My A / B Full Body

Bigger Stronger Leaner
1

I’m doing an A / B full body as I like full body but find mon / wed / fri a bit taxing.

Here is my routine. Two rest / cardio days between each workout.

A. ALL 3 sets x 8 reps for slight hypertrophy over strength / power.

Squats
Flat bench press
Millitary press
Bent over b’bell rows
Decline crunches 2 x failliure
Barbell curls

B. Set and rep ranges as above ecept for deads.
Deadlifts 3 x 5
Incline bench press
Side deltoid lateral d’bell raises
chins
calf press
Tricep push downs / or CGBP (not sure which best)

Pretty much covers all the compunds and hits all groups with a little iso WORK for calves, abs, tris and bis. I do the lateral raises for delts as I have narrow clavicles and these help fill them out.

I was trying to do this ABA / BAB - mon / wed / fri but feel it’s too much.
Any advice / changes welcomed, I have done 5 x 5 and do not like it and make better gains in the higher rep range. I kept the deads low rep and low set as was advised to by a friend but could just as easy do them 3 x 8.

I don’t like warm up sets other than ten mins light cardio and stretching and maybe 1 warm up set with the bar / light d’bell and then I get right in and do 3 x 8 on each, one min rest between sets and on to next exercise. Rather than pyramiding, I add wieght when I can and say I complete a full 8 reps for first set with an extra 5kg, I will then do drop sets back to the original weight if needed on the next two sets. All the warm up sets bore me, it’s just the way I am.

I could do 3 x a week if I dropped to 2 sets of 10. Not liking the idea oF light / med / heavy days, TOO COMPLICATED.

As you can see my core principal is KEEPING IT SIMPLE AND BASIC, NOT HAVING TO THINK IT OVER TOO MUCH.

Cheers.

2

Looks ok to me…but who am I?

3

My suggestions:

  1. do military press and lateral raises on the same day, to target shoulders on the same day
  2. do barbell rows and chins on the same day, to target the back on the same day
  3. superset your barbell curls and tricep work; do a set of one, then the other, then repeat

Also, start with a weight you can do 3x8. Work up to 3x12. Then increase the weight.

I don’t think it’s a particularly great routine, but those are the modifications I’d make if I were stuck doing it.

Standard disclaimer: anyone more experienced overrules anything I say.

4

The supersetting arm work makes sense.

5

There are so many full body plans out there, made by extremely intelligent strength coaches, who know so much more than you. Why don’t you just follow one of those?

Starting Strength
Stronglifts
Mad Cow
Bill Starr
Texas Method
5/3/1 full body template

Just do one of those.

6

[quote]Chris87 wrote:
There are so many full body plans out there, made by extremely intelligent strength coaches, who know so much more than you. Why don’t you just follow one of those?

Starting Strength
Stronglifts
Mad Cow
Bill Starr
Texas Method
5/3/1 full body template

Just do one of those.[/quote]

Because he doesn’t really want to. So, given his reluctance (for whatever reason), I tried to offer the best suggestions for what he could do with his provided workout.

7

NOT suggesting you do DC but the split is good: How to Build 50 Pounds of Muscle in 12 Months

8

It doesn’t look terrible, but I’ll warn you now: beginners designing their own programming never goes well.

9

[quote]Obisidian wrote:
It doesn’t look terrible, but I’ll warn you now: beginners designing their own programming never goes well. [/quote]

Exactly.

10

Guys I HAVE DONE 6 months on one of those 5 x 5 before, did madcow.

Honest to god I went from weakling to bench pressing 60kg (Look I know that’s not good but I was only 69kg) Squating 95kg for 20 breathing squats, deadlifting 110kg for 5 x 5 - all work sets and bent over rowing 70kg. All work sets, no warm ups. My OHP was good too for my size.

I get it. It works. It makes you strong. Heck, I FELT STRONG AS A FRIGGING BULL ON IT.

It just does not work for me on hypertrophy, just didn’t. WE ARE NOT ALL THE SAME AND DIFFERENT REP RANGES ETC WORK BETTER FOR SOME OF US THAN OTHERS.

I am short AND narrow shouldered AND I have long arms. Think chimpanzee, lol. Literally a lifter’s curse! My legs grow easy peasy but my upper bod takes a lot of volume to see results.

3 X 8-10 gives me gains. Have been at it a month and friends are noticing already. I can see the difference already.

I took a simple plan such as -

Day1
Squat
Mil Press
chins
Dips

Day2
Bench
Deads
Rows
squats

Which is from one of your prized authors and is meant to be 3 days mon / wed / fri and I put a little more volume in, a little iso work for abs, tris, bis and calves and am giving myself an extra rest day to compensate for that.

I am weekly hitting vertical and horizontal pull for lats. Incline and flat push for chest. Lower body pull and push. Shoulder press and abduction (or is it something else - the lateral raises) and direct tricep and bicep work. The former (tri work) is deffo helping my bench. Traps are getting hit from deads and rows.

I did the squat workout (A) on Wednesday and can still feel it all over my body. It hits everything, lets it recover for around 65 hours basaed on the times I go to the gym and then hits it all again from a different angle. I am after slow lean hypertrophy in conjunction with cardio, not bulking and then cutting, and have a clean mean diet with 2kg choice protien per kg of bodyweight.

If you look CLOSELY at the A and B workouts, you will see they are LITERALLY STARTING STRENGHT / RIPTOE / MADCOW etc as their base (I used those as templates) with iso for calves, tris, bis and abs added. And the delt raises, (heck arnold went into the woods on the sly and did iso work for his calves daily for a year, my side delts need these) with iso added (none of those mewntioned authors are against direct bi, tri, calf and ab work for those with some training already under their belt which I have) and a different set / rep range - which reflects my slow lean gains approach as oppoised to just bulking up and cutting, I am a 36 yr old man, not a teenager needing to build his beginners gains, got those years ago, cheers.

It also has LESS FREQUENCY to make up for the EXTRA VOLUME.

Anyhow, stay with me on this guys. I treid Upper lower split and it was too much hitting everything twice, twice a week. I LIKE FULL BODY. I LIKE 3 x 8 - 10.

I am happy doing it mon / wed / fri or doing it every 65 hours or so as I am currently doing.

I am not trying to argue, but read my post and you WILL SEE at least a rational approach and the fact that I have looked at the starting prgrammes many suggest.

Another thing that puts me off them I WILL BE HONEST is they often have you hitting chest only once a week while you squat every session and hit back every session. My pull lifts are already stronger than my pull lifts, so I’m not in that newbie ‘has fcuck all posterior chain strength’ phase.

So work with me guys. Please. I NEED a full body routine I can do with two rest and cardio days between or can do mon / wed / fri but with less vollume so I don’t feel overtrained, perhaps only 2 sets of 10-12 might be a suggestion. I need other than 5 x 5 as I have never grown on that.

I am not arguing for the sake of it, as I said I hope you will see that I HAVE looked at the programmes you guys suggest and made the changes I have and that they do have rational reasons behind those changes.

Help me out here guys because I’m really into this now (lifting) and want to keep the momentum going. I have been breaking my arse to hit my cals and get my protien in and I am a guy who hates big meals. I am working hard on diet and I work hard at the gym and study the form on exrx.net religiously. I HAVE WORKED OUT BEFORE but never more than 6 months at a time and usually only 3 months and then fallen into shitty lifestyles due to my bipolar 2, which is now for the first time being managed.

Cheers for wading through my novella, if you made it this far! :wink:

11

So to clarify, I want a beginner’s full bod routine with different rep / set range than 5 x 5 and one that is simple and lets me hit one day on, two rest / cardio days and then back on or 3 x a week mon, wed fri. One that i can do for 3 - 6 months and then change up to an intermediate upper / lower split or a push / pull / legs split etc.

Experience has shown me I need direct tri, bi, calf and ab work, even if just minimal and I grow more on 3 x 8-10 than 5 x 5 and 4 x 6.

I could take and upper / lower split and do it mon / wed / fri, but I think full bod beginner is still best for me right now.

Muscle.net has this beginner’s full bod 3 x a week and you can see it is VERY SIMMILAR to mine but I just added Another DAY where compounds hitting from vertical instead of all horizontal and an extra rest day due to addition of full deadlifts.

All 3 x 10

EXERCISES

SQUATS

STIFF LEG DEADLIFTS

BENCH PRESS

BENT OVER ROWS

MILITARY PRESS

CLOSS GRIP BENCH PRESS

BARBELL CURL

STANDING CALF

FROM ANOTHER WELL KNOW FORUM AND RESPECTED POSTER - he reccomends 3-5 sets - 6-15 reps for hyper trophy.

Monday:
Squats
Incline Bench Press
OH Press
Bent Over BB or DB Row
Weighted Pullups or Pulldowns

Wednesday:
Deadlift
Flat Bench or Weighted Dips
Arnolds
Seated One Arm Rows
Weighted Pullups or Pulldowns

Friday:
Squats
Incline Bench Press
Hang Clean & Press
Bent Over BB or DB Rows
Weighted Pullups or Pulldowns

JUST TO SHOW YOU GUYS I AM RESEARCHING AND NOT PULLING THESE OUT OF MY BUNG HOLE :wink:

12

Another from a well know site -

Workout A

Squats
3 sets of 8-10 reps.
2 minutes rest between sets.
Bench Press
3 sets of 8-10 reps.
2 minutes rest between sets.
Rows
3 sets of 8-10 reps.
2 minutes rest between sets.
Triceps Press Downs
1 set of 10-12 reps.
Calf Raises
1-2 sets of 10-12 reps.
1 minute rest between sets.
Workout B

Deadlifts
3 sets of 8-10 reps.
2 minutes rest between sets.
Pull-Ups (or Lat Pull-Downs)
3 sets of 8-10 reps.
2 minutes rest between sets.
Overhead Shoulder Press
3 sets of 8-10 reps.
2 minutes rest between sets.
Biceps Curls
1 set of 10-12 reps.
Abs
1-2 sets of 10-12 reps.
1 minute rest between sets.

Meant to be done mon / wed / fri. I added some extra exercises and gave my self and extra rest day between sessions. I also want direct shoulder and chest work each session. The whole 'guns take care of emselves and shoulders will grow from rows and other compounds - JUST DOESN’T WORK FOR ME.

Maybe with the higher rep ranges here it would work, so I could consider this one. off to do cardio.

Stick with me guys and help me choose a GOOD BEGIINER’S FULL BOD WORKOUT WITH 3 X 3-10 REP RANGES.

13

The reason you’re probably not putting on a lot of mass with that other program is because you’ve only been doing it for 6 months. It takes time to put on lots of mass and it doesn’t matter what kind of program you come up with or how much you analyze it, it’s going to take more time. If you really want to put on mass, keep doing that program that is working for you and focus more on your nutrition.

Since your goal is to gain muscle mass, what is your current nutrition like? And don’t tell us that you are eating lots or the right stuff, because that’s what every skinny guy says. There is a reason why they are still skinny.

14

@GSD

HEIGHT FIVE FOOT SEVEN.

WEIGHT - 73 KG NOW.

PROTIEN PER DAY - 150G

TOTAL CALS PER DAY 2700

DIET IS CLEAN, NOT POSTING EACH MEAL IN DETAIL BUT IT’S 4 MEALS OF AROUND 20G PROTIEN, A FIST SIZED PORTION OF CLEAN CARBS AND 3 VEG. THE REST OF THE PROTIEN COMES FROM WHEY, GOLD STANDARD.

DID 6 MONTHS 5 X 5 MADCOW AND GREW STRONG BUT PUT ON NOT MUCH MASS. 3 YRS BACK. LOTS OF PEOPLE HAVE THE SAME COMPLAINT - STRENGTH BUT NOT MUCH GROWTH.

JUST STARTED 3 X 8 - 10 OF THEW A /B SPLIT I POSTED AND SEE BETTRER GAINS IN A MONTH THAN IN 6 MONTHS OF MADCOW 5 X 5.

***** OH BTW, THE TWO TRAINERS AT MY GYM, ONE OF WHOM COMPETES IN BODYBUILDING AND HAS TROPHIES SAID MY ROUTINE WAS FINE, BUT HE’D WANT ANOTHER SHOULDER COMPOUND RATHER THAN THE DELT RAISES. PERHAPS DIPS INSTEAD OF INCLINE PRESS ON B DAY.

GET THIS - HE RECCOMENDED 6 SETS OF 8 ALL EXERCISES!!! TWO DAYS OFF FRO CARDIO; ONE RUNNING, ONE SWIMMING. THEN WORKOUT AGAIN. DOES HE WANT TO KILL ME! HE INSISTS ON THE SWIMMING.

AND YOU GUYS ARE SAYING 5 X 5! XX.COM SAYS 3 X 8-12. THIS GUY HAS ONE OF THE MOST AWESOME BODS I’VE EVER SEEN AND SAY 6 X 8! MY MATE WHO IS MASSIVE ALSO SAYS 3 X 8 FOR ALL.

TALK ABOUT FCUKING CONFUSING!

15

In the end it all comes down to what works for YOU, to meet YOUR goals. If this is actually working for you, great. If you want even better results than you’re getting, then some things might benefit from some change. But if this works, keep doing it. The only person who really matters is you here. You really don’t need our approval.

As far as sets/reps, for one of Vince Gironda’s programs, he recommended 3x8 for the first month, 6x6 for the second month, moving to 8x8 in the subsequent months. Other programs of his called for 10x10. There’s really a lot of ways to do things; there are good ways and there are better ways, but congrats on doing something, and congrats on your success so far.

16

This is the third thread you’ve started about a routine since you joined T-Nation less than 3 weeks ago. In each thread you’ve posted massive amounts of info about your “new”, “revised” or “better” routine, and you complain that you’re “confused”.

Why don’t you just lift and stop writing about some routines that you have to tweak to make it digestable?

Nobody with more than 3-4 years of lifting under their belt is going to approve your plan anymore, as the more experienced people here have already told you more than once what to do.

Could it be that you’re just allergic to taking sound advice?

17

  1. Cuso you’ve selectively missed out a lot of what I’ve written in this thread and are thusly selectively ignored.

  2. For the rest of ya- old school two day split - simmilar to mine but different. It’s from Stuart McRobert’s Brawn series. If it gets the okay I’ll start it and stick to it for 3-6 months min before attempting an upper / lower split

The 2 Day a Week Minimalist Power and Bulking Routine:
Workout A ? Mondays

Squat 3 x 5-15
***Dumbbell split squat (aka ?Bulgarian squats?) or single leg press or lunge variant 3 x 10
Bench press 3 x 5
Close Grip Bench Press 3 x 5
Row (or row variation) 3 x 5
*Static grip 2-3 x 60-90 seconds
Crunches 3 x 10-20

Workout B ? Thursdays

**Sidebends 3 x 10
Deadlift 3 x 5
Military press 3 x 5
Pullups/Chinups (weighted, if possible) or Power Cleans 3Ã??5-10
Barbell curl 3 x 5
Dips (weighted, if possible) 3 x 5
Calf raises 3 x 10-20

  1. NOW -

*** seems a bit much on top of squats as I go Arse 2 Grass. What about 1 x 12 of each leg ext and ham curl or 2 x 12 dble leg press?

**I ain’t doing no ‘side bends.’ Sounds gay, if they are what I think they are, seen people doing sit ups on their sides on a decline bench. If they are the dumbell variation, I don’t like those either, never been able to feel em do jack at any weight. So I’ll do decline side to side crunches instead like a boxer. They work and they look and feel cool, so there. Hey we all have our quirks.

  • Static grip = No, not doing it so will do shoulder Iso instead, most likely side raises as I like the look they give.

  1. This is from Stuart McRobert’s Brawn series. So come on guys…

  2. ONE LAST THING - WOULD IT REALLY RUIN IT IF I DO 3 X 8 INSTEAD OF 3 X 5? I respond well to high reps, some of us do, some don’t. Maybe I could do one range for a month and then another for a month?

I have long bloody arms, so need the extra few reps imo. My sodding calves grow just by looking at the calf press machine,and thighs respond well to squats and deads too - but upper body is stubborn as all hell and is skinnier than my lower body. Every woman I’ve been with says I have good legs. Used to do tons of hill and step sprints and bike riding.

  1. Stay with me and help me get started. My next session is tommorow eve. Is this an okay routine along with one weekly swimming 40 mins and one running 45 mins on off days with good diet and enough protien - 2g per kg body mass? My goal is simply - cardio to stay fit (and it’s fun) and twice weekly heavy weights workout to build some lean muscle / get some shape.

  2. I’m a skinny fcuk and need about two days rest between weights workouts IMHO rather than mon / wed / fri.

Stuart McRobert’s Brawn series - has to have enough kudos for T-Nation peeps naw?

18

Addendum to above post ^^

Ok just spoke to a co-worker who USED to be ripped and big, now just does all round fitness.

Told him ‘my calves and legs grow easy but my upper body just doesn’t.’

He said change from 3 x 8 to using heavier wieghts at around 3 / 4 sets of 5 - 8 reps.

He said big body parts do 4 x 5 (squat, deads, bench, rows)

And smaller body parts (curls, mill press, dips etc 4 x 8)

So I will do it, as I trust the guy and have seen his past results. I will do the two day routine from ‘Brawn’ in the above post and I’ll stick to the suggested rep and set ranges my friend said. I will still change the exercises I mentioned though.

NB - a thought. When I originally did 6 months at Madcow 5 x 5 - it was a push / pull / legs split. I thought I wasn’t a begginer as had trained before so jumped into a split instead of doing full body 5 x 5 - maybe that is part of why I made no gains, possibly, though I was doing decent lifts by the end of it.

OKAY - ABOVE POST ROUTINE twice a week at 4 x 5 - 8 - Go for it and then be able to leave you poor sods with better things do do than read my annoying shite - or do starting strength 3 x a week?

Whichever gets the most votes I will do it and follow it literally to the T for 6 months.

Bear in mind, I likes doing cardio on off days and at 172 cm and 73kg - I need more rest than you naturally big bastards and sometimes don’t sleep well due to hypomania for which I take meds (seroquel and clonazepam.)

Cheers for those with the patience to still be with me… Start tommorow…

19

Which one guys? I’ll let you choose as I obv cannot. I will stick to it for 6 motnhs or however long is reccomended and follow it pat.

I think the twice weekly better only as I don’t have amazing recovery.

20

Screw it I’m doing the Steve Reeve’s classic. worked for him it can work for me. Only change will be I’ll make it A / B by doing rows in A and chins in B. BHP (behind head press)- no, not like that so will do mill press in A and Laterals in B. Dips 3 x a week - hells naw. Dips in A and CGBP in B.

It’s decided. See you guys in 6 months.

Squat…3x8-12
BB/DB row…3x8-12…DL 3x5* see note
BHP…3x8-12
Bench…3x8-12
BB/DB curl…3x8-12
Dips…5x10@BW Try for sets of 10.
BB calf raise 3x15-20
AB work

Perform M-W-F

On Friday drop BB row and do 3x5 deadlifts Deadlifts are to be done Reg park style. 2 warmup/ 1 heavy work set.