Just an after thought. Do you all think 1275cal is to low? She starting on it today and said it was hard to get enough meals in. Perhaps i would be better to up cal intake to 1400 or so and throw in an extra cardio session or two a week.
anton
Hi Tones,
I think this is a good idea.As i said in my previous reply.I have my daughter on this and she is still losing 1Lb per week and without direct gym work.This week i have started her on triceps work to tone up her arms. The numbers you have put up are close to the ones i calculated for you( but mine were minus 500 kcals).I started my daughter on -250 the 1st week and minus another 250 the following week and am keeping at this until she stalls.
Best of luck and please keep us posted with updates.
Nobby
I’m currently 230 lbs and have been using the T-Dawg diet for almost a month. My daily calorie intake is between 3,500 and 4,000 calories and I am getting leaner each week, heck, I’m even putting on some muscle! My advice would be to keep her on the diet for at least another two months. This diet kicks ass! Last year I did low carb but high protein and hardly any fat. Sure, I got cut more quickly but I lost a hell of a lot of muscle in the process. This way I’m becoming leaner more slowly but without losing the muscle.
Everyone is giving great advice. You mentioned that she lost 4 to 5 pounds over two months. Has she gained any lbm during this time?
It might not hurt to measure her body parts, weekly, and see if she is losing inches. The scale can often not give the whole story, and sometimes measuring bf%, especially at high percentage levels, can be tricky.
Also you might try a short term bulking routine. Sure it is best to lose fat before trying to gain muscle, but I have found that a good bulking diet and exercise routine can boost the metabolism, and moving to diet can boost the results, at least in the short run. Especially if the person has spent years trying to cut calories.
I personally had to lean to stop dieting before I had results myself.
An update:
We started the T-dawg again on Sunday after a few week layoff. I had originally planned to go with around 1250 cal per day. However after trying it it seemed awful low, my girlfriend found it was hard to get enough meals in during the day. Flipping through her food log she saw that she lost the most weight while consuming 1400-1500 cal. So we are going to stick with that and see where it gets her.
Her bodyweight is 135lb, so
135lb x 15=2025 cal - 500 cal = 1525 cal per day. We might have to play around with this number a bit.
I have also started her doing dead lifts, dips, chins, stiff leg deads, etc. I think one of the problems before was that she was doing to much isolation work and not enough compound lifts.
So we will see how the next few weeks go for her. She has trouble with dips and chins, but is doing good with the dead lifts.
anton
Looks good Tones. Try the 1,400 calories for 2 weeks and drop down another 200 after that if necessary.
I meant 1,500 then drop down 200 if she isn’t losing weight.
Ive been doing tdawg2.0 for around 2 months. Ive lost around 25 lbs. and my strngth has been solid. Im a male, 6’1 and weigh around 225. My daily calorie intake is around 1600 + 1 cheat day per week. She may be able to cut calories lower with proper supplements, etc. just my 2cents.
Thanks again for everyone offering their advice.
Its kinda confusing as to know what to do sometimes.
My girlfriend was on the T-dawg for the month of Jan and Feb. The scale said she lost six or seven pounds, however she didnt notice much of a change in composition, muscle tone, etc. During that time she followed the T-dawg formula, BW x 15 - 500, to get her caloric guide lines.
We subsequently took a three week break in march. She was getting her thyroid tested, and was disheartened with all the work and no real noticeble results. Her thyroid came back fine, so that wasnt the cause of the problem.
So here we are starting up again and hoping to get some better results.
Thing is, if i put her at 1400-1500 cal per day this time around we wont be doing much different from last time, so why should i expcet different results? Granted i have introducted her to more compound lifts, so may that will do the trick.
I dont know if i should stick to the same calories, go lower to around 1300, or go higher. Its so hard, cause each person is different. One person’s metablolism may stall out with lower calories, whereas it will cause someone else to lose more weight.
anton
I’m not to fond of the T-Dawg calculations for myself. I started at 210 and dropped got to 205, my progress stalled even after recalculation for the weightloss. I contribute this drop to the carb reduction.
I kept with 2500 kCals for 3 weeks without a weight loss then dropped to 2000 on non-workout days and 2200 for workout days. I’ve started to lose fat again.
So, morale of the story is if you stall, readjust.
Anton, I’ve been following this thread and want to jump in with a few of my thoughts.
One of the things you said is “…however she didn’t notice much of a change in composition, muscle tone, etc.” First off, 7 pounds in 2 months is fabulous. Continue to use the numbers that you were using for January and February.
The goal while dieting, the reason for resistance training, is to MINIMIZE the loss of muscle.
My recommendations are:
- Don’t use soy as a protein source
- Avoid all milk and dairy products
- Avoid fruit in favor of green veggies
What I feel would be an effective approach as far as managing/manipulating carbs would be to go low/no carbs on workout days and take in the full alotment of carbs PWO in the form of Surge and a starchy carb meal. The P+F meals prior combined with her being at a bit of a caloric deficit will keep her burning stored fat. A little cardio (fasted-state or HIIT) would be highly complementary to the above approach.
If I missed it, how many days a week is she working out, for how long, and is she taking full advantage of the “basic” compound, multi-joint exercises? 5x5 or something of like kind is what I’d recommend while dieting.
Tampa-Terry,
Thanks alot for your post.
I was talking with my girlfriend and apparently she only lost four pounds over the two month period of jan and feb.
She started at 134lbs and got to 128 at the lowest, though by the time Janruary was over she was up at 130 for some reason. According to her log her weight loss was most steady when she was getting about 1400 cal per day.
She is lifting three days per week, and also doing about three cardio sessions, mostly on the eliptical machine. I have started her deadlifts, dips, chins, rows, bench, etc. Mostly in the 5x5 range. She can’t squat right now due the fact that her knees start hurting after a while. I think they dont track right or something. Prior to this she was doing more isolation stuff, so i am hoping going heavy on these big compound lifts will help her burn more calories.
She tries to get most of her carbs in on the first half of the day. Her breakfast is usually a bowl of oatmeal with flax oil added. Then the rest of the carbs are usually ingested in a post workout meal/shake.
So for now my plan for her is:
1400 cal/day
100 gr carb workout
70gr non workout
lift hard and make sure to get in enough cardio
If after two weeks there is no chnage i will probably drop the calories some.
anton
Anton, if you’re open to suggestions, I’d recommend that you save that oatmeal for the PWO P+C meal following Surge. And don’t forget to add some protein powder or a chicken breast to the oatmeal PWO. Remember, protein every meal.
Adding flaxseed oil to oatmeal is your classic F+C meal. It’s a body composition no-no. Honestly, except for Surge & that oatmeal + P meal, she could take in P+F meals. And then on days she doesn’t lift, carbs should be ENTIRELY, TOTALLY from green veggie sources ONLY. To get the maximum alotment of carbs, be sure to subtract the fiber (grams) from total carb (grams). That yields what we call net carbs and is the number that is tracked for purposes of the diet.
My last suggestion is that she switch to HIIT for her cardio and do it on her off days. It doesn’t have to be running. I do my HIIT on a StairMaster. Even though it’s short and (not so) sweet, HIIT will give her a bigger bang for the buck.
If you make the changes I recommend, just hang tough for 3 weeks before reducing calories. When you make changes to your diet, you need to give the body a few weeks to settle into the new patterns and routines. And then, don’t drop calories more than 250 calories a day.
Good luck to both of you!!! If you have any other questions, don’t hesitate to ask.
Correction. Make that “and then drop calories NO MORE THAN 250 calories per day for at least a week before reducing calories again.” Sorry, there. (grin)
Tampa-Terry,
Thanks alot for the advice. We were wondering to about oatmeal and flax combo. So we will have to get rid of that.
I’ll also have to work with her about carb sources for the non workout days. Veggies sound ideal, but its gonna be tough. She needs food she can easily eat between classes at college.
anton
Anton, re the food between classes, it’s just a case of preparing her food for the day, say the night before, putting it into little Tupperware container type deals.
On non-lifting days, frozen veggies would do the trick if she’s pressed for time. In fact, she wouldn’t even have to cook them. They’d be thawed out by the time it was time to eat.
You’re moving in the right direction, though. And the two of you were already doing a lot of good/right things. At this point it boils down to subtleties and little details. It’s just a case of tweaking and fine-tuning and HANGING TOUGH. Don’t ever give up! (grin) My motto.
Just to add in on this and the veggie thing. I bring broc. and cauli and such raw on an almost daily basis to eat during and between classes. Along with nuts and I am a sunseed junkie. Other than that salmon tuna chicken, and many types of raw veggies.
Good Luck
1. For mornings you suggested ditching the oatmeal and saving it for post workout. What would you suggest for breakfast? She sometimes eats eggs, but says that they dont fill her up. Granted i think she only eats a few, so if it was upped to five or six eggs plus some bacon would that be ok?
What I’m wanting to do, here, is have your GF eat P+F meals until she does her resistance training. PWO I want her to drink her Surge and then have another P+C meal with starchy carbs (50 grams’ worth). She could have her oatmeal and protein powder then, if she likes.
Your GF’s fat allotment for the day is .4g x LBM. That amount is typically divided up among the P+F meals. But in her case, if she’s hungriest the first meal of the day, she can borrow some fat from one of her other meals. As she settles into her new eating patterns, the hunger should subside. If it doesn’t, let me know. I’ve got a couple of tricks. (grin)
On non-lifting days, I still don’t want her taking in oatmeal as the first meal of the day. I want to see her eating green veggies (only), divided up into 3 or more meals. She could even divide it up into all 6 meals, eating 10g of carbs for 5 meals and 20g of carbs for 1 meal. Fat could be divided up evenly. It wouldn’t be a bad approach. Green veggies are pretty thermogenic.
One caveat. I’d like to see you stay away from corn, carrots, beets, and peas.
2. Is oatmeal all that bad in the morning? From what i have read the best time for carbs is when getting up and PWO. Oatmeal is just convenient cause its easily done in the microwave. Of course, since her primary goal is fat loss perhaps she should just stick to something else in the morning.
You’re right that the morning is one of two ideal times to take in carbs, but your GF has a particularly stubborn metabolism. Since she’s only getting a limited amount, I want to time what she gets to best advantage. She needs those carbs more PWO (for recovery & protein synthesis) than she does in the morning.
3. You reccomended on non-workout days taking all carbs from green veggies. Would getting some of it corn be ok? Its seems tough to get 70 carbs entirely from veggies. If we go the all veggie route it will be tough. She usually take some sort of chicken sandwhich with her to eat between classes. I suggested some reheated steak and veggies instead if we go this route.
No corn! Sorry. That’s just me, not T-Dawg, but I have a number of reasons. She doesn’t have to take in 70g of carbs on non-lifting days, but she would benefit greatly by trying to eat all she possibly can (up to the 70g). And, sorry, but no bread.
I promise you that these are the little tweaks that are going to add up and give her the fat loss she’s looking for. What she was doing before wasn’t working. Try what I’m recommending out for a month. If it doesn’t work, you can always overhaul her diet to suit your purposes. Just consider it a one-month dietary experiment. (grin)
Your list of green veggie carbs is below. They’re not all green, but they’re the ones she’s allowed to draw from.
Alfalfa Sprouts, Artichoke Hearts, Arugula, Asparagus, Bamboo Shoots, Bean Sprouts, Beet Greens, Bok Choy, Broccoli, Brussel Sprouts, Cabbage, Cauliflower, Celery, Celery Root, Chard, Chicory, Chives, Collard Greens, Cucumber, Dandelion Greens, Eggplant, Endive, Escarole, Fennel, Hearts of Palm, Jicama, Kale, Kohlrabi, Leeks, Lettuce, Mache, Mushrooms, Okra, Onion, Parsley, Peppers, Pickles, Pumpkin, Radicchio, Radishes, Rhubarb, Sauerkraut, Scallions Snow Pea Pods Sorrel, Spaghetti Squash, Spinach, String Beans, Summer Squash, Tomatoes, Turnips, Water Chestnuts, Wax Beans, Zucchini.
Terry,
Thanks so much. We are going try and start implementing this on sunday. Its going to take alot more meal planning, so time to go and buy some tupperware.
I’ll keep you posted on how things are going.
anton
Terry,
Is fruit allowed on this plan, perhaps PWO? I know probably not, but i figured i would check.
anton