effective. I have a hypothesis that neurotransmitters - like hormones - can be depleted to the point of chronic exhaustion. At this point, the only way to feel normal again is to use pharmaceuticals. That is why therapy doesn’t work. [/quote]
If your hypothesis is correct, couldn’t you just build them back up again?
[quote]BigKDawg wrote:
The only benefit pharmaceuticals give is to Big Pharma’s bottom line. They all belong in the g-d damn waste basket! Of course that is a huge generalization… but for the most part, people would do so much better for themselves healthwise if they would be proactive about their health and quit believing in these fairy tales the fundie pharmies keep selling em throughout the media.
But I guess for many people, actively seeking positive health behaviors is just too much work. If thats the case, I hope their happy being worthless piles of human excrement and wasted space.[/quote]
Douche bag, what diet and exercise program do you think will cure my bipolar disorder? Will the V-Diet do it? Or maybe a good 5x5 workout program? You seriously have no clue what you are talking about.
I had a great childhood but still developed depression. Accutane brought it on at age 17, but I had a strong genetic disposition to develop it as well. Both my dad and sister are on disability due to depression.
Some people’s depression are caused by endogenous factors, others from exogenous, and some a bit of both.
[quote]JohnnyNinja wrote:
my childhood was fine and I am close with all members of my immediate family.
anyway I started wellbutrin today. 100mg for 2 weeks then ramped up to 200. I’ll note anything interesting as I go along.[/quote]
Wellbutrin has a much better side effect profile than the SSRI’s. The main side effect people have problems with is anxiety, especially at the beginning. Long term it is supposed to reduce anxiety. I’m currently on 450mg XL per day.
I had partial relief from it. Adding Proviron seemed to help a lot and I’m close to 100% now.
Proviron is also great for combating SSRI induced sexual dysfunction.
The kicker… it is not FDA approved in the U.S./Canada and is a schedule 3 drug. Thank you fucking polititions!
I know people will ask, so don’t bother PMing me for sources of Proviron. I am not aiding people in illegal activity
Does anyone else find it hilarious that all the illegal “dangerous” drugs have less sides and can probably do the job better?[/quote]
Very true. Some of the best drugs are scheduled. I’m not laughing though.
Amphetamines
Benzos (Best for anxiety alongside Nardil)
Testosterone and other androgens
MDMA (Has shown quite successful in PTSD)
Opiates (Works very well for some refractory depressions, Tramadol, Buprenorphene, etc…)
DHEA is a scheduled drug in Canada. How ridiculous is that?
[quote]Dopamineloveaffa wrote:
Very true. Some of the best drugs are scheduled. I’m not laughing though.
Amphetamines
Benzos (Best for anxiety alongside Nardil)
Testosterone and other androgens
MDMA (Has shown quite successful in PTSD)
Opiates (Works very well for some refractory depressions, Tramadol, Buprenorphene, etc…)
DHEA is a scheduled drug in Canada. How ridiculous is that?[/quote]
cough Marijuana cough
But you’re right. The problem is abuse and then overreaction to said abuse.
[quote]belligerent wrote:
rephore wrote:
If you are not depressed and take an anti-depressant, what will happen?
This question relies on the assumption that depression is a meterial disease, which is a dubious notion at best. Depression is a psychiatric label. Physiologically there is no difference between a “depressed” person and a “normal” person. So, if you are not depressed and you take an anti-depressant, the result will be the same- you’ll get coked out on SSRIs and live in a medicated fog with your emotions anesthetized and diminished sensitivity to the stresses in your life. Which most psychiatrists would probably think is a good thing.
[/quote]
Pretty much everything you have said in this thread is not true.
For example, DEPRESSION impairs sleep quality. If anything, antidepressants don’t adequately fix the problem; they certainly don’t cause it.
Furthermore, depression is a physiological disease and contributes to other diseases. It is not a “label.” Depression damages the brain, especially the hippocampus. That would be enough for me to seek drug treatment despite the side effects.
It would be nice if the drugs were much more finely targeted and more effective. They are a little bit like shooting a cannon when you need a pistol.
The study (mentioned in another post) that found that antidepressants are no better than placebos is a misleading piece of garbage. Some people, about a third, fail to respond to antidepressants at all. Others respond spectacularly well, while a third group responds partially. If you average those together, the average response isn’t great, but try telling that to the individual who responded spectacularly well.
[quote]andersons wrote:
belligerent wrote:
rephore wrote:
If you are not depressed and take an anti-depressant, what will happen?
This question relies on the assumption that depression is a meterial disease, which is a dubious notion at best. Depression is a psychiatric label. Physiologically there is no difference between a “depressed” person and a “normal” person. So, if you are not depressed and you take an anti-depressant, the result will be the same- you’ll get coked out on SSRIs and live in a medicated fog with your emotions anesthetized and diminished sensitivity to the stresses in your life. Which most psychiatrists would probably think is a good thing.
Pretty much everything you have said in this thread is not true.
For example, DEPRESSION impairs sleep quality. If anything, antidepressants don’t adequately fix the problem; they certainly don’t cause it.
Furthermore, depression is a physiological disease and contributes to other diseases. It is not a “label.” Depression damages the brain, especially the hippocampus. That would be enough for me to seek drug treatment despite the side effects.
It would be nice if the drugs were much more finely targeted and more effective. They are a little bit like shooting a cannon when you need a pistol.
The study (mentioned in another post) that found that antidepressants are no better than placebos is a misleading piece of garbage. Some people, about a third, fail to respond to antidepressants at all. Others respond spectacularly well, while a third group responds partially. If you average those together, the average response isn’t great, but try telling that to the individual who responded spectacularly well. [/quote]
You’re not taking to account the plethora of studies that that are conducted prior to a drug receiving FDA approval. Some drugs will go through countless number of trials before showing an effect larger than placebo. The FDA only requires on trial demonstrating greater efficacy than placebo, and if you understand how these trials work, and if you understand statistics, you’ll know that all you have to do to get one positive result is conduct enough trials.
[quote]Thomas Gabriel wrote:
Unfortunately, the source of most mood disorders is related to childhood issues. Whenever I meet someone who is on mood stabilizing drugs, I ask them how their home life was growing up. It’s always BAD. Other large traumas in someone’s life can also be responsible.
In my experience and from what I’ve read from countless people online, therapy just isn’t effective. I have a hypothesis that neurotransmitters - like hormones - can be depleted to the point of chronic exhaustion. At this point, the only way to feel normal again is to use pharmaceuticals. That is why therapy doesn’t work. [/quote]
Define therapy.
Also, why do you assume that therapy would not affect neurotransmitters, and that only meds will? A classic study decades ago showed that behavior therapy and antidepressants show the same brain changes pre-to-post therapy/med administration.
You’re not taking to account the plethora of studies that that are conducted prior to a drug receiving FDA approval. Some drugs will go through countless number of trials before showing an effect larger than placebo. The FDA only requires on trial demonstrating greater efficacy than placebo, and if you understand how these trials work, and if you understand statistics, you’ll know that all you have to do to get one positive result is conduct enough trials. [/quote]
I’m not 100% on procedures, but doesn’t it make sense that drug companies go through lots of trials to find success? Its called research. Even if they see improvement in lab animal tests, that doesn’t predict human interactions with the drug. So they go through tests, fine tuning the drug and or dosage until they find what works. Thats how inventors work, you go through a million failures to find one success.
You’re not taking to account the plethora of studies that that are conducted prior to a drug receiving FDA approval. Some drugs will go through countless number of trials before showing an effect larger than placebo. The FDA only requires on trial demonstrating greater efficacy than placebo, and if you understand how these trials work, and if you understand statistics, you’ll know that all you have to do to get one positive result is conduct enough trials.
I’m not 100% on procedures, but doesn’t it make sense that drug companies go through lots of trials to find success? Its called research. Even if they see improvement in lab animal tests, that doesn’t predict human interactions with the drug. So they go through tests, fine tuning the drug and or dosage until they find what works. Thats how inventors work, you go through a million failures to find one success. [/quote]
No, you’re giving way too much credit to the pharmaceutical companies. At least, research should not consist of the shotgun method where you shoot and see what sticks. Also, you’re confusing research & development with clinical trials that are performed to get FDA approval. They aren’t the same thing.
[quote]belligerent wrote:
Those drugs are all fucking prescription crack to me. I really can’t think of anything more unsound across the entire spectrum of current medical practices than administering psychotrophic drugs to artificially inflate patients’ moods. I had a stint with anti-depressants years ago and consider it one of the biggest mistakes of my life. That fucking shit doesn’t just affect your mood, it fundamentally alters your mind and changes the way you think. You literally aren’t sober when you’re on that shit, but the effects are insideous, so you don’t even realize how coked out you are. You “feel” better, so you assume the drug is “working,” when all that it’s really doing is disrupting the completely normal physiological process of serotonin metabolism and suppressing whatever mental processes cause you to feel badly about your shitty circumstanes in life.
Also, you should be aware that anti-depressants may have seriously deleterious effects on your training and physical development. They are endocrine disruptors which may inhibit the production of anabolic hormones, likely due to the disruption of the sleep cyle, and have been proven to stunt growth in children. As a personal anecdote, I noticed that SSRIs impaired my recovery from training and dampened my mental intensity.
I strongly recommend that health conscious people stay away from anti-depressants and psychiatry in general, if they can avoid it. [/quote]
Sometimes people feel depressed for no good reason, especially if they have a genetic mental disorder like bi-polarism. Some people cannot function or have suicidal thoughts when they don’t take these meds. Using your logic, they should just “go natural” and blow their brains out.
I have also seen people who are a million times more functional and happy in general when they take anti-depression drugs. True they have some side effects, but it the side effects of the drug outweigh the awful feelings that they have when they don’t use any drugs, what is the big deal?
