Whoops wrong picture 
Heres the anti muscle police chief. Looks like he works out.
Are we ignoring that western culture already relates muscles with less intelligence?
What seems to be at play here is latest cultural assumption that muscular size is assumed to be impossible without illegal aid. If it was okay for guys to be huge then why would anyone care. I will worry when this becomes a problem in Texas, where men are men (and so are the women).
[quote]goldengloves wrote:
[quote]gregron wrote:
[quote]goldengloves wrote:
[quote]gregron wrote:
[quote]goldengloves wrote:
[quote]gregron wrote:
[quote]goldengloves wrote:
People care very little for those with the physique of a bodybuilder, why would they be up in arms over them being profiled when racial profiling receives very little attention?
[/quote]
What are you talking about? Are you even from America? You just pulled “people care very little for those with the physique of a bodybuilder” comment right out of your ass.
You completely skipped over my question as to why one basis of profiling is worse than the other?[/quote]
Alright, show me the sympathy from the average American on this issue. I bet most haven’t even heard of this and if they’ve they don’t care. Steroids are so demonized in this country it’s comical, I doubt many would care if they started muscle profiling anyway.
People make the choice to compete as a professional bodybuilder, that’s who’s being profiled in this case. You don’t make a choice to belong to an ethnic group.[/quote]
so its ok to profile someone as long as what you’re profiling them for you deem to be their choice?
(i still dont think you’re from the US)[/quote]
Those professional bodybuilders are most likely using AAS aren’t they? I’m not saying I support “muscle profiling”, just that it’s ridiculous to think there would be an outrage over it in America. There’s not even an outrage over racial profiling in America and it’s far more prevalent than “muscle profiling”. Racial profiling in America maybe gets a 5 minute discussion on a news network every so often.
What would make you think I’m not from the US? [/quote]
Again you’re avoiding my original question based on your first post. It’s ok to profile people in certain cases? Profiling someone based ok their race or sexual orientation is worse than profiling someone based on their size?[/quote]
I wasn’t speaking of profiling on their size, it’d be profiling them by their occupation. And when your occupation involves using such substances it’s not quite profiling now is it? Regardless, taking the original debate of profiling between race and occupation[bodybuilder], I’d say racial profiling is infinitely more despicable. Even if it were profiling them on their size racial profiling would still be much worse, racial profiling has lead to some serious injuries and is still prevalent yet receives very little attention in America. Muscle profiling has lead to what, a urinalysis?
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]goldengloves wrote:
[quote]Kalle wrote:
I sadly know a whole lot of people who I think would be FOR “muscle profiling” It is just crazy.
This article was posted in the Tony Freeman thread and there is an actual guideline to how to spot steroid users. Which includes “large trapezius muscles” which is just ridiculous. [/quote]
So it’s went beyond just profiling bodybuilders? That’s really weird then. I’m wondering what the motivation for it’s, if any.[/quote]
Yes, they are arresting people just because they look like they’ve seen a gym before. One guy was arrested at a night club by another lady cop and taken in for testing only to come up clear. They are NOT just going after IFBB pros. They are being told that large traps mean you use steroids illegally so anyone with big traps who looks like they lift could be arrested.
Anyone supporting that at all even by ignoring arrests of pro bodybuilders seems to be missing a few screws. If you are ok with it happening to them, but not ok with it happening to people who look like you, then you seem to be ignorant of the snowball effect these types of actions can have…even here.[/quote]
It really makes me wonder why Sweden has taken such a hardline stance on this. I guess there are droves of men with large traps plundering supermarkets and making off with all the protein.
[/quote]
Now you’re changing your argument to profiling someone based pm their job when that wasn’t what you said originally at all? So if someone is an athlete and their sport requires them to lift weights it’s ok to profile them? Let’s just arrest every NFl player or half of professional rugby players.
Stop trying to change your stance and twist it around. Profiling is wrong if it’s based on skin color, sexual orientation, gender or size(or occupation ad you seem to have changed your stance to now)
Where are you really from?
[quote]Tex Ag wrote:
Are we ignoring that western culture already relates muscles with less intelligence?
What seems to be at play here is latest cultural assumption that muscular size is assumed to be impossible without illegal aid. If it was okay for guys to be huge then why would anyone care. I will worry when this becomes a problem in Texas, where men are men (and so are the women).[/quote]
Mighty big difference between assuming someone is dumb based on size alone (which is an attitude that I don’t think is even rampant like it used to be) and using someone’s size to trample over their rights, raid their house and arrest them (potentially ruining reputations in the process) with no proof of a crime committed other than possessing big biceps.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]Tex Ag wrote:
Are we ignoring that western culture already relates muscles with less intelligence?
What seems to be at play here is latest cultural assumption that muscular size is assumed to be impossible without illegal aid. If it was okay for guys to be huge then why would anyone care. I will worry when this becomes a problem in Texas, where men are men (and so are the women).[/quote]
Mighty big difference between assuming someone is dumb based on size alone (which is an attitude that I don’t think is even rampant like it used to be) and using someone’s size to trample over their rights, raid their house and arrest them (potentially ruining reputations in the process) with no proof of a crime committed other than possessing big biceps.
[/quote]
If a high school student is held to a lower standard, potentially denying him the education he needs to succeed, because he is a big football player, then the impact might be as great or greater but less obvious. This is a recognized issue in education.
[quote]Tex Ag wrote:
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]Tex Ag wrote:
Are we ignoring that western culture already relates muscles with less intelligence?
What seems to be at play here is latest cultural assumption that muscular size is assumed to be impossible without illegal aid. If it was okay for guys to be huge then why would anyone care. I will worry when this becomes a problem in Texas, where men are men (and so are the women).[/quote]
Mighty big difference between assuming someone is dumb based on size alone (which is an attitude that I don’t think is even rampant like it used to be) and using someone’s size to trample over their rights, raid their house and arrest them (potentially ruining reputations in the process) with no proof of a crime committed other than possessing big biceps.
[/quote]
If a high school student is held to a lower standard, potentially denying him the education he needs to succeed, because he is a big football player, then the impact might be as great or greater but less obvious. This is a recognized issue in education.[/quote]
If I had a kid who was doing what he needed to in school but had teachers holding him back just because he lifts, I doubt those teachers would be working there for long. I know that bias exist in the teaching profession…very often against teachers, but are you saying this is a normal occurrence for muscular high school kids to be denied an education?
I do see this as a very large issue long before it ever hits Texas. If people are now being profiled based on size alone, then expect the same crap going on in Sweden over here…guys being arrested at night clubs because some skinny cop got intimidated.
I am not sure that will happen seeing as we do have quite a number of fucking huge cops in this state, but the fact that it happens at all in this country is not something the rest of us should take lightly.
That is what got to me about the Swedish guys on the board…they seemed to actually agree with it as if you can look at all people and tell who using steroids illegally. You can’t and the people who think you can are likely nowhere near even average for a weekend warrior…which makes me wonder why they are on this site.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]Tex Ag wrote:
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]Tex Ag wrote:
Are we ignoring that western culture already relates muscles with less intelligence?
What seems to be at play here is latest cultural assumption that muscular size is assumed to be impossible without illegal aid. If it was okay for guys to be huge then why would anyone care. I will worry when this becomes a problem in Texas, where men are men (and so are the women).[/quote]
Mighty big difference between assuming someone is dumb based on size alone (which is an attitude that I don’t think is even rampant like it used to be) and using someone’s size to trample over their rights, raid their house and arrest them (potentially ruining reputations in the process) with no proof of a crime committed other than possessing big biceps.
[/quote]
If a high school student is held to a lower standard, potentially denying him the education he needs to succeed, because he is a big football player, then the impact might be as great or greater but less obvious. This is a recognized issue in education.[/quote]
If I had a kid who was doing what he needed to in school but had teachers holding him back just because he lifts, I doubt those teachers would be working there for long. I know that bias exist in the teaching profession…very often against teachers, but are you saying this is a normal occurrence for muscular high school kids to be denied an education?
I do see this as a very large issue long before it ever hits Texas. If people are now being profiled based on size alone, then expect the same crap going on in Sweden over here…guys being arrested at night clubs because some skinny cop got intimidated.
I am not sure that will happen seeing as we do have quite a number of fucking huge cops in this state, but the fact that it happens at all in this country is not something the rest of us should take lightly.
That is what got to me about the Swedish guys on the board…they seemed to actually agree with it as if you can look at all people and tell who using steroids illegally. You can’t and the people who think you can are likely nowhere near even average for a weekend warrior…which makes me wonder why they are on this site.[/quote]
The student issue is frame in more of the “football (or basketball) is all the kid needs to get out of here/be a success so lets not hold him back or interfere with practice/ability to play” type reasoning. I guarantee this has happened in Texas a few times.
As far as profiling based on appearance, I think it has precedence in other non-criminal ways such as hiring. Who wants to hire the tattoo-pierced person, the fat-ass, the goofy looking kid, etc. This has been proven time and again that better looking candidates tend to get hired more often. But other than racial profiling, I do not see a similar scenario when it comes to police action.
I think in the states as long as steroids are associated with athletes and not just bodybuilders, size based arrests for steroids will not become a common problem. My concern at present is about the cultural negativity towards muscular size although seeing that evolve into criminalizing muscularity is a scary prospect. Without jumping too much into politics this is about what an individual is able to do with his/her own body.
I do not care who uses steroids especially since most of the women I know are on some kind of steroid currently.
[quote]Tex Ag wrote:
I think in the states as long as steroids are associated with athletes and not just bodybuilders, size based arrests for steroids will not become a common problem. My concern at present is about the cultural negativity towards muscular size although seeing that evolve into criminalizing muscularity is a scary prospect. Without jumping too much into politics this is about what an individual is able to do with his/her own body.
I do not care who uses steroids especially since most of the women I know are on some kind of steroid currently.[/quote]
The thing is, most of the people using steroids are NOT big. The general public has seen this themselves with all of the athletes busted. It isn’t like all of them were looking like IFBB pros. Most looked completely NOT jacked. Therefore, how can anyone, especially the Swiss, think size alone indicates use? So, their reasoning is, let’s let the majority using it illegally run free because they aren’t huge but lets bust everyone with muscles whether they are innocent or not.
That’s fucking retarded.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
I do see this as a very large issue long before it ever hits Texas. If people are now being profiled based on size alone, then expect the same crap going on in Sweden over here…guys being arrested at night clubs because some skinny cop got intimidated.
I am not sure that will happen seeing as we do have quite a number of fucking huge cops in this state, but the fact that it happens at all in this country is not something the rest of us should take lightly.
That is what got to me about the Swedish guys on the board…they seemed to actually agree with it as if you can look at all people and tell who using steroids illegally. You can’t and the people who think you can are likely nowhere near even average for a weekend warrior…which makes me wonder why they are on this site.[/quote]
It’s been going on in America for years. BTW, why haven’t you spoken up against it? If I remember correctly, you think that not doing so means that you accept it.
No one said that, you made that part up along with some other things. If cops suspect a crime over here, they investigate it. That means that BEFORE THEY HAVE PROOF, they LOOK FOR PROOF where there MIGHT BE PROOF to FIND PROOF. There aren’t that many natties as big, ripped and dry as Toney (to dispute this, give me one example, I’d be very glad if you did), or that many women with Irene Andersen’s physique. There MIGHT be something wrong, so without knowing if a crime has been committed they look to see whether or not a crime has been committed. You make it sound like you can only be questioned in America if the cops already have proof that you did it, which I can’t dispute but strongly doubt, in which case half of your posts in these threads are bullshit.
And WHY does every fucking discussion on this board end up with you calling people small? Yes, I’m at the “works out” stage per the “2010 KingBeef scale of hyoogeness”, but it doesn’t make you right. Save it for the threads where people claim to be big or know how to get big. It doesn’t fit in a discussion about law. “I object, your honor, he’s small!”
And again: One Swedish cop bothered a bodybuilder who hadn’t done anything wrong in Sweden.
One country invaded Iraq after finding out that they didn’t have WMDs.
People make mistakes. Some make bigger mistakes. Some like to argue forever about the smaller mistakes. I think I’ll withdraw from this discussion for now. Unless you post something that you haven’t already written a few times. The undisputably natural woman this thread is about says hi.
[quote]kakno wrote:
[quote]Professor X wrote:
I do see this as a very large issue long before it ever hits Texas. If people are now being profiled based on size alone, then expect the same crap going on in Sweden over here…guys being arrested at night clubs because some skinny cop got intimidated.
I am not sure that will happen seeing as we do have quite a number of fucking huge cops in this state, but the fact that it happens at all in this country is not something the rest of us should take lightly.
That is what got to me about the Swedish guys on the board…they seemed to actually agree with it as if you can look at all people and tell who using steroids illegally. You can’t and the people who think you can are likely nowhere near even average for a weekend warrior…which makes me wonder why they are on this site.[/quote]
It’s been going on in America for years. BTW, why haven’t you spoken up against it? If I remember correctly, you think that not doing so means that you accept it.
No one said that, you made that part up along with some other things. If cops suspect a crime over here, they investigate it. That means that BEFORE THEY HAVE PROOF, they LOOK FOR PROOF where there MIGHT BE PROOF to FIND PROOF. There aren’t that many natties as big, ripped and dry as Toney (to dispute this, give me one example, I’d be very glad if you did),[/quote]
Are you missing info on purpose? One of the guys they arrested wasn’t big at all. He looked like someone who just started lifting. Why focus on Toney when they arrested a guy like that as well for the same fucking reason? They are OBVIOUSLY not just going after IFBB pros. That makes all else you wrote null and void. Unless you are ok with them harassing YOU, acting like harassing Toney is ok is dumb.
[quote]
or that many women with Irene Andersen’s physique. There MIGHT be something wrong, so without knowing if a crime has been committed they look to see whether or not a crime has been committed. You make it sound like you can only be questioned in America if the cops already have proof that you did it, which I can’t dispute but strongly doubt, in which case half of your posts in these threads are bullshit.[/quote]
They usually don’t ARREST YOU without any proof because they can’t hold you in custody but for a limited time without pressing charges. They also can’t FORCE a piss test with no proof that any crime was committed to my knowledge. If you were arrested, they would have to let you go with no proof of any wrong doing.
[quote]
And WHY does every fucking discussion on this board end up with you calling people small? Yes, I’m at the “works out” stage per the “2010 KingBeef scale of hyoogeness”, but it doesn’t make you right. Save it for the threads where people claim to be big or know how to get big. It doesn’t fit in a discussion about law. “I object, your honor, he’s small!”[/quote]
I said that because you seem to be just fine with the idea of profiling the woman you posted a picture of…which is only what someone would do if they were not at risk of being seen as “big” themselves.
I think that is pretty fucking straight forward.
[quote]
And again: One Swedish cop bothered a bodybuilder who hadn’t done anything wrong in Sweden.
One country invaded Iraq after finding out that they didn’t have WMDs. [/quote]
Two swedish cops that I know of arrested two different people that I know of (maybe three) who had not committed a crime and forced both to take a piss test. Yes, I see that as a problem.
The actions of two cops, though misguided, are not the largest atrocities being permeated my humans. One look at Texas’s track record for capital punishment demonstrates how one wrongly accused can go really bad.
edit: I wrote this to downplay PX’s point but I think it strengthened it. I’ll be damned.
[quote]Tex Ag wrote:
The actions of two cops, though misguided, are not the largest atrocities being permeated my humans. One look at Texas’s track record for capital punishment demonstrates how one wrongly accused can go really bad.
edit: I wrote this to downplay PX’s point but I think it strengthened it. I’ll be damned.[/quote]
LOL…and that is the point. There are some pretty big dudes who are not using anything…and an arrest alone can fuck up a reputation, a business, and a job app (if it is public enough). Anyone taking it lightly as if it is ok because its just “them” seems to be missing the bigger picture.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Are you missing info on purpose? One of the guys they arrested wasn’t big at all. He looked like someone who just started lifting. Why focus on Toney when they arrested a guy like that as well for the same fucking reason?
[/quote]
are you referring to the guy who was arrested in the nightclub for having big traps? (then in the article it said the police report said he had way too muscled biceps?) lol
[quote]gregron wrote:
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Are you missing info on purpose? One of the guys they arrested wasn’t big at all. He looked like someone who just started lifting. Why focus on Toney when they arrested a guy like that as well for the same fucking reason?
[/quote]
are you referring to the guy who was arrested in the nightclub for having big traps? (then in the article it said the police report said he had way too muscled biceps?) lol[/quote]
Yep…which is why when they post pics of some woman bodybuilder as if they are ONLY going after the extremely developed, they show how little they even follow this shit.
Anyone for Toney Freeman being harassed but not for themselves being harassed has some screws loose.
[quote]gregron wrote:
^^This guy? (Picture for reference from my previous post)[/quote]
See…anyone that size or bigger can be arrested…and they are fine with that…which obviously means they can’t be very developed if they see him as some extreme above them.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]gregron wrote:
^^This guy? (Picture for reference from my previous post)[/quote]
See…anyone that size or bigger can be arrested…and they are fine with that…which obviously means they can’t be very developed if they see him as some extreme above them.[/quote]
the article did say that he was 6’5 and 275lbs… doesnt look like much in the picture but 6’5 275lbs is pretty big in person (especially to some tiny woman cop)
But yeah… he doesnt look huge muscularly… Maybe that cop lady thought steroids make 5’10 180lb guys turn into 6’5" 275lb guys lol
(that would be pretty sweet if they did though… I know I’d take some if that was the case)
[quote]gregron wrote:
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]gregron wrote:
^^This guy? (Picture for reference from my previous post)[/quote]
See…anyone that size or bigger can be arrested…and they are fine with that…which obviously means they can’t be very developed if they see him as some extreme above them.[/quote]
the article did say that he was 6’5 and 275lbs… doesnt look like much in the picture but 6’5 275lbs is pretty big in person (especially to some tiny woman cop)
But yeah… he doesnt look huge muscularly… Maybe that cop lady thought steroids make 5’10 180lb guys turn into 6’5" 275lb guys lol
(that would be pretty sweet if they did though… I know I’d take some if that was the case)[/quote]
Here’s the thing though…I’m 5’10 which is a 7 inch difference in height. If you take away 5-10lbs for every inch, that would put him much closer to where I was at only 205-210lbs. That means that someone built like KingBeef would be going to jail in that country in the same situation.
That’s fucking stupid.
Our UK Cell should take a trip together and walk in a big buffed group to see who gets arrested!
Would be better than a lunk alarm! Are you big enough to get arrested in Sweden?