RJ is right, the article was touchy feely bullshit.
It is easy to invent a nonexistent guy eating a chimichanga and put phony words in his mouth.
Much easier to blame others for not caring enough than it is to face the truth of the situation.
[quote]Zap Branigan wrote:
RJ is right, the article was touchy feely bullshit.
It is easy to invent a nonexistent guy eating a chimichanga and put phony words in his mouth.
Much easier to blame others for not caring enough than it is to face the truth of the situation.
[/quote]
Naah, it’s easier to take an existent black looter and paint every black with the same brush.
But tell us, what is the truth of the situation?
[quote]rainjack wrote:
I’ve been villified my entire adult life because of my color and/or sex. That’s right. I’m a WASP male. When I smell the bullshit on someone’s shoe - and you know the smell I’m talking about. The stench of racism. No one has to come out and use the N word for you to be able smell it when it applies to you, right? You’r enot the only one in town with that particular sense.
I smell it all over this guy’s article. Pardon me for not being one that is ashamed of his race.
Whether you want to be honest enough to admit it, or not - this entire thing is way more about race than it has ever been about a hurricane or a flood.
[/quote]
You’re not villified over you color and/or sex. Other male whites haven’t been villified. You’re villified because you’re you.
[quote]Wreckless wrote:
hedo wrote:
Wreckless wrote:
rainjack wrote:
That’s an out and out lie. There were many blacks that owned their own slaves right here in the U.S.
You blame the white-man for everything that is wrong with the black man is getting more than a little played.
That’s a lie. There were not many blacks that owned slaves. There were some. Not many.
Who do you think sold the black slaves to the white man and to the Arabs?
Blacks were the operators of step one of the slave trade. Not PC but true.
Plenty of blame to go around.
That’s not the point. He claimed many blacks owned slaves and he’s wrong about that.
Besides, if you want to start about Africans selling other Africans in slavery, you should also point out that these slave wars were activily encouraged by Europeans and Americans.[/quote]
Can’t sell something you don’t own right?
By the way those Americans and Europeans ended the slave trade via blockade…much to the dismay of the African merchants who still had plenty of slaves to sell to the Arabs who continued buying them until the early 20th. century. Since I want to talk about African involvement as you say.
[quote]Wreckless wrote:
ZEB wrote:
slimjim wrote:
What the hell is an ABBer? I keep seeing you throw that out there but have no idea what it is…
That would be you: “Anybody But Bush.”
I hope this clears things up 
That description would fit me. ABB, yeah, that’s me.
I don’t think he’s evil though. I think he’s just so stupid that he’s dangerous. It’s like letting the six year old drive the family car.
I’ll tell you something I discovered a couple of years ago. There are not many evil people in the world. Some, but not many.
Most damage is done by stupid people. Stupid people painting themselves into a corner and doing evil deeds to shift the blame. Or should I say, blame Plame?
You would have to be VERY VERY evil to be able to do more damage than a VERY VERY stupid person.
A Bush is VERY, VERY, VERY stupid.
Let me give you one example. One of his unqualified cronies was put in charge of Fema and screwed up.
Bush told people he would take responsibility for that. I doubted it al along.
What does this stupid mf do the next week, he nominates another unqualified crony of his to the supreme court.
He doesn’t consider this evil. He doens’t have a master plan. He doesn’t think this is cronyism. This is just his stupid, silly way.
The moron fucks up every chance he gets.
ABB. You’re damn right. All the way man.[/quote]
Stupid? Makes me wonder why he had a higher IQ in his National Guard entry test than John Kerry did on his military entrance IQ exam.
Does taht make Kerry more stupid than Bush?
[quote]Wreckless wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:
RJ is right, the article was touchy feely bullshit.
It is easy to invent a nonexistent guy eating a chimichanga and put phony words in his mouth.
Much easier to blame others for not caring enough than it is to face the truth of the situation.
Naah, it’s easier to take an existent black looter and paint every black with the same brush.
But tell us, what is the truth of the situation?[/quote]
Who the hell thinks all black people are like the scum bag looters?
In case you didn’t notice there were white looters too.
You seem to see many issues as a matter of race. It is too bad.
[quote]Who the hell thinks all black people are like the scum bag looters?
In case you didn’t notice there were white looters too.
You seem to see many issues as a matter of race. It is too bad.[/quote]
So Zap, you didn’t notice people right here on these forums deriding the people of New Orleans as lazy undeserving scum?
The article, if you could read, was about the fact that some people actually do have that attitude, as we’ve seen right here in our own discussions.
You don’t remember the talk of shooting and killing looters and so on that took place for weeks? You don’t remember the comments about the police? You don’t remember people acting like the ones described in the article at all?
My, it must be nice to be able to forget anything you don’t like so easily…
So, again, the article was simply upset at the mindset of some people… people who don’t actually see things independent of race as you seem to be trying to do by the tone of your comment.
What the hell is wrong with that?
–
On another note, for those that don’t think history is important, with respect to the situation in America today between blacks and whites, what the fuck are we talking about Africa for?
If you want to go that far back, you should be able to go back to segregation, racism and so on to look at problems that have existed right here at home.
[quote]Zap Branigan wrote:
Wreckless wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:
RJ is right, the article was touchy feely bullshit.
It is easy to invent a nonexistent guy eating a chimichanga and put phony words in his mouth.
Much easier to blame others for not caring enough than it is to face the truth of the situation.
Naah, it’s easier to take an existent black looter and paint every black with the same brush.
But tell us, what is the truth of the situation?
Who the hell thinks all black people are like the scum bag looters?
In case you didn’t notice there were white looters too.
You seem to see many issues as a matter of race. It is too bad.[/quote]
Have you been reading the responses in this thread? I mean, besides Vroom’s?
"On another note, for those that don’t think history is important, with respect to the situation in America today between blacks and whites, what the fuck are we talking about Africa for? "
It was a response to an innacurate post.
Because that’s where the slaves came from is the obvious answer. White guys didn’t invade and capture them…they bought them. So did Arabs in numbers twice as great
To ignore historical facts because they don’t agree with your opinion is naive and ignorant and makes people sound like a liberal.
If your going to assign blame you should start at the beginning.
vroom, are you dense or do you just like to blather?
The key word is all. Of course all black people weren’t looters. Some were, most weren’t. Some white people were looters too, most weren’t.
In a city that is over 70% black most of the poor people will be black. Most of the looters will be black. Most of the almost anything will be black.
Too many people are hung up on skin color. The message in the original article that started this thread was that the community in NO had problems before the hurricane and those problems compounded the crisis. The author made an error in using the word black.
As soon as someone throws the word black out there, everyone gets painted with a broad brush. Black is too loaded a term to use if you want to get taken seriously.
It is a shame because most real discussions of the issues end up discarded and the usual race war rhetoric takes over.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:
Wreckless wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:
RJ is right, the article was touchy feely bullshit.
It is easy to invent a nonexistent guy eating a chimichanga and put phony words in his mouth.
Much easier to blame others for not caring enough than it is to face the truth of the situation.
Naah, it’s easier to take an existent black looter and paint every black with the same brush.
But tell us, what is the truth of the situation?
Who the hell thinks all black people are like the scum bag looters?
In case you didn’t notice there were white looters too.
You seem to see many issues as a matter of race. It is too bad.
Have you been reading the responses in this thread? I mean, besides Vroom’s?[/quote]
Yup. If someone thinks all black people are looter please point it out.
They deserve my wrath for making stupid statements.
Most looters were black, but that doesn’t make most blacks looters.
It is a simple matter of most people in NO were black.
Zap, if you can’t see the racisim on these forums anytime something like this comes up, then I don’t know what you are reading. There are many here (I DON’T MEAN YOU) who have “nigger” right on the tip of their tounges…but if they say it here, everyone will lose respect for them, yell at the ect…but, I’d love to have acess to their private convos at home.
I try to tune out the blatant racism. I have seen it in other threads and it has disgusted me. I honestly did not see much of any of it in this thread.
I see the accusation more than I see the crime.
This thread started out with some fool saying he refused to read the article because it was racist. How the fuck would he know if he didn’t read it?
This kind of thinking just kills me.
[quote]Zap Branigan wrote:
I try to tune out the blatant racism. I have seen it in other threads and it has disgusted me. I honestly did not see much of any of it in this thread.
I see the accusation more than I see the crime.
This thread started out with some fool saying he refused to read the article because it was racist. How the fuck would he know if he didn’t read it?
This kind of thinking just kills me.
[/quote]
What’s killing me is how blind you choose to be. Perhaps you should spend less time harping on Vroom’s every word and more time actually looking back through this thread and not “tuning out” what many are noticing.
[quote]Because that’s where the slaves came from is the obvious answer. White guys didn’t invade and capture them…they bought them. So did Arabs in numbers twice as great
To ignore historical facts because they don’t agree with your opinion is naive and ignorant and makes people sound like a liberal.
If your going to assign blame you should start at the beginning.[/quote]
Hedo, I’m not suggesting the historical facts need to be ignored. However, the fact that blame can be spread in multiple areas doesn’t mean that it doesn’t also belong here at home.
There is nothing that says that because others are also responsible for it that everybody is then excused.
That part of history can be effectively ignored because it is no longer relevant to the issues at hand. It can be discussed and acknowledged, but it really has no impact on the discussion at hand.
Trying to deflect blame elsewhere when it is clearly here as well will make you look like a republican.
[quote] vroom, are you dense or do you just like to blather?
The key word is all. Of course all black people weren’t looters. Some were, most weren’t. Some white people were looters too, most weren’t.[/quote]
Speaking of being dense…
Did you perhaps notice that more than one article has been referred to?
Did you perhaps notice that the discussion has been around the meaning of that other article and various peoples interpretations of it?
At least try to follow along.
Your silly little one line both sides of the fence comments are neither here nor there.
Perhaps it is you that just likes to blather?
wow! what a thread.
i especially like what gregus said and found the responses by professor x and al durr very interesting. i was born here in the states, but my family is of Cuban heritage. though i could “pass” for white, many do not realize that Cubans are among the most ethnically diverse people in the world. we are a mixture of European, central American, and African genes. my grandfather had blond hair and blue eyes, and i have cousins as dark as Wesley snipes LOL.
i married an black woman and together we are raises two beautiful multiracial daughters. i grew up in poverty, was the first child on either side of my family ever to obtain a high school diploma, and the only one ever to attend and achieve a four year college degree to date. now i fall into the “rich conservative republican” stereotype, as i earn a good income and have become more conservative in my later years (nearly 40). so i think i have earned the right to speak on some of this.
no, gregus cannot compare what he and his family have gone through to what blacks in this country have gone through. knowing my heritage and personal history, and my outward appearance, i can tell you racism is alive and well in this country. how many times can you imagine i have been among white co workers or white company in general and they did not know me or my family history or who my wife was, and heard vile racist comments and attitudes? it is so bad that often to prevent tension later i would usually find ways to introduce myself as a Cuban American with a black wife as soon as possible, so white people would know to watch what they say around me. i have lost a job because of a supervisors racist attitudes.
but here is the shocker, that shit goes BOTH ways friends . i have experienced racism form the black community more so than the white community. whites are more subtle, blacks are more fearless and bold about it.
and what disturbs me to no end is how many blacks in this country refuse to acknowledge that other peoples and races have had to overcome hardships and suffering just as much and probably much more than they have. i fucking DARE any black person born after 1970 to compare what “hardships” they have had to go through compared to what my family had to overcome in Castro’s Cuba.
i have MUCH more to say, but i am sure i have stirred the pot enough already to generate some interesting responses, so i will save the rest for further debate.
michael
I think that black people in general, especially the men are much more obsessed with race then anyone else. It’s a conflict that’s within them and it’s hard to make it stop. I don’t care for the reasons why, or who’s fault it is. But that has been my experience. Most black men are insecure being black and it’s a mental hurdle that can only hold a person back.
[quote]vroom wrote:
Because that’s where the slaves came from is the obvious answer. White guys didn’t invade and capture them…they bought them. So did Arabs in numbers twice as great
To ignore historical facts because they don’t agree with your opinion is naive and ignorant and makes people sound like a liberal.
If your going to assign blame you should start at the beginning.
Hedo, I’m not suggesting the historical facts need to be ignored. However, the fact that blame can be spread in multiple areas doesn’t mean that it doesn’t also belong here at home.
There is nothing that says that because others are also responsible for it that everybody is then excused.
That part of history can be effectively ignored because it is no longer relevant to the issues at hand. It can be discussed and acknowledged, but it really has no impact on the discussion at hand.
Trying to deflect blame elsewhere when it is clearly here as well will make you look like a republican.[/quote]
Oh come on. People talk about racism routinely and bring up issues from the civil war.
If your going to pay attention to history then it’s all relevant.
[quote]Gregus wrote:
I think that black people in general, especially the men are much more obsessed with race then anyone else. It’s a conflict that’s within them and it’s hard to make it stop. I don’t care for the reasons why, or who’s fault it is. But that has been my experience. Most black men are insecure being black and it’s a mental hurdle that can only hold a person back. [/quote]
Black men often express this more because, in general, we have to deal with more outward racism. I just experienced something recently that I don’t want to go into right now. While racism may be more subtle with black women or other ethnic groups, it isn’t rare for many black men to feel it directly. It is a hurdle, but not because it is something we just can’t move past. It is a hurdle because it is thrown in our faces randomly out of the blue. I can honestly say that things are getting amazingly better in this country as far as that is concerned. It is nothing like what my parents had to deal with and a world away from what my grandmother had to endure. Every once in a while, however, just when it is no longer on your mind and your day is going great…it pops right back up letting you know that your color (along with age and other stereotypes) are major factors to some people.
There are problems on all sides and all of us play a role in it one way or another. The only thing that truly pisses me off, is the fact that some people pretend as if racism is such a non-factor that it shouldn’t be discussed any longer and everyone should just get over it. Pushing it beneath the surface doesn’t kill it. On that note, it also doesn’t keep me from trying to reach my goals. I was raised with the knowledge that it is out there, but that I should achieve in spite of it. Everyone wasn’t raised that way.